Pagers may be better than cell phones

Stan wrote:
>
> "Robert M" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > In article <[email protected]>,
> > Lawrence Glasser <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> > > Mainly because cell phones have more dead spots than pagers!
> >
> That depends on the animal. 2-way pagers have plenty of dead spots,
> including inside buildings where my cell phone has no problem.
>
> One way pagers are useless, since they don't offer store-and-forward
> service. How do you know when you're out of area?

The pager displays "Storing Messages."

Larry

---

› See More: Pagers may be better than cell phones

You don't give up. My cell phone basic plan comes with .02/msg text
messaging. I can get, silently, a 150 character or so email forwarded from
my regular account to my phone. I can also get a "page" on my phone (if
somebody wants to go through the trouble to do it), and can get silent
caller ID anytime. This is more than I ever got with a pager. You will no
doubt find the vast majority of people have come to the same conclusion as
me---there is not enough of a reason to carry a pager anymore. This is why
they are becoming a niche market.
"Lawrence Glasser" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Prilosec wrote:
> >
> > <snip>
> >
> > Sorry, pagers are a dying technology. There is no advantage to them at
all
> > for me, and probably not for anyone else fairly soon.
>
> UNLESS, once again, you're in a venue where communication is a must, and
> talking on a cell phone is impossible.
>
> Larry

On Sat, 15 May 2004 16:36:23 -0500, Steven J Sobol <[email protected]>
wrote:

>In alt.cellular Please invert everything left of the @ to reply <[email protected]> wrote:
>> 1) One AA cell runs my 2-way text pager for weeks when used frequently. My
>> (three) cellphones (Nokia, Palm and Samsung) need to be restoked with a
>> charge daily, or even more often, if used frequently, even if just in text
>> modes.

>Let's be fair: that's because you only use a lot of juice when you're
>receiving or sending a page and that only takes seconds... a cell phone
>does a lot more stuff, especially when actually being used...

Yes, it does... all of which are irrelevant to the task at hand, getting a
message across, no matter what.

>> 3) Dead zones are more frequent for cellular than for pagers. When I do
>> calldowns for my (24-hour on call go-anywhere-in-seven-counties) team, I
>> always do pagers first because experience has shown that sending 'pages'
>> and SMS to cellphones results in a high failure rate. I also see this when
>> I travel in urban areas; concrete canyons block cellular signals much more
>> than paging signals.


>Hm. That doesn't make sense - it's all radio transmissions, whether to a pager
>or not.

True, but there's radio,and then there's radio.

> What frequency do pagers run on?

Various.

> Isn't it normally 900 MHz?

No.There is no 'normal', but most POCSAG pagers are VHF.

>That's pretty close to what a lot of the cellular carriers run... although a lot of
>them also run on the PCS frequencies.

Irrelevant.


>> 4) Paging infrastructure is more robust.
>
>This is true.
--
John Bartley K7AAY http://celdata.cjb.net
This post quad-ROT-13 encrypted; reading it violates the DMCA.
Nobody but a fool goes into a federal counterrorism operation without duct tape - Richard Preston, THE COBRA EVENT.

On Mon, 17 May 2004 05:25:45 GMT, O/Siris <0siris@sprîntpcs.com> wrote:

>In article <rmarkoff-415120.06232216052004
>@news06.east.earthlink.net>, [email protected] says...
>> It would be nice if ANY carrier had an honest coverage map that showed
>> them. They are all ignoring their own "Consumer Code".

>There's never going to be the kind of map you expect, Phil. That
>kind of detail is physically impossible to provide *or* guarantee.
>
>Too many variables able to induce drastic, and possibly short-lived,
>problems in very tiny areas.

Not until we have robots do it for us.

Hmm... R/C robot aircraft with control via 802.16 flies a grid following
GPS, with a package of PCS and cellular band receivers for all major
carriers in a market, for quick mapping of signal quality. Move receiver
package to a taxi for ground level detail once the aerial survey is done.

What could I charge for website access to a site which shows the true
reception, in order to recover costs of the above?
--
John Bartley K7AAY http://celdata.cjb.net
This post quad-ROT-13 encrypted; reading it violates the DMCA.
Nobody but a fool goes into a federal counterrorism operation without duct tape - Richard Preston, THE COBRA EVENT.

>In message <<[email protected]>> "Stan"
><[email protected]> did ramble:
>
>>The cell phone providers are more concerned about dead spots than paging
>>companies.

On Sun, 16 May 2004 06:25:15 GMT, DevilsPGD <[email protected]>
wrote:

>Which is weird since cell phones typically have voicemail, and will hold
>SMS and voicemail messages until the cellphone comes back,


That assumes total competence in the voice mail system and its notification
to the cellphone. Here in Portland, it can take *days* for ATTWS, SprintPCS
or T-Mobile to tlell you there's been a page, or a voicemail is waiting for
you, if you are blacked out when the first notice is sent.

> whereas with a pager, the page is completely lost if it occurs when the pager is out
>of range.

Old paging systems, yes. ReFlex, no; modern paging systems see you come on
the net and dump everything.
--
John Bartley K7AAY http://celdata.cjb.net
This post quad-ROT-13 encrypted; reading it violates the DMCA.
Nobody but a fool goes into a federal counterrorism operation without duct tape - Richard Preston, THE COBRA EVENT.

On Mon, 17 May 2004 11:46:27 -0400, Scott <[email protected]> wrote:

>Since you seem to be knowledagble in this are, "dumb question" if I may.
>On 9-11 I was just about on the GWB when the tragedy began. My cell phones
>(Verizon and AT&T at the time) were pretty useless pretty quickly but my
>Blackbery (957) from Earthlink (using Motient/Cingular) never stopped
>working and allowed me to stay in touch with family. I had a similiar
>experience last summer during the NYC blackouts.
>
>Though I was happy to stay in touch, I was surprised. Does the Blackberry
>work on differnt towers/transmitters than cellular?

Yes. Your Blackberry uses a 2-way paging system. Not all do; now RIM is
pushing Blackberries to GSM and iDEN providers, and reliability will
suffer.

>Also, I have
>considered switching from my 957 to a phone type Blackbery but based on
>the above experiences, I was concerned. Any thoughts?

Reliability will suffer, without (in my experience) a significant increase
in throughput for data.

--
John Bartley K7AAY http://celdata.cjb.net
This post quad-ROT-13 encrypted; reading it violates the DMCA.
Nobody but a fool goes into a federal counterrorism operation without duct tape - Richard Preston, THE COBRA EVENT.

On Sat, 15 May 2004 20:57:03 GMT, "pemalu" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>I already have a cell phone that can receive pages at no extra charge and I
>don't have to try to find a working pay phone to return a page. Why spend
>extra money for something that my phone can do already?

Lack of reliability and inferior coverage.
--
John Bartley K7AAY http://celdata.cjb.net
This post quad-ROT-13 encrypted; reading it violates the DMCA.
Nobody but a fool goes into a federal counterrorism operation without duct tape - Richard Preston, THE COBRA EVENT.

Prilosec wrote:
>
> You don't give up. My cell phone basic plan comes with .02/msg text
> messaging. I can get, silently, a 150 character or so email forwarded from
> my regular account to my phone. I can also get a "page" on my phone (if
> somebody wants to go through the trouble to do it), and can get silent
> caller ID anytime. This is more than I ever got with a pager. You will no
> doubt find the vast majority of people have come to the same conclusion as
> me---there is not enough of a reason to carry a pager anymore. This is why
> they are becoming a niche market.

I agree that it's a "niche market," but I happen to be in the niche.

The problem, once again, is that in order to respond to a call/page,
on a cell phone, you have to make a call... There are times that this
isn't the way to go. My (2-way) pager's got a complete alphanumeric
keyboard (ala Treo) and, from what I've found, better coverage, in
shielded areas, than any of the cell phone carriers provide.

For ME, it's the right way to go. For YOU, obviously not.

Larry

On Sun, 16 May 2004 23:43:15 GMT, Jud Hardcastle
<[email protected]> wrote:

>In article <[email protected]>, wctom1
>@pacbell.net says...
>> Cellphones are banned in many hospital areas, so pagers are de rigeur
>> for hospital workers.
>
>Another case like at the gas station and aboard airplanes--zero
>confirmed problems but we're going to CYA.....
<snip>

Actually, hospitals have logged interference with (800MHz band) cellular,
but none with PCS (1900MHz band ). Check fcc.gov for details.


--
John Bartley K7AAY http://celdata.cjb.net
This post quad-ROT-13 encrypted; reading it violates the DMCA.
Nobody but a fool goes into a federal counterrorism operation without duct tape - Richard Preston, THE COBRA EVENT.

[email protected] wrote:
> On Sat, 15 May 2004 20:57:03 GMT, "pemalu"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> I already have a cell phone that can receive pages at no extra
>> charge and I don't have to try to find a working pay phone to return
>> a page. Why spend extra money for something that my phone can do
>> already?
>
> Lack of reliability and inferior coverage.

True. When I had a pager, I would often find myself being asked why I didn't
return a page I never got.

Lawrence Glasser wrote:

<snip>

> The problem, once again, is that in order to respond to a call/page,
> on a cell phone, you have to make a call... There are times that this
> isn't the way to go. My (2-way) pager's got a complete alphanumeric
> keyboard (ala Treo) and, from what I've found, better coverage, in
> shielded areas, than any of the cell phone carriers provide.

<snip>

http://www.gsmarena.com/motorola_a630-659.php

There are also other similar phones either out there already, or
supposedly coming out this year.

You might even be able to write your own software for phones like this.
SSH from your phone?

As far as battery life is concerned, I've switched the battery of my
existing phone to one with 50% higher capacity, and the battery life has
been phenomenal so far. Doubly so if I only use text messages or email
between charges. I do not know how the a630 or the like will fare in
this department, though, but I would presume you can purchase after
market high capacity batteries for them.

In article <[email protected]>, [email protected]=20
says...
> In alt.cellular.sprintpcs O/Siris <0siris@spr?ntpcs.com> wrote:
> =20
> > So does SPCS.
>=20
> Would you happen to have the TAP number? VZW's is archived on Google some=
where
> in the VZW newsgroup. We should do the same with the Sprint number.

I'll look it up and post it. If you call into one of our business=20
sales offices, they also sell the TAP software, but it sounds like=20
you're already covered there. You don't *have* to use what we sell.

>=20
> On another note...
>=20
> Verizon Wireless has an amazingly useful service called Office Message
> Alert which allows an automated system like an office voicemail system to
> easily send a numeric page to a VZW phone. You dial the OMA toll-free num=
ber
> and then send the ten-digit area code plus phone number of the phone you
> are paging, followed immediately by a ten-digit numeric message (usually
> this would be something like the office's main phone number, so the perso=
n
> carrying the phone knows to call in). Then you just hang up, and the mess=
age
> is sent to the phone over the cellular network's paging channel.
>=20
> If SPCS had something like this it would be quite beneficial, especially =
to
> business customers. I have OMA on my phone as a no-extra-cost option. I h=
ave
> to be in digital coverage and on Verizon's network to guarantee I receive
> the message, but that's to be expected anyhow... Does Sprint have a simil=
ar
> service?
>=20

The Sprint Complete Sense offering for home phones has a "Notify Me"=20
option that sends a message to my phone stating that there's a voice=20
mail and who called if caller ID info was available. It's kind of an=20
automated version of what you describe above.

That's not exactly what you asked, but that's as close as I'm aware=20
of to what you request.


--=20
R=D8=DF
O/Siris
I work for Sprint PCS
I *don't* speak for them

In article <[email protected]>, [email protected]=20
says...
> The problem, once again, is that in order to respond to a call/page,
> on a cell phone, you have to make a call...
>=20

Not true anymore, with SMS.

--=20
R=D8=DF
O/Siris
I work for Sprint PCS
I *don't* speak for them

In article <[email protected]>,=20
[email protected] says...
> Not until we have robots do it for us.
>=20
> Hmm... R/C robot aircraft with control via 802.16 flies a grid following
> GPS, with a package of PCS and cellular band receivers for all major
> carriers in a market, for quick mapping of signal quality. Move receiver
> package to a taxi for ground level detail once the aerial survey is done.
>=20
> What could I charge for website access to a site which shows the true
> reception, in order to recover costs of the above?
>=20

There was actually a company that tried to setup a cellular system=20
using balloons and small transceiver stations. Keep the package=20
under something like 10 lbs, and make it cheap enough that=20
replacement costs fall below some threshold, and they said it was=20
doable.

Apparently, if the package was small enough, it avoided many FAA=20
requirements. And let the balloons fly well above flight altitudes.

I can't remember the name of the company. I'm not even sure if=20
they're still working on it.

--=20
R=D8=DF
O/Siris
I work for Sprint PCS
I *don't* speak for them

Kael Vaeltaja wrote:
>
> Lawrence Glasser wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
> > The problem, once again, is that in order to respond to a call/page,
> > on a cell phone, you have to make a call... There are times that this
> > isn't the way to go. My (2-way) pager's got a complete alphanumeric
> > keyboard (ala Treo) and, from what I've found, better coverage, in
> > shielded areas, than any of the cell phone carriers provide.
>
> <snip>
>
> http://www.gsmarena.com/motorola_a630-659.php

Cool!

One problem, however, still remains...

In my experience, for the areas that I need coverage in, pagers
still seem to be the answer. As John mentioned, pagers run on
a completely different frequency range than do cell phones.

Believe me, if I could carry one unit, that provided me with all
the features and coverage that I need, I'd do it in a heartbeat!

Larry