Next Up - The iPhone in China

At 14 Nov 2007 20:37:21 -0700 Snit wrote:

> 3G was left out, likely, for battery issues.

"Steve Said It, I Believe It, and That Settles It!"

While that's certainly the company line, and may well be true, (3G isn't
THAT power hungry- but certainly could've tipped the scales in the wrong
direction enough if Apple had certain battery life goals in mind, I
suppose) the industry trades suggested that a potential chip shortage
might have been the culprit, since Apple certaintly didn't want to run
out of a phone they expected to sell a few million of, due to lack of
components.

---

› See More: Next Up - The iPhone in China

"Todd Allcock" <[email protected]> stated in post
xe9%[email protected] on 11/15/07 9:39 PM:

> At 14 Nov 2007 20:37:21 -0700 Snit wrote:
>
>> 3G was left out, likely, for battery issues.
>
> "Steve Said It, I Believe It, and That Settles It!"

I know you think you are being funny... but you are not really succeeding.
I appreciate the attempt though.

> While that's certainly the company line, and may well be true, (3G isn't
> THAT power hungry- but certainly could've tipped the scales in the wrong
> direction enough if Apple had certain battery life goals in mind, I
> suppose) the industry trades suggested that a potential chip shortage
> might have been the culprit, since Apple certaintly didn't want to run
> out of a phone they expected to sell a few million of, due to lack of
> components.

Um, OK.



--
Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and
conscientious stupidity. -- Martin Luther King, Jr.

At 15 Nov 2007 22:09:41 -0600 CozmicDebris wrote:

> Name one mainly mac city. That would mean that over half of the
> machines are macs, just to be clear.

Perhaps Cupertino, but that's probably about it... ;-)


P.S.- nice move with the follow-up! I've been trying to do the same!

On Thu, 15 Nov 2007, Oxford wrote:
> you
> can't break into macs / osx.

That must be why people who owned a Mac had to keep it behind an external
firewall for 10 long months between the Month Of Apple Bugs and the
release of 10.4.11.

I particularly liked the certificate validation and IPV6 holes.

-- Mark --

http://panda.com/mrc
Democracy is two wolves and a sheep deciding what to eat for lunch.
Liberty is a well-armed sheep contesting the vote.

"Mr. Strat" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:151120072201467389%[email protected]...
> In article <[email protected]>,
> Mark Crispin <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> That must be why people who owned a Mac had to keep it behind an external
>> firewall for 10 long months between the Month Of Apple Bugs and the
>> release of 10.4.11.
>
> That month of alleged bugs was pure bull****. Name one OS X virus or
> spyware in the wild.


http://www.sophos.com/pressoffice/ne...acosxleap.html

At 15 Nov 2007 22:00:35 -0700 Snit wrote:

> > "Steve Said It, I Believe It, and That Settles It!"
>
> I know you think you are being funny... but you are not really
> succeeding.
> I appreciate the attempt though.

Like the stand-ups say, "it's funny 'coz it's true."

The multiple-personality disordered fantroll Oxford/none/Gene Jones/Mark
Thompsen's intrusion into the alt.cellular groups motivated me into
eavesdropping on CSMA recently, which leads me to ask, my God, is there
not a skeptical bone in some of you guys? It's (with a few rational
exceptions) a clear divison between rabid fanatics and the bashers just
trying to get under their skin, both sides spouting arguments that make
almost as much sense as Spinal Tap's explanation of why amplifiers that
"go to eleven"" are "one louder!" Are there no shades of gray in
Macworld? Say anything negative and it's heresy! Is there no middle
ground between fanatic and basher?

Now I know "Apple isn't like any other company" and they can do no wrong,
but whatever happened to healthy skepticism? CEOs and company spokesmen-
even your beloved Steve- are like politicians; they have to spin ANY
negative into a positive to try and keep shareholders, customers, and
journalists happy, and avoid giving the competition any ammunition. And
if you don't believe me, go watch the September keynote where they
introduced the new iPods and the iPhone price cut, and check out that bit
where SJ pretended to get excited about the fact that you could make an
iPhone ringtone out of a song you already bought for "just ANOTHER 99-
cents!" Bill Clinton himself couldn't have faked "genuine sincerity" any
better!

Hell, I know Jobs isn't happy about that situation- he doesn't need
Apple's few-cent cut of the "another 99-cents" that badly- it's just the
reality of the music business when selling DRM'd players forces you to
get in bed with that industry. But instead of saying "sorry, but
contracts are contracts, and this is the only way we could get the music
companies to agree to let us put your content on the phone as a ringtone,
etc." he pretends that the "another 99-cents" is an "excellent value"
because "other carriers" charge "$2.49 or more" for ringtones,
(conveniently forgetting to add that those $2.49 ringtones are an OPTION
for people unable or unwilling to make their own, usually by just
plugging the phone into the computer and drag-n-dropping any song they've
ripped from their CD collection for $0.00. A feature that many $40
phones have, but one particular $400 one doesn't.)

Do I thing Jobs was wrong for trying to "sell" the ringtone feature as an
"excellent value?" Of course not, that's his JOB! But does that mean
you have to believe him? Heck, no.


So, yes, 3G sucks a little more power than EDGE, but certainly far less
than WiFi, and it doesn't seem to stop other 3G-equipped smartphones from
having ferocious battery life. So do I believe that "drains batteries"
is the reason it was omitted? Sure- about as much as I believe that
extra 99-cents for ringtones represents an "excellent value."

But in retrospect, who cares? The phone, even without 3G, is a rousing
success, and is a slick, easy to use, good-featured phone. Why not leave
it at that, instead of pretending it's few negatives are really positives-
that's the CEO's job!

"Todd Allcock" <[email protected]> stated in post
8Ub%[email protected] on 11/16/07 12:44 AM:

> At 15 Nov 2007 22:00:35 -0700 Snit wrote:
>
>>> "Steve Said It, I Believe It, and That Settles It!"
>>>
>> I know you think you are being funny... but you are not really succeeding. I
>> appreciate the attempt though.
>>
> Like the stand-ups say, "it's funny 'coz it's true."

A hint as to why your humor did not succeed. OK.
>
> The multiple-personality disordered fantroll Oxford/none/Gene Jones/Mark
> Thompsen's intrusion into the alt.cellular groups motivated me into
> eavesdropping on CSMA recently, which leads me to ask, my God, is there
> not a skeptical bone in some of you guys? It's (with a few rational
> exceptions) a clear divison between rabid fanatics and the bashers just
> trying to get under their skin, both sides spouting arguments that make
> almost as much sense as Spinal Tap's explanation of why amplifiers that
> "go to eleven"" are "one louder!" Are there no shades of gray in
> Macworld? Say anything negative and it's heresy! Is there no middle
> ground between fanatic and basher?

I live in that middle ground - I use and teach both OS X and Windows. I
tend to prefer OS X for many things but certainly not all. Heck, the videos
I make for my classes I do on Windows for two reasons: one, Camtasia is a
Windows only product and there is nothing like it for the Mac and, less
important for the comparison purposes, it is easier to do a full-screen
1024x768 movie in a virtualized OS in a window.

> Now I know "Apple isn't like any other company" and they can do no wrong,

I disagree. Strongly. Now I will say Apple has, in general, been very good
to me. I recently purchases a new aluminum and black iMac. It turned out
that it had a hardware issue - but I called then a day past the date that
they state I should to have my machine be deemed DOA. They deemed it as
such anyway. They then agreed to rush shipment for the machine even beyond
their normal DOA procedures based on my need for a computer... and refunded
me $100 for my troubles. They then let me get the up-to-date pricing for
the Leopard update... saving me about another $100.

I am not happy they shipped a bad product but I think they handled the
situation very well, going above and beyond what they *had* to do (the
minimum required by their contract and by law).

> but whatever happened to healthy skepticism?

I am all for it.

> CEOs and company spokesmen- even your beloved Steve- are like politicians;

"beloved Steve"? I admire some things about the man but certainly do not
see him as "beloved". Personally I see your reference to him as that as a
bit odd.

> they have to spin ANY negative into a positive to try and keep shareholders,
> customers, and journalists happy, and avoid giving the competition any
> ammunition. And if you don't believe me

Don't believe you? What? Of course Jobs puts a pro-Apple spin on things.

> , go watch the September keynote where they introduced the new iPods and the
> iPhone price cut, and check out that bit where SJ pretended to get excited
> about the fact that you could make an iPhone ringtone out of a song you
> already bought for "just ANOTHER 99- cents!" Bill Clinton himself couldn't
> have faked "genuine sincerity" any better!

Personally I would like to see *any* sound be usable as a ring tone. No
charge... but I suspect Apple's hands are, to some extent, tied by their
contracts.

> Hell, I know Jobs isn't happy about that situation- he doesn't need
> Apple's few-cent cut of the "another 99-cents" that badly- it's just the
> reality of the music business when selling DRM'd players forces you to
> get in bed with that industry. But instead of saying "sorry, but
> contracts are contracts, and this is the only way we could get the music
> companies to agree to let us put your content on the phone as a ringtone,
> etc." he pretends that the "another 99-cents" is an "excellent value"
> because "other carriers" charge "$2.49 or more" for ringtones,
> (conveniently forgetting to add that those $2.49 ringtones are an OPTION
> for people unable or unwilling to make their own, usually by just
> plugging the phone into the computer and drag-n-dropping any song they've
> ripped from their CD collection for $0.00. A feature that many $40
> phones have, but one particular $400 one doesn't.)

Um, OK.

> Do I thing Jobs was wrong for trying to "sell" the ringtone feature as an
> "excellent value?" Of course not, that's his JOB! But does that mean
> you have to believe him? Heck, no.

You are going on a bit of a rant... who said they believed him?

> So, yes, 3G sucks a little more power than EDGE, but certainly far less
> than WiFi, and it doesn't seem to stop other 3G-equipped smartphones from
> having ferocious battery life. So do I believe that "drains batteries"
> is the reason it was omitted? Sure- about as much as I believe that
> extra 99-cents for ringtones represents an "excellent value."

Is your rather odd rant based on my saying:

3G was left out, likely, for battery issues. Not sure about the
other two.

And then, when you offered other ideas, my response of:

Um, OK.

I do not use a cell phone and frankly do not really care why 3G was left
out, other than idle curiosity because it seems like Apple "should" have
used it if they could have from what I know of the cell phone industry. If
it was not battery life issues but instead was contract or chip availability
issues it makes no real difference to me.

> But in retrospect, who cares?

Not I... but your rant shows you do.

> The phone, even without 3G, is a rousing success, and is a slick, easy to use,
> good-featured phone. Why not leave it at that

I did... but clearly you could not.

> , instead of pretending it's few negatives are really positives- that's the
> CEO's job!

Not sure why you even wrote that.



--
When I'm working on a problem, I never think about beauty. I think only how
to solve the problem. But when I have finished, if the solution is not
beautiful, I know it is wrong. -- R. Buckminster Fuller

In article
<[email protected]>,
Oxford <[email protected]> wrote:

> mainly mac cities have open wireless pretty much everywhere since you
> can't break into macs / osx.
>

So far as I know, there aren't any "mainly mac cities." And I live not
far from Cupertino.

Nor have I ever observed "open wireless pretty much everywhere." Could
you give an example of such a place?

--
http://www.daviddfriedman.com/ http://daviddfriedman.blogspot.com/
Author of _Harald_, a fantasy without magic.
Published by Baen, in bookstores now

Oxford wrote:
> Mark Crispin <[email protected]> wrote:
>> There's certainly lots of Wi-Fi in Seattle, but these days most networks
>> are locked down by a combination of MAC address filtering, WPA (nobody
>> uses WEP any more) and SSID broadcast disable.
>
> but that's mainly a result that windows machines / the OS is so poorly
> designed

So basically you are saying that if I had a Mac, I wouldn't need
wireless encryption for my ASCII text files (that are not OS specific, BTW).

In article <ZEa%[email protected]>, Kevin
Weaver <[email protected]> wrote:

> > That month of alleged bugs was pure bull****. Name one OS X virus or
> > spyware in the wild.
>
>
> http://www.sophos.com/pressoffice/ne...acosxleap.html

Viruses created in the laboratory or on paper by companies selling
anti-virus software doesn't count. *IN THE WILD*

Oh, and that article is over a year old. Nice try, but no cigar.

"Mr. Strat" <[email protected]> wrote in
news:151120072201467389%[email protected]:

> In article <alpine.OSX.0.99999.0711152135150.3800
@pangtzu.panda.com>,
> Mark Crispin <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> That must be why people who owned a Mac had to keep it behind
an
>> external firewall for 10 long months between the Month Of
Apple Bugs
>> and the release of 10.4.11.
>
> That month of alleged bugs was pure bull****. Name one OS X
virus or
> spyware in the wild.
>

http://tinyurl.com/2oyfql
http://tinyurl.com/2lv5vv
http://tinyurl.com/2qtd2h
http://tinyurl.com/39ja6a
http://tinyurl.com/3xkty4
http://tinyurl.com/2qponl

You are not immune, just below the Micro$not hatred radar, at the
moment.

The crackers make virii for WIDELY USED operating systems, not
little niche OSes that won't make the headlines.


Larry
--
Xterm IS the ultimate video game...(c;

Todd Allcock <[email protected]> wrote in news:8Ub%
[email protected]:

> So, yes, 3G sucks a little more power than EDGE, but certainly
far less
> than WiFi, and it doesn't seem to stop other 3G-equipped
smartphones from
> having ferocious battery life. So do I believe that "drains
batteries"
> is the reason it was omitted? Sure- about as much as I believe
that
> extra 99-cents for ringtones represents an "excellent value."
>
>

I think 3G would reduce battery life NOT because it sucks more
power than EDGE from the battery, but because it results in
significantly more PROCESSING because significantly more DATA is
available, resulting in significantly more throughput for
anything that sucks on the web's tittie.

When a computer sits at idle doing nothing while EDGE, or some
other dialup modem plods along like a snail, the number of memory
reads/writes/, CPU processing is less...resulting in less chip
current, as the fast CPU yawns and sleeps waiting for SOMTHING
from the comm chips....zzzZZZ.



Larry
--
Xterm IS the ultimate video game...(c;

"Oxford" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> seattle is the detroit of computer tech, crime ridden, and full of
> people that can only build shoddy products. (Vista, Office, Exchange,
> Xbox, Zune, etc, etc)
>
> no wonder Mark doesn't understand wireless, or where the industry is
> heading. he lives in the "detroit" of computing.
>
> -

And the IDIOT Oxford digs his stupid hole deeper and deeper.

THE most moronic statement yet...

"Oxford" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> grow up LHA, qwest supports my views, not yours. deal with it.
>

Uhhhhhhh, not they don't, (Qwest).

Ness Net <[email protected]> wrote:

> "Oxford" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> >
> > seattle is the detroit of computer tech, crime ridden, and full of
> > people that can only build shoddy products. (Vista, Office, Exchange,
> > Xbox, Zune, etc, etc)
> >
> > no wonder Mark doesn't understand wireless, or where the industry is
> > heading. he lives in the "detroit" of computing.
> >
> > -
>
> And the IDIOT Oxford digs his stupid hole deeper and deeper.
>
> THE most moronic statement yet...

He's just yanking your chain, to coin a phrase...

--

Immunity is better than innoculation.

Peter