What are the chances of getting a refund?

I've on my third faulty N80 from e2save.com. It's been about 6 weeks since I
got the first one and I'm on a one year contract with o2. I'm fed up with
the phone and o2. I'd like to see if I can return the phone and cancel the
contract. Is this likely to be possible?

Thanks

---

› See More: What are the chances of getting a refund?

"Steve" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I've on my third faulty N80 from e2save.com. It's been about 6 weeks since
> I got the first one and I'm on a one year contract with o2. I'm fed up
> with the phone and o2. I'd like to see if I can return the phone and
> cancel the contract. Is this likely to be possible?

No chance.

"Simon Ough" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "Steve" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> I've on my third faulty N80 from e2save.com. It's been about 6 weeks
>> since I got the first one and I'm on a one year contract with o2. I'm fed
>> up with the phone and o2. I'd like to see if I can return the phone and
>> cancel the contract. Is this likely to be possible?
>
> No chance.

Yep.

"Steve" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I've on my third faulty N80 from e2save.com. It's been about 6 weeks since
> I got the first one and I'm on a one year contract with o2. I'm fed up
> with the phone and o2. I'd like to see if I can return the phone and
> cancel the contract. Is this likely to be possible?
>
> Thanks
>
>

a visit to trading standards...............

[email protected] declared for all the world to hear...
> I've on my third faulty N80 from e2save.com. It's been about 6 weeks since I
> got the first one and I'm on a one year contract with o2. I'm fed up with
> the phone and o2. I'd like to see if I can return the phone and cancel the
> contract. Is this likely to be possible?

You might be able to change to a different phone but you won't be able
to cancel the contract.
--
Regards
Jon

On Wed, 5 Jul 2006 23:15:36 +0100, "Steve" <[email protected]> wrote:

>I've on my third faulty N80 from e2save.com. It's been about 6 weeks since I
>got the first one and I'm on a one year contract with o2. I'm fed up with
>the phone and o2. I'd like to see if I can return the phone and cancel the
>contract. Is this likely to be possible?
>
>Thanks

Why are you sending the phone back to them? When you should be sending
it direct to a NOKIA service center.

No chance of canceling the contract.

--
http://www.unimobiles.com | http://www.unimobiles.com/auctions
UK Specialists in Refurbished Mobile Phones & Accessories

"Unimobiles.com" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Wed, 5 Jul 2006 23:15:36 +0100, "Steve" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>I've on my third faulty N80 from e2save.com. It's been about 6 weeks since
>>I
>>got the first one and I'm on a one year contract with o2. I'm fed up with
>>the phone and o2. I'd like to see if I can return the phone and cancel the
>>contract. Is this likely to be possible?
>>
>>Thanks
>
> Why are you sending the phone back to them? When you should be sending
> it direct to a NOKIA service center.
>
> No chance of canceling the contract.

His contract is with O2 not with Nokia.

Gavin wrote:

> On Thu, 6 Jul 2006 06:45:04 +0100, "OhNo" <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
>> "Steve" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>>> I've on my third faulty N80 from e2save.com. It's been about 6 weeks since
>>> I got the first one and I'm on a one year contract with o2. I'm fed up
>>> with the phone and o2. I'd like to see if I can return the phone and
>>> cancel the contract. Is this likely to be possible?
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>>
>>>
>> a visit to trading standards...............

> on what grounds, they've replaced them when faulty.

IANAL but it seems to be that if you have been unable to make use of the
service because of the faulty phones then you have a reasonable case of
frustrated contract.

Geoff

"Geoff Winkless" <usenet-at-geoff-dot-dj@[127.0.0.1]> wrote
in message
news:[email protected]
> Gavin wrote:
>
> > On Thu, 6 Jul 2006 06:45:04 +0100, "OhNo"
> > <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> > > "Steve" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> > > news:[email protected]...
> > > > I've on my third faulty N80 from e2save.com. It's
> > > > been about 6 weeks since I got the first one and
> > > > I'm on a one year contract with o2. I'm fed up with
> > > > the phone and o2. I'd like to see if I can return
> > > > the phone and cancel the contract. Is this likely
> > > > to be possible? Thanks
> > > >
> > > >
> > > a visit to trading standards...............
>
> > on what grounds, they've replaced them when faulty.
>
> IANAL but it seems to be that if you have been unable to
> make use of the service because of the faulty phones then
> you have a reasonable case of frustrated contract.

The phone itself does not form part of most if not all mobile contracts,
hence the reason you can legally sell it from day one. You may have a case
that the goods you bought were not fit for purpose under the Sale of Goods
Act but it doesn't seem to me to be a valid reason to cancel the *airtime*
contract. They should provide you with a replacement phone, but you're
still liable for the airtime as far as I can make out.

Ivor

[email protected] declared for all the world
to hear...
> His contract is with O2 not with Nokia.

Indeed, but a Nokia service centre is the most direct and quickest route
to take to getting a repair done.
--
Regards
Jon

Ivor Jones wrote:
> "Geoff Winkless" <usenet-at-geoff-dot-dj@[127.0.0.1]> wrote
> in message
> news:[email protected]
>> Gavin wrote:
>>
>>> On Thu, 6 Jul 2006 06:45:04 +0100, "OhNo"
>>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> "Steve" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>>> news:[email protected]...
>>>>> I've on my third faulty N80 from e2save.com. It's
>>>>> been about 6 weeks since I got the first one and
>>>>> I'm on a one year contract with o2. I'm fed up with
>>>>> the phone and o2. I'd like to see if I can return
>>>>> the phone and cancel the contract. Is this likely
>>>>> to be possible? Thanks
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> a visit to trading standards...............
>>> on what grounds, they've replaced them when faulty.
>> IANAL but it seems to be that if you have been unable to
>> make use of the service because of the faulty phones then
>> you have a reasonable case of frustrated contract.
>
> The phone itself does not form part of most if not all mobile contracts,
> hence the reason you can legally sell it from day one. You may have a case
> that the goods you bought were not fit for purpose under the Sale of Goods
> Act but it doesn't seem to me to be a valid reason to cancel the *airtime*
> contract. They should provide you with a replacement phone, but you're
> still liable for the airtime as far as I can make out.
>
> Ivor

I agree that's probably correct from a technical point of view and he's
unlikely to get very far, but from a "fit for purpose"/Trading
Standards/Sale of Goods Act point of view, the contract (the purchase,
not mobile) was a single entity, a phone with particular features, and
airtime. If the handset is not fit for purpose, then the whole contract
(again, not airtime contract) is void.

The way I see it, is it's no different to having a fault with a TV with
free DVD player offer. You specify you'll take the offer but it must
work with DVD-RW discs. You get it home and find it doesn't. You take
it back to the store because it's not fit for purpose. You're fully
entitled to return the whole package including TV, not just the (free)
DVD player. The whole package formed the (purchase) contract - if any
element fails to be "fit for purpose" then you're entitled to a refund
etc. The free DVD offer may have been the only reason you took up the
deal. No DVD and you'd not have taken it. Same with the mobile - you
may have wanted a specific phone - no good saying to just get a
different model.

I suspect that the wording in the airtime contract gets them around this
- although it doesn't stop networks etc putting unfair terms into their
contracts (and if deemed to be such cannot be enforced). Remember -
your statutory rights override any contract a network may have drawn up.

Try asking in uk.legal or uk.legal.moderated - they may have a better
idea about your statutory rights - which the networks cannot override.

D

"David Hearn" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]

[snip]

> I agree that's probably correct from a technical point of
> view and he's unlikely to get very far, but from a "fit
> for purpose"/Trading Standards/Sale of Goods Act point of
> view, the contract (the purchase, not mobile) was a
> single entity, a phone with particular features, and
> airtime. If the handset is not fit for purpose, then
> the whole contract (again, not airtime contract) is void.

I don't see that there is a "whole" contract as such. You buy the phone,
you sign an airtime contract. The phone does *not* form part of the
contract that you sign, that is for the airtime only.

I may be wrong of course, but that's how it looks to me.

Ivor

Ivor Jones wrote:

> "David Hearn" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]
>
> [snip]
>
>> I agree that's probably correct from a technical point of
>> view and he's unlikely to get very far, but from a "fit
>> for purpose"/Trading Standards/Sale of Goods Act point of
>> view, the contract (the purchase, not mobile) was a
>> single entity, a phone with particular features, and
>> airtime. If the handset is not fit for purpose, then
>> the whole contract (again, not airtime contract) is void.
>
> I don't see that there is a "whole" contract as such. You buy the phone,
> you sign an airtime contract. The phone does *not* form part of the
> contract that you sign, that is for the airtime only.
>
> I may be wrong of course, but that's how it looks to me.

IMO the phone forms part of the consideration and is therefore
implicitly part of the contract.

Of course if the shop gives you an approximately-equally-capable phone
while yours is repaired then you have no case.

The advice to ask in uk.legal is good though.

Geoff

"Geoff Winkless" <usenet-at-geoff-dot-dj@[127.0.0.1]> wrote
in message
news:[email protected]

[snip]

> IMO the phone forms part of the consideration and is
> therefore implicitly part of the contract.

The contract of the purchase, not the *airtime* contract, that is a
different entity. As I see it you can throw the phone back under the Sale
of Goods Act and say "give me one that works" but the airtime is a
different matter.

Personally I wouldn't touch a contract these days, I buy my own phones and
use PAYG SIMs.

Ivor

Ivor Jones wrote:
> "Geoff Winkless" <usenet-at-geoff-dot-dj@[127.0.0.1]> wrote
> in message
> news:[email protected]
>
> [snip]
>
>> IMO the phone forms part of the consideration and is
>> therefore implicitly part of the contract.
>
> The contract of the purchase, not the *airtime* contract, that is a
> different entity. As I see it you can throw the phone back under the Sale
> of Goods Act and say "give me one that works" but the airtime is a
> different matter.

The purchase/transaction contract is "I will buy this phone and get this
airtime". If the phone is returned under SoGA then the original
transaction should (morally?) be 'rolled back' to return the 'purchaser'
to the original state they were in before the transaction occurred
(subject to paying for the airtime/minutes used).

I would argue that it is a single transaction because you cannot get the
phone (for the price paid) without the contract. They are tied together.

And with regard to replacing a handset with a similar model being
satisfactory - is this legal (I've no idea)? If that device is
inherently faulty (or not fit for purpose), then no identical
replacement will be possible. For some people they will accept a
different model of handset - but ultimately, if to the purchaser - no
suitable replacements are satisfactory (lack of features, size,
specification etc) then are they forced to accept a different handset.

Again, if they're not forced to accept a different handset, then surely
returning the handset under the SoGA and not accepting a different model
as replacement, should (I would suggest) require the airtime contract to
be cancelled.

D