Bluetooth and CDMA don't work well together? Any truth?

Hi Everyone,

I have been hearing a lot of this lately and was wondering if there
was any truth to the statement. I know Verizon has claimed that
Bluetooth doesn't pass their quality standards, but I have always
dismissed this as Verizon's excuse to keep making "Teen Rave" phones.
But I notice with my Sony Ericsson T608 (800/1900 Mhz CDMA & 800Mhz
Analog) that my Bluetooth connections using Express Network are not very
fast. It seems to top out at 56-60 kps. I have also heard rumors that
Verizon intends to remove the bluetooth functionality in the Motorola
V710 before they release it. Could this be because CDMA and bluetooth
really don't play well together, at least as well as GSM does? What do
you all think?

- NM

---

› See More: Bluetooth and CDMA don't work well together? Any truth?

On Fri, 23 Apr 2004 12:01:06 -0400, NewsMonkey
<please_post_reply@to_the_group.net> wrote:

>But I notice with my Sony Ericsson T608 (800/1900 Mhz CDMA & 800Mhz
>Analog) that my Bluetooth connections using Express Network are not very
>fast. It seems to top out at 56-60 kps.

That's probably the rough average speed of 1XRTT data. The 144 kbps
figure is "bursting" speeds.

Mike

On Fri, 23 Apr 2004 12:01:06 -0400, NewsMonkey
<please_post_reply@to_the_group.net> wrote:

>But I notice with my Sony Ericsson T608 (800/1900 Mhz CDMA & 800Mhz
>Analog) that my Bluetooth connections using Express Network are not very
>fast. It seems to top out at 56-60 kps.

That's probably the rough average speed of 1XRTT data. The 144 kbps
figure is "bursting" speeds.

Mike

A bit OT, but:

There are many tech savvy people that think Bluetooth is
a dead or dying technology. Never gained 'critical mass' and
is in decline already. Maybe Verizon also subscribes to this
notion and that is why they don't and won't support Bluetooth.


"NewsMonkey" <please_post_reply@to_the_group.net> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
> Hi Everyone,
>
> I have been hearing a lot of this lately and was wondering if there
> was any truth to the statement. I know Verizon has claimed that
> Bluetooth doesn't pass their quality standards, but I have always
> dismissed this as Verizon's excuse to keep making "Teen Rave" phones.
> But I notice with my Sony Ericsson T608 (800/1900 Mhz CDMA & 800Mhz
> Analog) that my Bluetooth connections using Express Network are not very
> fast. It seems to top out at 56-60 kps. I have also heard rumors that
> Verizon intends to remove the bluetooth functionality in the Motorola
> V710 before they release it. Could this be because CDMA and bluetooth
> really don't play well together, at least as well as GSM does? What do
> you all think?
>
> - NM

A bit OT, but:

There are many tech savvy people that think Bluetooth is
a dead or dying technology. Never gained 'critical mass' and
is in decline already. Maybe Verizon also subscribes to this
notion and that is why they don't and won't support Bluetooth.


"NewsMonkey" <please_post_reply@to_the_group.net> wrote in message news:[email protected]...
> Hi Everyone,
>
> I have been hearing a lot of this lately and was wondering if there
> was any truth to the statement. I know Verizon has claimed that
> Bluetooth doesn't pass their quality standards, but I have always
> dismissed this as Verizon's excuse to keep making "Teen Rave" phones.
> But I notice with my Sony Ericsson T608 (800/1900 Mhz CDMA & 800Mhz
> Analog) that my Bluetooth connections using Express Network are not very
> fast. It seems to top out at 56-60 kps. I have also heard rumors that
> Verizon intends to remove the bluetooth functionality in the Motorola
> V710 before they release it. Could this be because CDMA and bluetooth
> really don't play well together, at least as well as GSM does? What do
> you all think?
>
> - NM

Richard Ness wrote:
> A bit OT, but:
>
> There are many tech savvy people that think Bluetooth is
> a dead or dying technology. Never gained 'critical mass' and
> is in decline already. Maybe Verizon also subscribes to this
> notion and that is why they don't and won't support Bluetooth.

Don't forget that VZW supports the phones. There is significant
overhead in doing this.

....they sold me a bluetooth phone. I can't get my laptop to talk
to it. I go to my VZW store and tell them "it doesn't work, fix
it"...

Then there is the related testing, etc. It's much more likely that
the demand relative to the cost doesn't justify it.

-Quick

Richard Ness wrote:
> A bit OT, but:
>
> There are many tech savvy people that think Bluetooth is
> a dead or dying technology. Never gained 'critical mass' and
> is in decline already. Maybe Verizon also subscribes to this
> notion and that is why they don't and won't support Bluetooth.

Don't forget that VZW supports the phones. There is significant
overhead in doing this.

....they sold me a bluetooth phone. I can't get my laptop to talk
to it. I go to my VZW store and tell them "it doesn't work, fix
it"...

Then there is the related testing, etc. It's much more likely that
the demand relative to the cost doesn't justify it.

-Quick

That's silly. I have one of those neat/nifty Jabra Freespeak's, and have to
tell you that little blue flashing light when it is on or being charged is
REALLY cool. If it wasn't for flashing Blue Lights, why would anyone shop at
Kmart?

I would think that it's pretty obvious that they have sold a bunch of units
to the old farts, and now they need some snazzy flashing lights, removable
faceplates, fancy rings, downloadable games etc to spark peoples interest in
spending more money with them, or at least appeal to the younger people who
can get their parents to pay for it..

If in actuality they wanted phones that work, why did they drop the power?
Older ones used to be 3 or at least .6 watts, instead of that wimpy .2 they
have now. Didn't they cut the power so more people could be on their system
at once? To suggest that they are doing an about face, and are trying to
provide service instead of flash, flies in the face of what they have been
doing for years.

<G>

"Richard Ness" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]
> A bit OT, but:
>
> There are many tech savvy people that think Bluetooth is
> a dead or dying technology. Never gained 'critical mass' and
> is in decline already. Maybe Verizon also subscribes to this
> notion and that is why they don't and won't support Bluetooth.
>
>
> "NewsMonkey" <please_post_reply@to_the_group.net> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> Hi Everyone,
>>
>> I have been hearing a lot of this lately and was wondering if there
>> was any truth to the statement. I know Verizon has claimed that
>> Bluetooth doesn't pass their quality standards, but I have always
>> dismissed this as Verizon's excuse to keep making "Teen Rave" phones.
>> But I notice with my Sony Ericsson T608 (800/1900 Mhz CDMA & 800Mhz
>> Analog) that my Bluetooth connections using Express Network are not
>> very fast. It seems to top out at 56-60 kps. I have also heard
>> rumors that Verizon intends to remove the bluetooth functionality in
>> the Motorola V710 before they release it. Could this be because CDMA
>> and bluetooth really don't play well together, at least as well as
>> GSM does? What do you all think?
>>
>> - NM

That's silly. I have one of those neat/nifty Jabra Freespeak's, and have to
tell you that little blue flashing light when it is on or being charged is
REALLY cool. If it wasn't for flashing Blue Lights, why would anyone shop at
Kmart?

I would think that it's pretty obvious that they have sold a bunch of units
to the old farts, and now they need some snazzy flashing lights, removable
faceplates, fancy rings, downloadable games etc to spark peoples interest in
spending more money with them, or at least appeal to the younger people who
can get their parents to pay for it..

If in actuality they wanted phones that work, why did they drop the power?
Older ones used to be 3 or at least .6 watts, instead of that wimpy .2 they
have now. Didn't they cut the power so more people could be on their system
at once? To suggest that they are doing an about face, and are trying to
provide service instead of flash, flies in the face of what they have been
doing for years.

<G>

"Richard Ness" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]
> A bit OT, but:
>
> There are many tech savvy people that think Bluetooth is
> a dead or dying technology. Never gained 'critical mass' and
> is in decline already. Maybe Verizon also subscribes to this
> notion and that is why they don't and won't support Bluetooth.
>
>
> "NewsMonkey" <please_post_reply@to_the_group.net> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> Hi Everyone,
>>
>> I have been hearing a lot of this lately and was wondering if there
>> was any truth to the statement. I know Verizon has claimed that
>> Bluetooth doesn't pass their quality standards, but I have always
>> dismissed this as Verizon's excuse to keep making "Teen Rave" phones.
>> But I notice with my Sony Ericsson T608 (800/1900 Mhz CDMA & 800Mhz
>> Analog) that my Bluetooth connections using Express Network are not
>> very fast. It seems to top out at 56-60 kps. I have also heard
>> rumors that Verizon intends to remove the bluetooth functionality in
>> the Motorola V710 before they release it. Could this be because CDMA
>> and bluetooth really don't play well together, at least as well as
>> GSM does? What do you all think?
>>
>> - NM

Nope. There are Nokia CDMA with Bluetooth coming soon, there was a Nokia
Bluetooth battery for some older CDMA phones, there is the Sony Ericsson
T608.

I think some operators don't want to invest in support, or rather sell to
the youth market (what a stupid segmentation name), or don't have capacity
to support data users demand (yep, because Bluetooth will open a whole new
usage profile for data)...

PS Sorry for the crosspost, replying to the original, but from now on my
replies will go to alt.cellular.bluetooth

--
Mauricio Freitas, Microsoft MVP Mobile Devices
Handhelds, mobile: http://www.geekzone.co.nz
Bluetooth guides: http://www.geekzone.co.nz/content.asp?contentid=449
Performance Centre (Pocket PC reviews):
http://www.geekzone.co.nz/content.asp?ContentId=2028
Handango discount: http://www.geekzone.co.nz/handango_code.asp


"NewsMonkey" <please_post_reply@to_the_group.net> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Hi Everyone,
>
> I have been hearing a lot of this lately and was wondering if there
> was any truth to the statement. I know Verizon has claimed that
> Bluetooth doesn't pass their quality standards, but I have always
> dismissed this as Verizon's excuse to keep making "Teen Rave" phones.
> But I notice with my Sony Ericsson T608 (800/1900 Mhz CDMA & 800Mhz
> Analog) that my Bluetooth connections using Express Network are not very
> fast. It seems to top out at 56-60 kps. I have also heard rumors that
> Verizon intends to remove the bluetooth functionality in the Motorola
> V710 before they release it. Could this be because CDMA and bluetooth
> really don't play well together, at least as well as GSM does? What do
> you all think?
>
> - NM

Nope. There are Nokia CDMA with Bluetooth coming soon, there was a Nokia
Bluetooth battery for some older CDMA phones, there is the Sony Ericsson
T608.

I think some operators don't want to invest in support, or rather sell to
the youth market (what a stupid segmentation name), or don't have capacity
to support data users demand (yep, because Bluetooth will open a whole new
usage profile for data)...

PS Sorry for the crosspost, replying to the original, but from now on my
replies will go to alt.cellular.bluetooth

--
Mauricio Freitas, Microsoft MVP Mobile Devices
Handhelds, mobile: http://www.geekzone.co.nz
Bluetooth guides: http://www.geekzone.co.nz/content.asp?contentid=449
Performance Centre (Pocket PC reviews):
http://www.geekzone.co.nz/content.asp?ContentId=2028
Handango discount: http://www.geekzone.co.nz/handango_code.asp


"NewsMonkey" <please_post_reply@to_the_group.net> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Hi Everyone,
>
> I have been hearing a lot of this lately and was wondering if there
> was any truth to the statement. I know Verizon has claimed that
> Bluetooth doesn't pass their quality standards, but I have always
> dismissed this as Verizon's excuse to keep making "Teen Rave" phones.
> But I notice with my Sony Ericsson T608 (800/1900 Mhz CDMA & 800Mhz
> Analog) that my Bluetooth connections using Express Network are not very
> fast. It seems to top out at 56-60 kps. I have also heard rumors that
> Verizon intends to remove the bluetooth functionality in the Motorola
> V710 before they release it. Could this be because CDMA and bluetooth
> really don't play well together, at least as well as GSM does? What do
> you all think?
>
> - NM

http://www.geekzone.co.nz/content.asp?contentid=2690

This Pocket PC Phone Edition was launched yesterday in China, and it's a
CDMA 1xRTT Bluetooth device.


--
Mauricio Freitas, Microsoft MVP Mobile Devices
Handhelds, mobile: http://www.geekzone.co.nz
Bluetooth guides: http://www.geekzone.co.nz/content.asp?contentid=449
Performance Centre (Pocket PC reviews):
http://www.geekzone.co.nz/content.asp?ContentId=2028
Handango discount: http://www.geekzone.co.nz/handango_code.asp


"Mauricio Freitas" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Nope. There are Nokia CDMA with Bluetooth coming soon, there was a Nokia
> Bluetooth battery for some older CDMA phones, there is the Sony Ericsson
> T608.
>
> I think some operators don't want to invest in support, or rather sell to
> the youth market (what a stupid segmentation name), or don't have capacity
> to support data users demand (yep, because Bluetooth will open a whole new
> usage profile for data)...
>
> PS Sorry for the crosspost, replying to the original, but from now on my
> replies will go to alt.cellular.bluetooth
>
> --
> Mauricio Freitas, Microsoft MVP Mobile Devices
> Handhelds, mobile: http://www.geekzone.co.nz
> Bluetooth guides: http://www.geekzone.co.nz/content.asp?contentid=449
> Performance Centre (Pocket PC reviews):
> http://www.geekzone.co.nz/content.asp?ContentId=2028
> Handango discount: http://www.geekzone.co.nz/handango_code.asp
>
>
> "NewsMonkey" <please_post_reply@to_the_group.net> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > Hi Everyone,
> >
> > I have been hearing a lot of this lately and was wondering if there
> > was any truth to the statement. I know Verizon has claimed that
> > Bluetooth doesn't pass their quality standards, but I have always
> > dismissed this as Verizon's excuse to keep making "Teen Rave" phones.
> > But I notice with my Sony Ericsson T608 (800/1900 Mhz CDMA & 800Mhz
> > Analog) that my Bluetooth connections using Express Network are not very
> > fast. It seems to top out at 56-60 kps. I have also heard rumors that
> > Verizon intends to remove the bluetooth functionality in the Motorola
> > V710 before they release it. Could this be because CDMA and bluetooth
> > really don't play well together, at least as well as GSM does? What do
> > you all think?
> >
> > - NM
>
>

http://www.geekzone.co.nz/content.asp?contentid=2690

This Pocket PC Phone Edition was launched yesterday in China, and it's a
CDMA 1xRTT Bluetooth device.


--
Mauricio Freitas, Microsoft MVP Mobile Devices
Handhelds, mobile: http://www.geekzone.co.nz
Bluetooth guides: http://www.geekzone.co.nz/content.asp?contentid=449
Performance Centre (Pocket PC reviews):
http://www.geekzone.co.nz/content.asp?ContentId=2028
Handango discount: http://www.geekzone.co.nz/handango_code.asp


"Mauricio Freitas" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Nope. There are Nokia CDMA with Bluetooth coming soon, there was a Nokia
> Bluetooth battery for some older CDMA phones, there is the Sony Ericsson
> T608.
>
> I think some operators don't want to invest in support, or rather sell to
> the youth market (what a stupid segmentation name), or don't have capacity
> to support data users demand (yep, because Bluetooth will open a whole new
> usage profile for data)...
>
> PS Sorry for the crosspost, replying to the original, but from now on my
> replies will go to alt.cellular.bluetooth
>
> --
> Mauricio Freitas, Microsoft MVP Mobile Devices
> Handhelds, mobile: http://www.geekzone.co.nz
> Bluetooth guides: http://www.geekzone.co.nz/content.asp?contentid=449
> Performance Centre (Pocket PC reviews):
> http://www.geekzone.co.nz/content.asp?ContentId=2028
> Handango discount: http://www.geekzone.co.nz/handango_code.asp
>
>
> "NewsMonkey" <please_post_reply@to_the_group.net> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > Hi Everyone,
> >
> > I have been hearing a lot of this lately and was wondering if there
> > was any truth to the statement. I know Verizon has claimed that
> > Bluetooth doesn't pass their quality standards, but I have always
> > dismissed this as Verizon's excuse to keep making "Teen Rave" phones.
> > But I notice with my Sony Ericsson T608 (800/1900 Mhz CDMA & 800Mhz
> > Analog) that my Bluetooth connections using Express Network are not very
> > fast. It seems to top out at 56-60 kps. I have also heard rumors that
> > Verizon intends to remove the bluetooth functionality in the Motorola
> > V710 before they release it. Could this be because CDMA and bluetooth
> > really don't play well together, at least as well as GSM does? What do
> > you all think?
> >
> > - NM
>
>

It's very unlikely that GSM is somehow less prone to issues with regard to
concurrent bluetooth usage. This issue appears to be similar to the internal
antenna issue on Verizon. GSM/TDMA carriers have moved almost exclusively
to small internal antenna designs for phones and Verizon almost never
permits
this type of phone. The GSM folks are also happy to utilize bluetooth
enabled
phones, and Verizon will not.

Bottom line: Verizon seems to be willing to stop any technology from being
officially supported on their network which either causes RF interference or
for some reason diminshes RF performance. Even if the amount of
performance degradation is "minimal."

I think Verizon is being stupid. For a company so concerned with quality in
the handset, take a look at the Moto 720 or the LG 4400. Take any LG 4400
and put it near an EM field like a monitor, and the phone will autotically
reboot or turn itself off. In other words, their so called rigorous quality
standards have not allowed them to have less probelmatic phones in a general
sense than the competition. They are, however, willing to take away options
from the customer from perceived limitations.

In terms of bluetooth supportability-- this makes no sense. Try helping
someone get a friggin' future dial cable to work with one of their current
phones, then try setting up bluetooth. Support wise, bluetooth wins hands
down.

-Dan

PS: If any GSM carrier could match Verizon's coverage in my home state, I'd
probably switch. Most of the folks who say bluetooth sucks or is a passing
trend have never actually used it. It's one of those technologies that after
you actually use it, you tend to like it. i.e. Akin to someone saying -
why do we need 802.11 at all. I got a 75' ethernet cable which is the way
god and nature intended it.

It's very unlikely that GSM is somehow less prone to issues with regard to
concurrent bluetooth usage. This issue appears to be similar to the internal
antenna issue on Verizon. GSM/TDMA carriers have moved almost exclusively
to small internal antenna designs for phones and Verizon almost never
permits
this type of phone. The GSM folks are also happy to utilize bluetooth
enabled
phones, and Verizon will not.

Bottom line: Verizon seems to be willing to stop any technology from being
officially supported on their network which either causes RF interference or
for some reason diminshes RF performance. Even if the amount of
performance degradation is "minimal."

I think Verizon is being stupid. For a company so concerned with quality in
the handset, take a look at the Moto 720 or the LG 4400. Take any LG 4400
and put it near an EM field like a monitor, and the phone will autotically
reboot or turn itself off. In other words, their so called rigorous quality
standards have not allowed them to have less probelmatic phones in a general
sense than the competition. They are, however, willing to take away options
from the customer from perceived limitations.

In terms of bluetooth supportability-- this makes no sense. Try helping
someone get a friggin' future dial cable to work with one of their current
phones, then try setting up bluetooth. Support wise, bluetooth wins hands
down.

-Dan

PS: If any GSM carrier could match Verizon's coverage in my home state, I'd
probably switch. Most of the folks who say bluetooth sucks or is a passing
trend have never actually used it. It's one of those technologies that after
you actually use it, you tend to like it. i.e. Akin to someone saying -
why do we need 802.11 at all. I got a 75' ethernet cable which is the way
god and nature intended it.