best prepaid USA cellular for "remote" areas?

best prepaid USA cellular for "remote" areas?

i gather that it comes down to either
GSM or CDMA or iDen (Boost only). see:
www.cellguru.net/prepaid_compare.htm

fwiw, i currently have Tracfone GSM (Moto V170)

for car trips between Chicago and El Paso,
will i have better "remote" reception (hills,
whatever) with a CDMA prepaid provider?
not that i'll be all that remote since
i'll keep to the main highways

also, i'm assuming that CDMA will not
get discontinued anytime soon (as is
currently happening with TDMA)

bill

willbill wrote:

> best prepaid USA cellular for "remote" areas?
>
> i gather that it comes down to either
> GSM or CDMA or iDen (Boost only). see:
> www.cellguru.net/prepaid_compare.htm
>
> fwiw, i currently have Tracfone GSM (Moto V170)
>
> for car trips between Chicago and El Paso,
> will i have better "remote" reception (hills,
> whatever) with a CDMA prepaid provider?
> not that i'll be all that remote since
> i'll keep to the main highways
>
> also, i'm assuming that CDMA will not
> get discontinued anytime soon (as is
> currently happening with TDMA)


well, i at least found some useful/recent
info at www.wikipedia.org:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compari...hone_standards

which includes:

<"Advantages of GSM

* GSM is mature; this maturity means a more stable network with
robust features.
* Less signal deterioration inside buildings.
* Ability to use repeaters.
* Talktime is generally higher in GSM phones due to the pulse
nature of transmission.
* The availability of Subscriber Identity Modules allows users
to switch networks and handsets at will.
* GSM covers virtually all parts of the world so international
roaming is not a problem.

Disadvantages of GSM

* Pulse nature of transmission interferes with some electronics,
especially certain audio amplifiers.
* Intellectual property is concentrated among a few industry
participants, creating barriers to entry for new entrants
and limiting competition among phone manufacturers.
* GSM has a fixed maximum cell site range of 35 km, which is
imposed by technical limitations. [1]

Advantages of CDMA

* Capacity is CDMA's biggest asset. It can accommodate more users
per MHz of bandwidth than any other technology.
* CDMA has no built-in limit to the number of concurrent users.
* CDMA uses precise clocks that do not limit the distance a tower
can cover. [2]
* CDMA consumes less power and covers large areas so cell size
in CDMA is larger.
* CDMA is able to produce a reasonable call with lower signal
(cell phone reception) levels.
* CDMA uses soft handoff, reducing the likelihood of dropped calls.
* CDMA's variable rate voice coders reduce the rate being
transmitted when speaker is not talking, which allows the
channel to be packed more efficiently.
* Has a well-defined path to higher data rates.

Disadvantages of CDMA

* Most technologies are patented and must be licensed from Qualcomm.
* Breathing of base stations, where coverage area shrinks under load.
As the number of subscribers using a particular site goes up,
the range of that site goes down.
* Because CDMA towers interfere with themselves, they are normally
installed on much shorter towers. Because of this, CDMA may not
perform well in hilly terrain.
* Currently CDMA covers a smaller portion of the world as compared
to GSM which has more subscribers and is in more countries
overall worldwide.">


but i'm still not sure how this translates in the
real world. (with Tracfone GSM (Moto V170) vs.
the CDMA providers)

bill

willbill wrote:
> best prepaid USA cellular for "remote" areas?
>
> i gather that it comes down to either
> GSM or CDMA or iDen (Boost only). see:
> www.cellguru.net/prepaid_compare.htm

Actually it doesn't come down to that. For remote areas, it comes down
to choosing a carrier that also supports AMPS, which automatically
limits you to a very few prepaid services, all CDMA.

Pageplus is probably your best bet, in terms of price and coverage.

SMS wrote:

> willbill wrote:
>
>> best prepaid USA cellular for "remote" areas?
>>
>> i gather that it comes down to either
>> GSM or CDMA or iDen (Boost only). see:
>> www.cellguru.net/prepaid_compare.htm


> Actually it doesn't come down to that. For remote areas, it comes down
> to choosing a carrier that also supports AMPS, which automatically
> limits you to a very few prepaid services, all CDMA.
>
> Pageplus is probably your best bet, in terms of price and coverage.


thanks for the reponse.

i'm in the process of looking at my
prepaid alternatives (lowcost) that
might provide better coverage than
my current GSM Tracfone (Moto V170)

and yes, i see that AMPS is the analog
part of Pagepluscellular (actually Verizon)

but www.wikipedia.org's definition of AMPS
shows that the FCC's end date for AMPS
is jan/feb of 2008, and that Verizon
is likely to quickly shut it down at
that point and go strictly with CDMA

i'm starting to think that i might do
better to go with T-mobile prepaid

i mean, the one real world source (of sorts)
is the 14 page jan 2007 Consumer Reports
review of cell phones that shows Verizon
and T-Mobile consistentantly at the top
of the heap, and even then it only focuses
on major metro areas

any further thoughts will be appreciated.

bill

willbill wrote:

> but www.wikipedia.org's definition of AMPS
> shows that the FCC's end date for AMPS
> is jan/feb of 2008, and that Verizon
> is likely to quickly shut it down at
> that point and go strictly with CDMA

When the FCC permits AMPS to be shut down, it will almost certainly
immediately be shut down in areas that are covered by digital service,
because it uses a lot of bandwidth unnecessarily.

However, remote areas, where AMPS is the only service, will almost
certainly not have AMPS shut down, at least by the rural CDMA/AMPS
carriers. There are several reasons for this. First, a lot of emergency
call boxes are in areas with no digital coverage, and these call boxes
use AMPS. Second, a lot of the AMPS coverage is by smaller carriers in
rural areas, and AMPS represents roaming revenue. Third, AMPS provides
the only coverage for locals in a lot of the area covered by these
carriers. There is no cost savings in turning off AMPS unless there is a
capacity issue, and the rural carriers don't have capacity issues.

For AMPS areas that are currently covered only by Cingular, they will
almost certainly turn off AMPS even in their areas that have no digital
coverage. For example, I was recently out in the Florida Everglades,
roaming onto Cingular's AMPS network from my Verizon tri-band phone. 95%
of Cingular's customers can't use that AMPS network, and had no
coverage. It makes Cingular look bad when only Verizon, Sprint, Alltel,
etc's customers can use one of their networks. Hence, I think that
Cingular will turn of all AMPS as soon as they can, even though this
means vast areas with no coverage will be created. Fortunately, there
are not a lot of areas where Cingular is the only AMPS carrier.

Metro areas with rural areas surrounding them, will suffer when AMPS is
permitted to be turned off. For example, in the San Francisco Bay Area,
there are a lot of areas outside the urban core, sometimes only a few
miles from the urban core, where AMPS is the only coverage you're able
to get. A lot of these areas are city, county, state, and national
parks, where they are unlikely to permit enough towers to cover the
areas in digital, but where you currently get decent AMPS coverage from
towers outside the parks. All the coverage in these areas will be lost
when AMPS is turned off. This is good news for Cingular, which has much
poorer coverage, at least in my area, by virtue of their lack of AMPS.
I'm hoping that the state of California will insist that all the
roadside call boxes remain operational, which will give AMPS a bit more
life, even in the semi-urban areas.

Even without AMPS, Verizon's network is better than Cingular's, so
PagePlus is still a good choice.

SMS wrote:

> willbill wrote:
>
>> but www.wikipedia.org's definition of AMPS
>> shows that the FCC's end date for AMPS
>> is jan/feb of 2008, and that Verizon
>> is likely to quickly shut it down at
>> that point and go strictly with CDMA


> When the FCC permits AMPS to be shut down, it will almost certainly
> immediately be shut down in areas that are covered by digital service,
> because it uses a lot of bandwidth unnecessarily.
>
> However, remote areas, where AMPS is the only service, will almost
> certainly not have AMPS shut down, at least by the rural CDMA/AMPS
> carriers. There are several reasons for this. First, a lot of emergency
> call boxes are in areas with no digital coverage, and these call boxes
> use AMPS. Second, a lot of the AMPS coverage is by smaller carriers in
> rural areas, and AMPS represents roaming revenue. Third, AMPS provides
> the only coverage for locals in a lot of the area covered by these
> carriers. There is no cost savings in turning off AMPS unless there is a
> capacity issue, and the rural carriers don't have capacity issues.
>
> For AMPS areas that are currently covered only by Cingular, they will
> almost certainly turn off AMPS even in their areas that have no digital
> coverage. For example, I was recently out in the Florida Everglades,
> roaming onto Cingular's AMPS network from my Verizon tri-band phone. 95%
> of Cingular's customers can't use that AMPS network, and had no
> coverage. It makes Cingular look bad when only Verizon, Sprint, Alltel,
> etc's customers can use one of their networks. Hence, I think that
> Cingular will turn of all AMPS as soon as they can, even though this
> means vast areas with no coverage will be created. Fortunately, there
> are not a lot of areas where Cingular is the only AMPS carrier.
>
> Metro areas with rural areas surrounding them, will suffer when AMPS is
> permitted to be turned off. For example, in the San Francisco Bay Area,
> there are a lot of areas outside the urban core, sometimes only a few
> miles from the urban core, where AMPS is the only coverage you're able
> to get. A lot of these areas are city, county, state, and national
> parks, where they are unlikely to permit enough towers to cover the
> areas in digital, but where you currently get decent AMPS coverage from
> towers outside the parks. All the coverage in these areas will be lost
> when AMPS is turned off. This is good news for Cingular, which has much
> poorer coverage, at least in my area, by virtue of their lack of AMPS.
> I'm hoping that the state of California will insist that all the
> roadside call boxes remain operational, which will give AMPS a bit more
> life, even in the semi-urban areas.
>
> Even without AMPS, Verizon's network is better than Cingular's,
> so PagePlus is still a good choice.


i agree with this last sentence!

again, thank you for a thought provoking response
(and especially the ideas it provides!)

also the high ranking of Verizon by the last two
yearly Consumer Reports writeups on cell phones
makes it clear to me that it was their evolving
CDMA capability and not their AMPS/analog
capability that resulted in their top ranking
in the major metro areas in the USA

what is clear to me (from the jan.'07 Consumer Reports
article on cell phones, and the dec.27'06 S.Goodman
response in the "Suggestions for emergency phone" thread)
is that i can get better prepaid cell area coverage than
what i currently have with Tracfone (for car trip to/from
El Paso/Chicago), and that CDMA digital cellular coverage
is both improving *and* probably evolving (see wikipedia's
CDMA2000 definition)

as you pointed out, pagepluscellular may well be the
lowcost leader

but they currently only appear to offer somewhat "older"
tri-mode phones (AMPS850/CDMA850/CDMA1900). i mean, who
is going to produce an up-to-date tri-mode phone, given
that AMPS is going to take a major downsizing in 11 months?

so i'm not all that interested in buying a somewhat
out of date tri-mode cell phone. if i'm wrong about
this, i'm open to correction.

S.Goodman mentioned the possible option of buying a current
CDMA Verizon phone and checking with pagepluscellular that
they can/will activate it with their service. do you have
any insight into if this is doable/workable?

what about buying a used Verizon phone on e-Bay?

bill

willbill wrote:

> but they currently only appear to offer somewhat "older"
> tri-mode phones (AMPS850/CDMA850/CDMA1900). i mean, who
> is going to produce an up-to-date tri-mode phone, given
> that AMPS is going to take a major downsizing in 11 months?

The Motorola V325i is an up to date tri-mode phone.

You can use any Verizon phone on PagePlus, you don't have to buy one of
the phones they offer. Of course you'll pay a lot for a V325i if you buy
one with no contract from Verizon.

In article <45a5ebed$0$68953$742ec2ed@news.sonic.net>, on Wed, 10 Jan
2007 23:48:52 -0800, SMS wrote:

> willbill wrote:
>
> > but they currently only appear to offer somewhat "older"
> > tri-mode phones (AMPS850/CDMA850/CDMA1900). i mean, who
> > is going to produce an up-to-date tri-mode phone, given
> > that AMPS is going to take a major downsizing in 11 months?
>
> The Motorola V325i is an up to date tri-mode phone.
>
> You can use any Verizon phone on PagePlus, you don't have to buy one of
> the phones they offer. Of course you'll pay a lot for a V325i if you buy
> one with no contract from Verizon.


The Inpulse Samsung SCHa870pp appears to be tri-mode (and bluetooth!).
$100 at WalMart - which might be more than the OP wishes to spend.

--
Seth Goodman

In article <qktph.142830$gl2.12167@newsfe16.lga>, on Thu, 11 Jan 2007
10:11:04 -0600, George wrote:

> In article <MPG.20100a446de75091989ba7@newsgroups.comcast.n
> et>, seth_news@yahoo.com says...
>
> > The Inpulse Samsung SCHa870pp appears to be tri-mode
> > (and bluetooth!). $100 at WalMart - which might be more
> > than the OP wishes to spend.
>
> I'm helping my brother in Dallas get set up with a prepaid
> account, and one option is Page Plus. But since Verizon
> isn't where I am, nobody sells InPulse phones here. Could
> you tell me what the least expensive InPulse phone is, and
> how much Wal-Mart wants for it?

They've got a $50 Nokia:

http://www.walmart.com/catalog/catalog.gsp?cat=489784

(Note that this is the web price. They say "prices vary" in-store.)

--
Seth Goodman

At 11 Jan 2007 10:11:04 -0600 George wrote:

> Could
> you tell me what the least expensive InPulse phone is, and
> how much Wal-Mart wants for it?
>


IIRC, it was $59.99 in store, but I forgot what model it was. (And
frankly didn't care- the phone would get virtually no use!)

I was looking about a month ago while researching my options for a
replacement for my Beyond Wireless TDMA service, and was considering
PagePlus.
For anyone who cares, I still haven't decided, but I'm leaning toward
Speakout only because I'm a GSM snob. Not because I think it's "better"
but because I like the idea of moving SIMs between phones. I primarily
use a GSM PDA phone on T-Mo with all of my contacts and business info
etc. in it and when I find myself in an area without T-Mo service (rarer
and rarer these days thankfully!) it'd be nice to put a working SIM in
the PDA and still just carry one device. Currently I "forward when
unavailable" the PDA to one of my Beyond phones and have to lug another
phone around with me. With Speakout I could just carry the extra SIM and
switch them at will.

So far my travels haven't taken me many places that either T-Mo or
Cingular didn't work, so while the extra coverage PP offers would be
nice, it's not necessarily a deal-breaker.

Would you mind discussing why your experience with Tracfone?

I assume that you are not satisfied with their service.

Thanks

TMT
willbill wrote:
> best prepaid USA cellular for "remote" areas?
>
> i gather that it comes down to either
> GSM or CDMA or iDen (Boost only). see:
> www.cellguru.net/prepaid_compare.htm
>
> fwiw, i currently have Tracfone GSM (Moto V170)
>
> for car trips between Chicago and El Paso,
> will i have better "remote" reception (hills,
> whatever) with a CDMA prepaid provider?
> not that i'll be all that remote since
> i'll keep to the main highways
>
> also, i'm assuming that CDMA will not
> get discontinued anytime soon (as is
> currently happening with TDMA)
>
> bill

Too_Many_Tools wrote:

> Would you mind discussing why your experience with Tracfone?

your wording is unclear. anyhow, Tracfone is my 1st
cell phone with about 100 days passed on a 14-month/
460-minute prepaid account; i've so far made about
6 calls totaling 13 minutes

>
> I assume that you are not satisfied with their service.

quite the contrary. Tracfone has worked just
fine with my limited usage (in the far Chicago
suburbs)

but now that i know a bit more, i'm fully dangerous
in the conclusions that i reach.

bill

I asked becasue it sounded like you did not like Tracfone.

Why are you then looking for another provider if the service is good?

Thanks

TMT
willbill wrote:
> Too_Many_Tools wrote:
>
> > Would you mind discussing why your experience with Tracfone?
>
> your wording is unclear. anyhow, Tracfone is my 1st
> cell phone with about 100 days passed on a 14-month/
> 460-minute prepaid account; i've so far made about
> 6 calls totaling 13 minutes
>
> >
> > I assume that you are not satisfied with their service.
>
> quite the contrary. Tracfone has worked just
> fine with my limited usage (in the far Chicago
> suburbs)
>
> but now that i know a bit more, i'm fully dangerous
> in the conclusions that i reach.
>
> bill

Too_Many_Tools wrote:

> I asked becasue it sounded like you did not like Tracfone.
>
> Why are you then looking for another provider if the service is good?


my concern is the open road (Chicago/El Paso)

bill

Why would that matter?

TMT
willbill wrote:
> Too_Many_Tools wrote:
>
> > I asked becasue it sounded like you did not like Tracfone.
> >
> > Why are you then looking for another provider if the service is good?
>
>
> my concern is the open road (Chicago/El Paso)
>
> bill