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- 01-12-2006, 09:37 PM #1GilesGuest
Interesting plan... Apparently Optus is looking to buy Vodafone's
network infrastructure and make Vodafone a virtual mobile network
operator. Vodafone would buy Optus airtime wholesale and resell it to
its customer base, similar to the way Virgin runs its mobile business
now.
Optus's thoughts turn to Vodafone - Australian IT 13/1/06
http://australianit.news.com.au/arti...nbv%5E,00.html
Would be a coup for Optus, on top of the plans for Crazy Johns to
resell airtime as another Optus VMNO when its agreement with Telstra
runs out.
› See More: Optus plans buyout of Vodafone network
- 01-13-2006, 12:21 PM #2Rod SpeedGuest
Re: Optus plans buyout of Vodafone network
Giles <[email protected]> wrote:
> Interesting plan... Apparently Optus is looking to buy Vodafone's
> network infrastructure and make Vodafone a virtual mobile network
> operator. Vodafone would buy Optus airtime wholesale and resell it to
> its customer base, similar to the way Virgin runs its mobile business
> now.
>
> Optus's thoughts turn to Vodafone - Australian IT 13/1/06
> http://australianit.news.com.au/arti...nbv%5E,00.html
>
> Would be a coup for Optus, on top of the plans for Crazy Johns to
> resell airtime as another Optus VMNO when its agreement with Telstra
> runs out.
Remains to be seen if the ACCC would allow it.
- 01-13-2006, 05:35 PM #3GilesGuest
Re: Optus plans buyout of Vodafone network
> > Interesting plan... Apparently Optus is looking to buy Vodafone's
> > network infrastructure and make Vodafone a virtual mobile network
> > operator.
> Remains to be seen if the ACCC would allow it.
Yeah, that's an interesting one - it would be the biggest consolidation
of the mobile market in Australia, ever.
Optus and Vodafone would still have distinct customer bases though -
it's not a merger or total business acquisition, it's just the network
infrastructure.
- 01-13-2006, 07:41 PM #4Dean CollinsGuest
Re: Optus plans buyout of Vodafone network
same more or less as the foxtel optus pay tv agreement.
"Giles" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>> > Interesting plan... Apparently Optus is looking to buy Vodafone's
>> > network infrastructure and make Vodafone a virtual mobile network
>> > operator.
>
>> Remains to be seen if the ACCC would allow it.
>
> Yeah, that's an interesting one - it would be the biggest consolidation
> of the mobile market in Australia, ever.
>
> Optus and Vodafone would still have distinct customer bases though -
> it's not a merger or total business acquisition, it's just the network
> infrastructure.
>
- 01-13-2006, 07:46 PM #5Ed-Guest
Re: Optus plans buyout of Vodafone network
there would be far too much network duplication, therfore singtel buying
assets which are redundant would only make sense if it was to remove a
competitor from the marketplace, in order to be able to increase prices.
: same more or less as the foxtel optus pay tv agreement.
:
: >> > Interesting plan... Apparently Optus is looking to buy
Vodafone's
: >> > network infrastructure and make Vodafone a virtual mobile network
: >> > operator.
: >
: >> Remains to be seen if the ACCC would allow it.
: >
: > Yeah, that's an interesting one - it would be the biggest
consolidation
: > of the mobile market in Australia, ever.
: >
: > Optus and Vodafone would still have distinct customer bases though -
: > it's not a merger or total business acquisition, it's just the
network
: > infrastructure.
: >
:
:
- 01-13-2006, 09:37 PM #6Rod SpeedGuest
Re: Optus plans buyout of Vodafone network
Dean Collins" <collins_dean"spam.me.here.
<collins_dean"spam.me.here."@hotmail.com> wrote:
> same more or less as the foxtel optus pay tv agreement.
Nope, nothing like it. That's just content sharing.
> Giles <[email protected]> wrote
>>>> Interesting plan... Apparently Optus is looking to buy Vodafone's
>>>> network infrastructure and make Vodafone a virtual mobile network
>>>> operator.
>>> Remains to be seen if the ACCC would allow it.
>> Yeah, that's an interesting one - it would be the biggest
>> consolidation of the mobile market in Australia, ever.
>> Optus and Vodafone would still have distinct customer bases though -
>> it's not a merger or total business acquisition, it's just the
>> network infrastructure.
- 01-15-2006, 04:30 PM #7Rod SpeedGuest
Re: Optus plans buyout of Vodafone network
Tom Smyth <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Rod Speed" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> Giles <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>>>> Interesting plan... Apparently Optus is looking
>>>>> to buy Vodafone's network infrastructure and
>>>>> make Vodafone a virtual mobile network operator.
>>>
>>>> Remains to be seen if the ACCC would allow it.
>>>
>>> Yeah, that's an interesting one - it would be the biggest
>>> consolidation of the mobile market in Australia, ever.
>>
>> Yeah, and I have the vague recollection that the ACCC has
>> said that they wouldnt allow Telstra or Optarse to buy it.
>>
>> That was before 3 tho, so it may not be quite that simple now.
>>
>> And that was Fels too, not the current top ACCC monkey.
>>
>>> Optus and Vodafone would still have distinct customer
>>> bases though - it's not a merger or total business
>>> acquisition, it's just the network infrastructure.
>> Sure.
> What if a separate business was created to combine and manage the
> infrastructure?
The ACCC wont buy such an obvious end run
if they wont allow Optarse to buy Vodafone.
> Optus and Voda would be billed for using it, and they would also be the
> shareholders.
Irrelevant to what the ACCC cares about, a reduction in competition when
one of the majors lunches on one of the small number of competitors.
> I've been trying to float that idea for *weeks*, albeit my idea involved
> combining the infrastructure of all the networks.
No thanks. What works is real competition.
- 01-15-2006, 04:47 PM #8Tom SmythGuest
Re: Optus plans buyout of Vodafone network
"Rod Speed" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Giles <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>>> Interesting plan... Apparently Optus is looking
>>>> to buy Vodafone's network infrastructure and
>>>> make Vodafone a virtual mobile network operator.
>>
>>> Remains to be seen if the ACCC would allow it.
>>
>> Yeah, that's an interesting one - it would be the biggest
>> consolidation of the mobile market in Australia, ever.
>
> Yeah, and I have the vague recollection that the ACCC has
> said that they wouldnt allow Telstra or Optarse to buy it.
>
> That was before 3 tho, so it may not be quite that simple now.
>
> And that was Fels too, not the current top ACCC monkey.
>
>> Optus and Vodafone would still have distinct customer
>> bases though - it's not a merger or total business
>> acquisition, it's just the network infrastructure.
>
> Sure.
What if a separate business was created to combine and manage the
infrastructure? Optus and Voda would be billed for using it, and they would
also be the shareholders.
I've been trying to float that idea for *weeks*, albeit my idea involved
combining the infrastructure of all the networks.
- 01-15-2006, 05:32 PM #9GilesGuest
Re: Optus plans buyout of Vodafone network
> Interesting plan... Apparently Optus is looking to buy Vodafone's
> network infrastructure and make Vodafone a virtual mobile network
> operator. Vodafone would buy Optus airtime wholesale and resell it to
> its customer base, similar to the way Virgin runs its mobile business
> now.
>
> Optus's thoughts turn to Vodafone - Australian IT 13/1/06 http://australianit.news.com.au/arti...nbv%5E,00.html
FYI, Crikey's analysis of a few days ago is now online
http://www.crikey.com.au/articles/20...1622-8969.html
- 01-15-2006, 07:14 PM #10brian w edgintonGuest
Re: Optus plans buyout of Vodafone network
On Mon, 16 Jan 2006 01:37:23 GMT, "Tom Smyth"
<[email protected]> wrote:
>You're right, but it pains me to think of the vast (and mainly unnessary,
>technically) duplication of infrastructure. We're paying for all that crap.
Yeah!
A hobby-horse of mine.....imagine the coverage if , even, half of the
existing towers were spread across the country with access by all
customers.
Like the copper wire system.
We were lucky there wasn't the same "competition" mystique when the
PMG was doing its thing back when.
If this was a perfect world, we, probably, wouldn't
be in it.
- 01-15-2006, 07:33 PM #11Rod SpeedGuest
Re: Optus plans buyout of Vodafone network
Tom Smyth <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Rod Speed" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> Tom Smyth <[email protected]> wrote:
>>> "Rod Speed" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>> news:[email protected]...
>>>> Giles <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>>> Interesting plan... Apparently Optus is looking
>>>>>>> to buy Vodafone's network infrastructure and
>>>>>>> make Vodafone a virtual mobile network operator.
>>>>>
>>>>>> Remains to be seen if the ACCC would allow it.
>>>>>
>>>>> Yeah, that's an interesting one - it would be the biggest
>>>>> consolidation of the mobile market in Australia, ever.
>>>>
>>>> Yeah, and I have the vague recollection that the ACCC has
>>>> said that they wouldnt allow Telstra or Optarse to buy it.
>>>>
>>>> That was before 3 tho, so it may not be quite that simple now.
>>>>
>>>> And that was Fels too, not the current top ACCC monkey.
>>>>
>>>>> Optus and Vodafone would still have distinct customer
>>>>> bases though - it's not a merger or total business
>>>>> acquisition, it's just the network infrastructure.
>>
>>>> Sure.
>>
>>> What if a separate business was created to combine and manage the
>>> infrastructure?
>>
>> The ACCC wont buy such an obvious end run
>> if they wont allow Optarse to buy Vodafone.
>>
>>> Optus and Voda would be billed for using it, and they would also be
>>> the shareholders.
>>
>> Irrelevant to what the ACCC cares about, a reduction in competition
>> when one of the majors lunches on one of the small number of
>> competitors.
>>> I've been trying to float that idea for *weeks*, albeit my idea
>>> involved combining the infrastructure of all the networks.
>>
>> No thanks. What works is real competition.
>
> You're right, but it pains me to think of the vast (and mainly
> unnessary, technically) duplication of infrastructure. We're paying
> for all that crap.
We are with banks, insurance companys, airlines, supermarkets,
etc etc etc too. The short story is that no monopoly ever delivers
anything like as well as real competition, even tho competition isnt
theoretically as efficient. In practice no monopoly is ever efficient
either, essentially because there is no incentive to be efficient.
> It's a vicious circle comparing competition vs cost base etc etc.
No its not. Anyone with a clue realises that no monopoly
with the supply of services ever works properly.
- 01-15-2006, 07:37 PM #12Tom SmythGuest
Re: Optus plans buyout of Vodafone network
"Rod Speed" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Tom Smyth <[email protected]> wrote:
>> "Rod Speed" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>>> Giles <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>>>>> Interesting plan... Apparently Optus is looking
>>>>>> to buy Vodafone's network infrastructure and
>>>>>> make Vodafone a virtual mobile network operator.
>>>>
>>>>> Remains to be seen if the ACCC would allow it.
>>>>
>>>> Yeah, that's an interesting one - it would be the biggest
>>>> consolidation of the mobile market in Australia, ever.
>>>
>>> Yeah, and I have the vague recollection that the ACCC has
>>> said that they wouldnt allow Telstra or Optarse to buy it.
>>>
>>> That was before 3 tho, so it may not be quite that simple now.
>>>
>>> And that was Fels too, not the current top ACCC monkey.
>>>
>>>> Optus and Vodafone would still have distinct customer
>>>> bases though - it's not a merger or total business
>>>> acquisition, it's just the network infrastructure.
>
>>> Sure.
>
>> What if a separate business was created to combine and manage the
>> infrastructure?
>
> The ACCC wont buy such an obvious end run
> if they wont allow Optarse to buy Vodafone.
>
>> Optus and Voda would be billed for using it, and they would also be the
>> shareholders.
>
> Irrelevant to what the ACCC cares about, a reduction in competition when
> one of the majors lunches on one of the small number of competitors.
>
>> I've been trying to float that idea for *weeks*, albeit my idea involved
>> combining the infrastructure of all the networks.
>
> No thanks. What works is real competition.
You're right, but it pains me to think of the vast (and mainly unnessary,
technically) duplication of infrastructure. We're paying for all that crap.
It's a vicious circle comparing competition vs cost base etc etc.
- 01-16-2006, 01:16 AM #13Nick WGuest
Re: Optus plans buyout of Vodafone network
Tom Smyth wrote:
> "Rod Speed" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>>Giles <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>>>Interesting plan... Apparently Optus is looking
>>>>>to buy Vodafone's network infrastructure and
>>>>>make Vodafone a virtual mobile network operator.
>>>
>>>>Remains to be seen if the ACCC would allow it.
>>>
>>>Yeah, that's an interesting one - it would be the biggest
>>>consolidation of the mobile market in Australia, ever.
>>
>>Yeah, and I have the vague recollection that the ACCC has
>>said that they wouldnt allow Telstra or Optarse to buy it.
>>
>>That was before 3 tho, so it may not be quite that simple now.
>>
>>And that was Fels too, not the current top ACCC monkey.
>>
>>
>>>Optus and Vodafone would still have distinct customer
>>>bases though - it's not a merger or total business
>>>acquisition, it's just the network infrastructure.
>>
>>Sure.
>
>
> What if a separate business was created to combine and manage the
> infrastructure? Optus and Voda would be billed for using it, and they would
> also be the shareholders.
Isn't that what Telstra and Hutch have done with 3's network?
http://www.three.com.au/documents/Ne...ease_700AD.pdf
-Nick
- 01-16-2006, 09:58 PM #14Tom SmythGuest
Re: Optus plans buyout of Vodafone network
"Horry" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news[email protected]...
> On Sun, 15 Jan 2006 22:47:04 GMT, Tom Smyth wrote:
>
>> "Rod Speed" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>>> Giles <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>>>>> Interesting plan... Apparently Optus is looking
>>>>>> to buy Vodafone's network infrastructure and
>>>>>> make Vodafone a virtual mobile network operator.
>>>>
>>>>> Remains to be seen if the ACCC would allow it.
>>>>
>>>> Yeah, that's an interesting one - it would be the biggest
>>>> consolidation of the mobile market in Australia, ever.
>>>
>>> Yeah, and I have the vague recollection that the ACCC has
>>> said that they wouldnt allow Telstra or Optarse to buy it.
>>>
>>> That was before 3 tho, so it may not be quite that simple now.
>>>
>>> And that was Fels too, not the current top ACCC monkey.
>>>
>>>> Optus and Vodafone would still have distinct customer
>>>> bases though - it's not a merger or total business
>>>> acquisition, it's just the network infrastructure.
>>>
>>> Sure.
>>
>> What if a separate business was created to combine and manage the
>> infrastructure? Optus and Voda would be billed for using it, and they
>> would
>> also be the shareholders.
>>
>> I've been trying to float that idea for *weeks*, albeit my idea involved
>> combining the infrastructure of all the networks.
>
> Annoying me with SMSs about this for *weeks* does not constitute "floating
> the idea".
I thought you were a rather influential figure in aus.comms.mobile. Are you
not??
- 01-17-2006, 02:04 AM #15Jeremy QuirkeGuest
Re: Optus plans buyout of Vodafone network
"Rod Speed" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Tom Smyth <[email protected]> wrote:
>> "Rod Speed" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>>> Tom Smyth <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>> "Rod Speed" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>> news:[email protected]...
>>>>> Giles <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Interesting plan... Apparently Optus is looking
>>>>>>>> to buy Vodafone's network infrastructure and
>>>>>>>> make Vodafone a virtual mobile network operator.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Remains to be seen if the ACCC would allow it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yeah, that's an interesting one - it would be the biggest
>>>>>> consolidation of the mobile market in Australia, ever.
>>>>>
>>>>> Yeah, and I have the vague recollection that the ACCC has
>>>>> said that they wouldnt allow Telstra or Optarse to buy it.
>>>>>
>>>>> That was before 3 tho, so it may not be quite that simple now.
>>>>>
>>>>> And that was Fels too, not the current top ACCC monkey.
>>>>>
>>>>>> Optus and Vodafone would still have distinct customer
>>>>>> bases though - it's not a merger or total business
>>>>>> acquisition, it's just the network infrastructure.
>>>
>>>>> Sure.
>>>
>>>> What if a separate business was created to combine and manage the
>>>> infrastructure?
>>>
>>> The ACCC wont buy such an obvious end run
>>> if they wont allow Optarse to buy Vodafone.
>>>
>>>> Optus and Voda would be billed for using it, and they would also be
>>>> the shareholders.
>>>
>>> Irrelevant to what the ACCC cares about, a reduction in competition
>>> when one of the majors lunches on one of the small number of
>>> competitors.
>>>> I've been trying to float that idea for *weeks*, albeit my idea
>>>> involved combining the infrastructure of all the networks.
>>>
>>> No thanks. What works is real competition.
>>
>> You're right, but it pains me to think of the vast (and mainly
>> unnessary, technically) duplication of infrastructure. We're paying
>> for all that crap.
>
> We are with banks, insurance companys, airlines, supermarkets,
> etc etc etc too. The short story is that no monopoly ever delivers
> anything like as well as real competition, even tho competition isnt
> theoretically as efficient. In practice no monopoly is ever efficient
> either, essentially because there is no incentive to be efficient.
But the existing model could be more efficient without unnecessary
triplication of network infrastructure in barely or unprofitable areas. i.e.
a subset of the operators provides coverage in such areas, and charges the
remaining operators through roaming agreements. These charges are balanced
through a different subset of operators providing coverage in another low
density area. Ultimately you might end up getting better overall coverage
that way.
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