Verizon takes a larger share of the wireless market

At 03 Sep 2008 21:05:37 -0700 SMS wrote:
> The system warns me when I'm down to 5 or 10 minutes that I may
> need a recharge and will autosell me another 100 minutes by pressing
> one of the keys. Works
> great....until Verizon takes over, I'm assuming.
>
> That's such a hassle. No wonder so few Alltel subscribers sign up for
> ther regional plans.


Oh p
ease- it's completely automated and reasonably priced. If my carrier
offered that option I'd switch in a heartbeat. I'd take me a year to use
1000 minutes ($10 worth) out of market, and I'l wager Larry saves at least
$10/month on his regional plan. That $100+/year savings.>

---

› See More: Verizon takes a larger share of the wireless market

At 03 Sep 2008 11:37:41 -0700 SMS wrote:

> > The grandfathering will likely placate them for awhile, unless/until
> > Verizon pulls an "AT&T" and forces them out of those grandfathered plans
> > the next time they upgrade their handsets, like the "new AT&T" did to
"old"
> > AT&T blue customers...
>
> Historically Verizon has not forced existing customers to adopt current
> calling plans when upgrading handsets and going back under contract.

True, but those are grandfathered Verizon plans. I'm not sure how many
wing ut Alltel plans Verizon is going to want to support in their billing
systems.

> I keep worrying that they will do this, but so far they haven't.

To be fair, the same could be said of Cingular- it was primarily the
acquired ATTWS customers they shafted.

> They've gone to great trouble to even keep the greater coverage
> of the older Americas Choice Plan available (plus they don't ever
> seem to charge for the off-network AMPS roaming that shows on
> the handset as roaming that I should be charged for). They're under
> no obligation to keep offering service at prices from the older plans,
> but they do so anyway.


True, but the same can be said of most if not all carriers. Last time I
spoke to him (three months ago or so) my cousin was still on an old ATTWS
GSM "charter plan" that offered unlimited voice calling for $99. (The
recent ccrop of unlimited plans has made this less impressive, but he's had
it for six years or so!)

> Part of the way Cingular forced AT&T Wireless customers to switch
> to higher cost plans was due to the change from TDMA to GSM. All
> those super-cheap TDMA plans went away with the technology
> change.

It wasn't just the TDMA customers- Cingular refused to transfer
grandfathered ATTWS GSM plans to Cingular/"new AT&T" SIMs and phones,
forcing them to take new Cingular plans. My forementioned cousin has had
to use unlocked phones to keep his plan since Cingular/new AT&T phones
won't accept his "blue" SIM. He also can't add current data or text
packages to his charter plan. (For that reason he was considering
switching to either a new unlimited AT&T or Verizon plan now that they've
"caught up" to his charter plan's value, last I heard.)

On 2008-09-04, Todd Allcock <[email protected]> wrote:
> At 03 Sep 2008 11:37:41 -0700 SMS wrote:
>
>> > The grandfathering will likely placate them for awhile, unless/until
>> > Verizon pulls an "AT&T" and forces them out of those grandfathered plans
>> > the next time they upgrade their handsets, like the "new AT&T" did to
> "old"
>> > AT&T blue customers...
>>
>> Historically Verizon has not forced existing customers to adopt current
>> calling plans when upgrading handsets and going back under contract.
>
> True, but those are grandfathered Verizon plans. I'm not sure how many
> wing ut Alltel plans Verizon is going to want to support in their billing
> systems.

Should get an example of what they'll be doing early on, though.
Verizon's acquisition of RCC was approved by the FCC on August 1
(that's one year after the acquisition was announced), so they'll
probably do whatever they are going to do to Unicel's oddball plans
before they get around to Alltel.

It seems plausible that the accumulated variety of all their acquisitions'
plans might cause some heartburn to their billing system, though I'm
not sure they have any choice other than entering them for existing
customers even if they stop selling those plans.

Dennis Ferguson

SMS <[email protected]> wrote in news:w8Jvk.18936$LG4.4088
@nlpi065.nbdc.sbc.com:

> It was Alltel charging you the 89˝ per minute, not Verizon. Alltel paid
> Verizon very little for the roaming, and it could have been nothing at
> all depending on what reciprocal agreements were in place.
>
>

Nope. I was a VERIZON customer. Doesn't wash.

Todd Allcock <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:

> At 03 Sep 2008 21:05:37 -0700 SMS wrote:
>> The system warns me when I'm down to 5 or 10 minutes that I may
>> need a recharge and will autosell me another 100 minutes by pressing
>> one of the keys. Works
>> great....until Verizon takes over, I'm assuming.
>>
>> That's such a hassle. No wonder so few Alltel subscribers sign up for
>> ther regional plans.
>
>
> Oh p
> ease- it's completely automated and reasonably priced. If my carrier
> offered that option I'd switch in a heartbeat. I'd take me a year to
> use 1000 minutes ($10 worth) out of market, and I'l wager Larry saves
> at least $10/month on his regional plan. That $100+/year savings.>
>
>
>

Alltel's 2-state NC/SC plus a large area of the states that surround the
2 states from New Port News, VA to south of Brunswick, GA and up into
about Knoxville, TN is $39.95 for 700 mins, plus 100 bonus minutes for
being a great customer. The plan has all the bells/whistles, free LD,
free M2M, 5 My Circle was a bonus a couple years back for free,
voicemail, etc....$40!

Add $25 for truly unlimited EVDO broadband for my Nokia N800 Bluetooth
tethered to the Motorola ROKR Z6m that's NOT all hobbled up so you can't
use its music and camera functions straight off the microSD card and
it's a helluva deal compared to the forced nationwide nonsense and
hobbling on Verizon. COPY, MOVE, make your own ringtones (an MP3 from
usenet of the Star Trek bosun's whistle intercom), takes jpgs straight
to the memory card, plays usenet's MP3s straight off the card, no funny
business.

We're sure gonna get screwed with Verizon, who I'm sure is going to
force their ****ty hobbled firmware on us as soon as they think they can
get away with it. After all, we can't have the NEW VZW Alltel customers
with much better phones than our loyal customers, can we? They might
compare notes and the old guys DEMAND what the new guys are still
enjoying! THAT would be very dangerous, indeed!

Bend over, boys....Verizon's comin'!

At 04 Sep 2008 14:23:07 +0000 Larry wrote:

> Alltel's 2-state NC/SC plus a large area of the states that surround the
> 2 states from New Port News, VA to south of Brunswick, GA and up into
> about Knoxville, TN is $39.95 for 700 mins, plus 100 bonus minutes for
> being a great customer. The plan has all the bells/whistles, free LD,
> free M2M, 5 My Circle was a bonus a couple years back for free,
> voicemail, etc....$40!


Nice- I iss my old T-Mo regional plan: 3000 minutesand 50 text messages for
$50. Back then (2001-2003) I didn't have GPRS, but could tether via dialup
out of my voice minutes. The T-Mo plan didn't have LD though, so I ditched
it eventually.

> make your own ringtones (an MP3 from
> usenet of the Star Trek bosun's whistle intercom)...

I take full credit for that idea! When I hear that whistle, I know
it's my phone ringing and no one elses!


> We're sure gonna get screwed with Verizon, who I'm sure is going to
> force their ****ty hobbled firmware on us as soon as they think they can
> get away with it.


I doubt it- they'll be content to wait until you all upgrade to ther
crippled handsets- no point rocking the boat too early. Verizon is patient-
they have the rest of your life you screw you! ;-)

Dennis Ferguson wrote:
> On 2008-09-04, Todd Allcock <[email protected]> wrote:
>> At 03 Sep 2008 11:37:41 -0700 SMS wrote:
>>
>>>> The grandfathering will likely placate them for awhile, unless/until
>>>> Verizon pulls an "AT&T" and forces them out of those grandfathered plans
>>>> the next time they upgrade their handsets, like the "new AT&T" did to
>> "old"
>>>> AT&T blue customers...
>>> Historically Verizon has not forced existing customers to adopt current
>>> calling plans when upgrading handsets and going back under contract.
>> True, but those are grandfathered Verizon plans. I'm not sure how many
>> wing ut Alltel plans Verizon is going to want to support in their billing
>> systems.
>
> Should get an example of what they'll be doing early on, though.
> Verizon's acquisition of RCC was approved by the FCC on August 1
> (that's one year after the acquisition was announced), so they'll
> probably do whatever they are going to do to Unicel's oddball plans
> before they get around to Alltel.
>
> It seems plausible that the accumulated variety of all their acquisitions'
> plans might cause some heartburn to their billing system, though I'm
> not sure they have any choice other than entering them for existing
> customers even if they stop selling those plans.

Trying to keep track of which calls are roaming if they were still on
Alltel regional plans would be a real pain in the butt. They may just
let those customers keep the plan but no longer charge for roaming out
of the region. Since so few Alltel customers choose the regional plans
it wouldn't be a huge hit on revenue.

Todd Allcock <[email protected]> wrote in news:g9ovkb$vr2$2
@aioe.org:

> I take full credit for that idea! When I hear that whistle, I know
> it's my phone ringing and no one elses!
>
>

A whole restaurant will look my way when that thing goes off on a Z6m ROKR.
It's really LOUD! I have no trouble hearing it at 70 mph on the interstate
on the motorcycle even without wearing the S9.

SMS <[email protected]> wrote in news:WDTvk.8520$np7.3555
@flpi149.ffdc.sbc.com:

> Since so few Alltel customers choose the regional plans
> it wouldn't be a huge hit on revenue.
>
>

One more time.....where is this info coming from? Got a reference or is
this just your opinion??

Larry wrote:
> SMS <[email protected]> wrote in news:WDTvk.8520$np7.3555
> @flpi149.ffdc.sbc.com:
>
>> Since so few Alltel customers choose the regional plans
>> it wouldn't be a huge hit on revenue.
>>
>>
>
> One more time.....where is this info coming from? Got a reference or is
> this just your opinion??
>

I remember reading this back around 2003 or 2004 in one of the trade
publications. I think it was RCR Wireless ("http://www.rcrwireless.com").

This was 2-3 years after when Alltel came out with their "Always Up2Date
Guarantee," which would recommend the most cost effective rate plan to
customers, as a way of reducing churn (which was a huge problem for
Alltel when they didn't have a national plan that included roaming).

They had initially planned this guarantee to cover only their new Total
Freedom National plan, but then they expanded it to cover their regional
plans because they saw that a high percentage of their regional
customers were paying more in roaming charges than the cost difference
between the regional rate plan and the national rate plan for comparable
amounts of minutes. Very few new customers sign up for regional plans
according to Alltel, and over time the customers that did opt for
regional plans have been migrating to national plans.

As an aside, Cellular One in the SF Bay Area was running into a similar
problem. There were customers going to Sacramento to buy phones and
service on AT&T Wireless because Cellular One and GTE Mobilnet didn't
offer any national plans at the time. AT&T didn't like people doing this
because the subscribers were doing mostly off-network roaming onto other
networks. The problem was solved when AT&T took over Cellular One's Bay
Area operations.

Todd Allcock wrote:
> At 04 Sep 2008 14:23:07 +0000 Larry wrote:
>
>> Alltel's 2-state NC/SC plus a large area of the states that surround the
>> 2 states from New Port News, VA to south of Brunswick, GA and up into
>> about Knoxville, TN is $39.95 for 700 mins, plus 100 bonus minutes for
>> being a great customer. The plan has all the bells/whistles, free LD,
>> free M2M, 5 My Circle was a bonus a couple years back for free,
>> voicemail, etc....$40!
>
>
> Nice- I iss my old T-Mo regional plan: 3000 minutesand 50 text messages for
> $50. Back then (2001-2003) I didn't have GPRS, but could tether via dialup
> out of my voice minutes. The T-Mo plan didn't have LD though, so I ditched
> it eventually.

I had one of those plans for two days. A buddy and I both decided it
would be a way to make inexpensive calls in addition to our VZW phones.
This was pre "in" network. I found that tmobile had such poor coverage
that the phone was useless so I returned it the next day. tmobile tried
to ding me fifty bucks for less than 10 minutes of use and I remember
making a bunch of calls to make them go away.


>
>> make your own ringtones (an MP3 from
>> usenet of the Star Trek bosun's whistle intercom)...
>
> I take full credit for that idea! When I hear that whistle, I know
> it's my phone ringing and no one elses!
>
>
>> We're sure gonna get screwed with Verizon, who I'm sure is going to
>> force their ****ty hobbled firmware on us as soon as they think they can
>> get away with it.
>
>
> I doubt it- they'll be content to wait until you all upgrade to ther
> crippled handsets- no point rocking the boat too early. Verizon is patient-
> they have the rest of your life you screw you! ;-)
>
>

SMS wrote:
> Larry wrote:
>> SMS <[email protected]> wrote in news:WDTvk.8520$np7.3555
>> @flpi149.ffdc.sbc.com:
>>
>>> Since so few Alltel customers choose the regional plans it wouldn't
>>> be a huge hit on revenue.
>>>
>>>
>>
>> One more time.....where is this info coming from? Got a reference or
>> is this just your opinion??
>>
>
> I remember reading this back around 2003 or 2004 in one of the trade
> publications. I think it was RCR Wireless ("http://www.rcrwireless.com").
>
> This was 2-3 years after when Alltel came out with their "Always Up2Date
> Guarantee," which would recommend the most cost effective rate plan to
> customers, as a way of reducing churn (which was a huge problem for
> Alltel when they didn't have a national plan that included roaming).
>
> They had initially planned this guarantee to cover only their new Total
> Freedom National plan, but then they expanded it to cover their regional
> plans because they saw that a high percentage of their regional
> customers were paying more in roaming charges than the cost difference
> between the regional rate plan and the national rate plan for comparable
> amounts of minutes. Very few new customers sign up for regional plans
> according to Alltel, and over time the customers that did opt for
> regional plans have been migrating to national plans.
>
> As an aside, Cellular One in the SF Bay Area was running into a similar
> problem. There were customers going to Sacramento to buy phones and
> service on AT&T Wireless because Cellular One and GTE Mobilnet didn't
> offer any national plans at the time. AT&T didn't like people doing this
> because the subscribers were doing mostly off-network roaming onto other
> networks. The problem was solved when AT&T took over Cellular One's Bay
> Area operations.

BTW, if you have some citation that says that a lot of Alltel customers
actually do sign up for regional plans, please post that as well. I've
seen you claim that this is the case, but I've never seen anything from
you that backs it up.