More SPAM?

Rod Speed wrote...

> It looks more likely he was targetted geographically.
>
> Its certainly technically feasible for the system to work out
> which mobiles are working thru particular mobile bases.

But that would require info from either Telstra or Optus or whever the mobile
carrier that he's with, wouldn't it?

If that's the case, then if he starts getting slugged for charges that he didn't
ask for and doesn't accept, then that carrier would have to wear it, wouldn't
it?

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› See More: More SPAM?

Snapper <[email protected]> wrote
> Rod Speed wrote

>> BUT the very fundamental problem with the whole approach is that
>> there is nothing that can be done about operations outside the country
>> that choose to ignore you listing your number on the do not call register,
>> where there isnt any direct association with a local operation that can
>> be shafted if they choose to ignore our law. Most obviously with the
>> operations that are entirely overseas based and so arguably dont have
>> any legal obligation to comply with our law and no way thats practical to
>> take any action against them even if the authoritys decide to bother.

> What about the companies that they're selling products for here in Australia?

Thats what I meant about no direct association with a local
operation, nothing can be done about those which dont have any.

> We get calls all the time regarding mobile phones. These originate
> from OS, usually India or whereever. But the products that they're
> selling have to be from here. So why not go those pricks? They are
> just using the call centre as their agents.

Yes, its certainly possible to shaft those operations in that situation.

> Sort of like when you pay some dude to commit a crime,
> eg, murder, rob a store or sell drugs. You can go to jail
> for that, like Mokbel is on trial for, or will be on trial for the
> murder of Lewis Moran even though he didn't pull the trigger.

Sure, but the problem is with the ones that arent flogging something
from a local operation at all, most obviously with those flogging
overseas holidays or 'investment' schemes and asian time share etc.

Snapper <[email protected]> wrote
> Rod Speed wrote

>> It looks more likely he was targetted geographically.

>> Its certainly technically feasible for the system to work out
>> which mobiles are working thru particular mobile bases.

> But that would require info from either Telstra or Optus
> or whever the mobile carrier that he's with, wouldn't it?

Not if the telco delivers the SMS or voice message, without telling
the originator of the message who was delivered to number wise.

> If that's the case, then if he starts getting slugged
> for charges that he didn't ask for and doesn't accept,
> then that carrier would have to wear it, wouldn't it?

Sure, but the originator of the message can just pay for that, at a discounted rate etc.

Rod Speed wrote...

> Sure, but the problem is with the ones that arent flogging something
> from a local operation at all, most obviously with those flogging
> overseas holidays or 'investment' schemes and asian time share etc.

Haven't got any of them. Just mobs flogging phone services and in some cases
power or gas contracts...

Rod Speed wrote...

> > That suggests Optus is selling the info (about who is where)
> > based on its internal location registers.
>
> Not necessarily. They could be just delivering the spam SMS
> to the mobiles that their system knows are in a particular area.

How would they know this?

There used to be a geographical link to mobile numbers when they first come out.
The phone's home cell had the area code in the number, but that quickly fell by
the wayside as the takeup of mobiles got greater.

> > There are some legitimate privacy issues in doing this.
>
> Nope, not if they just deliver the spam SMS and dont
> tell the source of the SMS anything about which mobiles
> they sent the SMS to, just the total of SMSs sent etc.

Eh?

Snapper wrote:

> Rod Speed wrote...
>
>> > That suggests Optus is selling the info (about who is
>> > where) based on its internal location registers.
>>
>> Not necessarily. They could be just delivering the spam SMS
>> to the mobiles that their system knows are in a particular
>> area.
>
> How would they know this?

google for "home location register" and "visitor location
register".

John

Snapper <[email protected]> wrote
> Rod Speed wrote

>> Sure, but the problem is with the ones that arent flogging something
>> from a local operation at all, most obviously with those flogging
>> overseas holidays or 'investment' schemes and asian time share etc.

> Haven't got any of them. Just mobs flogging phone
> services and in some cases power or gas contracts...

Sure, but you havent had that many to your mobile.

Have you got them on the do not call register ?

Snapper <[email protected]> wrote
> Rod Speed wrote

>>> That suggests Optus is selling the info (about who is where)
>>> based on its internal location registers.

>> Not necessarily. They could be just delivering the spam SMS
>> to the mobiles that their system knows are in a particular area.

> How would they know this?

The mobile system has to keep track of what bases can hear your mobile
so they can get that base to whistle up your mobile when you receive a call.

> There used to be a geographical link to mobile numbers when they first
> come out. The phone's home cell had the area code in the number, but
> that quickly fell by the wayside as the takeup of mobiles got greater.

Yeah, it obviously cant be done that way.

>>> There are some legitimate privacy issues in doing this.

>> Nope, not if they just deliver the spam SMS and dont
>> tell the source of the SMS anything about which mobiles
>> they sent the SMS to, just the total of SMSs sent etc.

> Eh?

If the mobile telco just sends SMSs or voice messages to the mobile
that have logged in to a few bases, and doesnt tell the originator of
the SMS or voice message which mobile numbers they have been
sent to, just the total of how many got sent, there arent any privacy
issues, particularly if the do not call register is observed.

I wrote:

> google for "home location register" and "visitor location
> register".

I should have given some more background.

GSM/UMTS overage is broken down to "location areas" within
countries.

A cell has a unique ID consisting of 4 parts. Firstly, there's
the country (MCC) and the operator ID (MNC). Together, MCC
with MNC is also called PLMN).

Then there's the location area code (LAC), and finally the cell
ID itself. The cell ID is unique only when taken with that
other info (the MCC + MNC + LAC + cell ID combination).

The location area is the area in which all cells transmit the
paging call when your phone receives an incoming call or
message. So your carrier has to know your LAC.

An LAC can cover a signifiant part of a city, an entire city, or
hundreds of square kilometres of country. You don't want too
many LACs, or phone battery life suffers. This is because each
phone must transmit a location update every time it camps on a
cell with a different LAC from the last. That happening
several times a minute in your lounge room isn't good.

So your carrier always knows your current LAC. It's very basic
information.

John

"Snapper" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Rod Speed wrote...
>
>> > they do not seem to want to stop - I thought that there was
>> > legislation put in place to stop this type of unsolicited spam?
>>
>> Nope, just a mechanism to opt out of it if you dont want to get it.
>
> Does it work, though?
>

I went back to provider (Isim through Optus) they are going to block that
number from my phone. They advised I should ring the opt out number and ask
to be taken off the DB.

Since I didn't opt in my number should not be on their DB

Rod Speed wrote...

> > Haven't got any of them. Just mobs flogging phone
> > services and in some cases power or gas contracts...
>
> Sure, but you havent had that many to your mobile.
>
> Have you got them on the do not call register ?

Haven't got anyone. I have yet to register. But I might, even though most of
them come from O/S.

When we get "Private Caller" we let the call go to the answering machine. I
would like to reinstate the following greeting:

"You've reached our answering machine because you either have blocked your
caller ID or we aren't here. If your call is really important to us then you can
leave a message. For everyone else, sorry for the inconvenience. We will get
back to you ASAP."

but the missus made me delete it. Or rather, she recorded a new message over it.

Snapper <[email protected]> wrote
> Rod Speed wrote

>>> Haven't got any of them. Just mobs flogging phone
>>> services and in some cases power or gas contracts...

>> Sure, but you havent had that many to your mobile.

>> Have you got them on the do not call register ?

> Haven't got anyone. I have yet to register.
> But I might, even though most of them come from O/S.

They are still required to observe it, particularly when they are acting for local operations.

But then they are now also required to present their Caller ID too, and quite a few dont bother.

> When we get "Private Caller" we let the call go to the answering
> machine. I would like to reinstate the following greeting:

> "You've reached our answering machine because you either have
> blocked your caller ID or we aren't here. If your call is really
> important to us then you can leave a message. For everyone
> else, sorry for the inconvenience. We will get back to you ASAP."

> but the missus made me delete it.

Who has the balls at your place ?

> Or rather, she recorded a new message over it.

Obvious fix for that problem.

Rod Speed wrote...

> > but the missus made me delete it.
>
> Who has the balls at your place ?

She has, of course.

Whoever says that this isn't the case is either:

1. lying
2. not married
3. will never get married
4. was married
5. likes eternal conflict and grief
6. or is married to a subservient mousy type who either wears a burka or is
lousy in bed or both..

Like they say, "happy wife, happy life..."

"brian w edginton" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> ....have had a GSM service from Optus for years.
> I live in a rural area and had never had spam calls or messages.
> Recently, I was in town (Lismore NSW) on a rare visit.
> Had a voice call telling me I "might have won a $60 betting voucher".
> Terminated, immediately.
>
> A query for the techies.....is it possible that spam can be directed
> to specific geographic areas?

no.

a mobile number is a mobile number. its non geographic
s

"Snapper" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Rod Speed wrote...
>
>> > they do not seem to want to stop - I thought that there was
>> > legislation put in place to stop this type of unsolicited spam?
>>
>> Nope, just a mechanism to opt out of it if you dont want to get it.
>
> Does it work, though?

generally
>