Improving Mobile Phone Reception in Car

Greetings,

I happily use an Orange Nokia 6310i in my Fiat Stilo, connected via a
CARK-91 cradle etc. It has a 10cm rubberised roof-mounted aerial* cabled
directly to the CARK-91 control unit, but this isn't always sufficient to
maintain reliable signal strength in rural areas (mainly Northern England).

Is there any merit in replacing the roof aerial with a longer/better one? I
know next to nothing about RF or telecoms, but it seems to me that the
emergency services must use those long steel whip antennae for some reason?
I'm not worried about appearances as long as it's tidy, and would consider
any other affordable solution (multiple aerials, RF amplifiers, witchcraft
....?)

* Photo's at http://tinyurl.com/2uqgqc, http://tinyurl.com/3yb7ag,
http://tinyurl.com/37hffn in case they mean anything to expert viewers. Was
installed by Orange technicians along with the CARK-91 etc approx 3yrs ago,
they told me it would give a better signal than the stick-on window version.

Comments & advice would be greatly appreciated -
(NB - FU's set to uk.telecom.mobile)

Many thanks -
Steve

---

› See More: Improving Mobile Phone Reception in Car

"Steve Walker" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Greetings,
>
> I happily use an Orange Nokia 6310i in my Fiat Stilo, connected via a
> CARK-91 cradle etc. It has a 10cm rubberised roof-mounted aerial* cabled
> directly to the CARK-91 control unit, but this isn't always sufficient to
> maintain reliable signal strength in rural areas (mainly Northern
> England).
>
> Is there any merit in replacing the roof aerial with a longer/better one?
> I know next to nothing about RF or telecoms, but it seems to me that the
> emergency services must use those long steel whip antennae for some
> reason? I'm not worried about appearances as long as it's tidy, and would
> consider any other affordable solution (multiple aerials, RF amplifiers,
> witchcraft ...?)
>
> * Photo's at http://tinyurl.com/2uqgqc, http://tinyurl.com/3yb7ag,
> http://tinyurl.com/37hffn in case they mean anything to expert viewers.
> Was installed by Orange technicians along with the CARK-91 etc approx 3yrs
> ago, they told me it would give a better signal than the stick-on window
> version.
>
> Comments & advice would be greatly appreciated -
> (NB - FU's set to uk.telecom.mobile)

IIRC Aerial length is calculated according to the wavelength of the
transmission. It's not a longer, but a more efficient aerial that you want.

Doki wrote:
> "Steve Walker" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> Greetings,
>>
>> I happily use an Orange Nokia 6310i in my Fiat Stilo, connected via a
>> CARK-91 cradle etc. It has a 10cm rubberised roof-mounted aerial*
>> cabled directly to the CARK-91 control unit, but this isn't always
>> sufficient to maintain reliable signal strength in rural areas
>> (mainly Northern England).

> IIRC Aerial length is calculated according to the wavelength of the
> transmission. It's not a longer, but a more efficient aerial that you
> want.

Thanks Doki - I know that Orange use 1800MHz, and I dimly recall that an
efficient aerial has to match the freq by fractions (eg 1/4 wavelength or
whatever). I haven't seen any mobile aerials advertised with this info
though - they seem to be sold without technical data.

Steve Walker <[email protected]> wrote:

> Greetings,
>
> I happily use an Orange Nokia 6310i in my Fiat Stilo, connected via a
> CARK-91 cradle etc. It has a 10cm rubberised roof-mounted aerial* cabled
> directly to the CARK-91 control unit, but this isn't always sufficient to
> maintain reliable signal strength in rural areas (mainly Northern England).
>
> Is there any merit in replacing the roof aerial with a longer/better one? I
> know next to nothing about RF or telecoms, but it seems to me that the
> emergency services must use those long steel whip antennae for some reason?
> I'm not worried about appearances as long as it's tidy, and would consider
> any other affordable solution (multiple aerials, RF amplifiers, witchcraft
> ...?)

Not much you can do other than to try other networks.

On the whole, mobile coverage in the UK is ****e - especially in
comparison with most other European countries.
--
SteveH 'You're not a real petrolhead unless you've owned an Alfa Romeo'
www.italiancar.co.uk - Honda VFR800 - Hongdou GY200 - Alfa 75 TSpark
Alfa 156 TSpark - B6 Passat 2.0TDI SE - COSOC KOTL
BOTAFOT #87 - BOTAFOF #18 - MRO # - UKRMSBC #7 - Apostle #2 - YTC #

When parked up in a weak signal area you could compare the signal strength
with the phone in the cradle with it out of the cradle and in your hand
(inside the car) just to eliminate the (unlikely) possibility of there being
a problem with the antenna/cable/&connections.
The antenna should be vertical and ideally in the middle of the roof.
Getting a larger aeriel will IMO do little if anything to help.
One thing you may have more success with is to compare the network coverages
in the areas in which you travel and possible use a dual simm or two mobiles
on the optimum networks.

J
"Steve Walker" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Greetings,
>
> I happily use an Orange Nokia 6310i in my Fiat Stilo, connected via a
> CARK-91 cradle etc. It has a 10cm rubberised roof-mounted aerial* cabled
> directly to the CARK-91 control unit, but this isn't always sufficient to
> maintain reliable signal strength in rural areas (mainly Northern
> England).
>
> Is there any merit in replacing the roof aerial with a longer/better one?
> I know next to nothing about RF or telecoms, but it seems to me that the
> emergency services must use those long steel whip antennae for some
> reason? I'm not worried about appearances as long as it's tidy, and would
> consider any other affordable solution (multiple aerials, RF amplifiers,
> witchcraft ...?)
>
> * Photo's at http://tinyurl.com/2uqgqc, http://tinyurl.com/3yb7ag,
> http://tinyurl.com/37hffn in case they mean anything to expert viewers.
> Was installed by Orange technicians along with the CARK-91 etc approx 3yrs
> ago, they told me it would give a better signal than the stick-on window
> version.
>
> Comments & advice would be greatly appreciated -
> (NB - FU's set to uk.telecom.mobile)
>
> Many thanks -
> Steve
>
>




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"Steve Walker" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Greetings,
>
> I happily use an Orange Nokia 6310i in my Fiat Stilo, connected via a
> CARK-91 cradle etc. It has a 10cm rubberised roof-mounted aerial* cabled
> directly to the CARK-91 control unit, but this isn't always sufficient to
> maintain reliable signal strength in rural areas (mainly Northern
> England).
>
> Is there any merit in replacing the roof aerial with a longer/better one?
> I know next to nothing about RF or telecoms, but it seems to me that the
> emergency services must use those long steel whip antennae for some
> reason? I'm not worried about appearances as long as it's tidy, and would
> consider any other affordable solution (multiple aerials, RF amplifiers,
> witchcraft ...?)
>
> * Photo's at http://tinyurl.com/2uqgqc, http://tinyurl.com/3yb7ag,
> http://tinyurl.com/37hffn in case they mean anything to expert viewers.
> Was installed by Orange technicians along with the CARK-91 etc approx 3yrs
> ago, they told me it would give a better signal than the stick-on window
> version.
>


There's a fixed relationship between the length of the antenna and the
operating frequency - the emergency services have longer antennas as they
use lower frequencies than your Orange Mobile.

I would suggest getting the installation checked by someone competent before
doing anything else.

Also contary to popular belief, the antenna will work better if vertical and
not swept back at an angle. May look sporty but does nothing for the
performance!

Tony wrote:

> Also contary to popular belief, the antenna will work better if
> vertical and not swept back at an angle. May look sporty but does
> nothing for the performance!

Thanks Tony, that's a small improvement at least!

On Sat, 27 Jan 2007 17:21:33 -0000, "Doki" <[email protected]> wrote:

>IIRC Aerial length is calculated according to the wavelength of the
>transmission. It's not a longer, but a more efficient aerial that you want.

That's true and at 1,800 megs a quarter wave whip is just a few cms
long (about 4 IIAC) . Aerials improve their performance (gain) by
looking at a smaller area of sky. Some police cars have aerials for
the car "tracker" system which work on a different (Much lower)
frequency entirely.

It's easiest to understand by considering a transmitting aerial. A
parabolic dish can focus a the transmitted radio energy down to a
narrow high intensity beam just like the reflector in a flashlight.
However since the whole transmission path including aerials is passive
the reciprocity theorem applies and what goes to make a high gain
transmitting aerial also makes a high gain receiving aerial.

But higher gain is achieved by making the aerial more directional. For
this reason not very much can usefully be done to increase the gain on
a car mobile antenna, you don't want to lose the signal because you've
turned a corner and the antenna is looking away from the transmitter.

The gain can be increased by trimming the response in a skyward
direction well above the horizon where you lnow the transmitter is not
going to be, to the benefit of response closer to the horizon 360
degress around the car, but it's not going to make a lot of difference
and there'll be losses in the extra cabling and connectors. Presumably
the OP's add on external antenna has already done that.

TBH was surprised the OP is having a lot of trouble in North
Yorkshire. I live in Leeds and can drive to Aberdeen via either
Edinburgh or Glasgow via the A66 without getting a problem. OTOH my
daughter lived in a flat in the centre of Lancaster where the signal
strength was zilch. Nothing we could do about it. There are obviously
odd areas with little or no signal.

Is it just one or two bad locations?.

So, to the OP I'd say don't try throwing money at this problem a
solution may not exist other than changing networks.

DG

Derek Geldard wrote:

> So, to the OP I'd say don't try throwing money at this problem a
> solution may not exist other than changing networks.

Thanks Derek -

I'll try a PAYG with another network, see if that's any better.

"Steve Walker" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Greetings,
>
> I happily use an Orange Nokia 6310i in my Fiat Stilo, connected via a
> CARK-91 cradle etc. It has a 10cm rubberised roof-mounted aerial* cabled
> directly to the CARK-91 control unit, but this isn't always sufficient to
> maintain reliable signal strength in rural areas (mainly Northern
> England).
>
> Is there any merit in replacing the roof aerial with a longer/better one?
> I know next to nothing about RF or telecoms, but it seems to me that the
> emergency services must use those long steel whip antennae for some
> reason? I'm not worried about appearances as long as it's tidy, and would
> consider any other affordable solution (multiple aerials, RF amplifiers,
> witchcraft ...?)
>
> * Photo's at http://tinyurl.com/2uqgqc, http://tinyurl.com/3yb7ag,
> http://tinyurl.com/37hffn in case they mean anything to expert viewers.
> Was installed by Orange technicians along with the CARK-91 etc approx 3yrs
> ago, they told me it would give a better signal than the stick-on window
> version.
>
>
Try Peter Parry he's UKTMs expert on mobile aerials
http://www.wppltd.demon.co.uk/WPP/wpp.html#FirstPage

A 6310i on a CARK 91 with external aerial is about the best you can do

My guess is an 1800MHz high gain colinear on your mobile mount
will make the difference, also Peter sells at a very reasonable price
bidirectional mobile amps for 1800MHz GSM.

Steve Terry

Steve Terry wrote:

> Try Peter Parry he's UKTMs expert on mobile aerials
> http://www.wppltd.demon.co.uk/WPP/wpp.html#FirstPage
>
> A 6310i on a CARK 91 with external aerial is about the best you can do
>
> My guess is an 1800MHz high gain colinear on your mobile mount
> will make the difference, also Peter sells at a very reasonable price
> bidirectional mobile amps for 1800MHz GSM.

Thanks Steve - much interesting reading, esp:
http://www.wppltd.demon.co.uk/WPP/Pr...cessories.html

Simple, change to T Mobile. Sorted.


"Steve Walker" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Greetings,
>
> I happily use an Orange Nokia 6310i in my Fiat Stilo, connected via a
> CARK-91 cradle etc. It has a 10cm rubberised roof-mounted aerial* cabled
> directly to the CARK-91 control unit, but this isn't always sufficient to
> maintain reliable signal strength in rural areas (mainly Northern
> England).
>
> Is there any merit in replacing the roof aerial with a longer/better one?
> I know next to nothing about RF or telecoms, but it seems to me that the
> emergency services must use those long steel whip antennae for some
> reason? I'm not worried about appearances as long as it's tidy, and would
> consider any other affordable solution (multiple aerials, RF amplifiers,
> witchcraft ...?)
>
> * Photo's at http://tinyurl.com/2uqgqc, http://tinyurl.com/3yb7ag,
> http://tinyurl.com/37hffn in case they mean anything to expert viewers.
> Was installed by Orange technicians along with the CARK-91 etc approx 3yrs
> ago, they told me it would give a better signal than the stick-on window
> version.
>
> Comments & advice would be greatly appreciated -
> (NB - FU's set to uk.telecom.mobile)
>
> Many thanks -
> Steve
>

"Steve Walker" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Steve Terry wrote:
>
>> Try Peter Parry he's UKTMs expert on mobile aerials
>> http://www.wppltd.demon.co.uk/WPP/wpp.html#FirstPage
>>
>> A 6310i on a CARK 91 with external aerial is about the best you can do
>>
>> My guess is an 1800MHz high gain colinear on your mobile mount
>> will make the difference, also Peter sells at a very reasonable price
>> bidirectional mobile amps for 1800MHz GSM.
>
> Thanks Steve - much interesting reading, esp:
> http://www.wppltd.demon.co.uk/WPP/Pr...cessories.html
>
Peter must be away or he would have replied to this thread by now,
he's a regular contributor to this group.

Anyway give him an email, he'll sort you out the best aerial,
and at only 40quid you might as well go for a Allgon amp
to stick inline with your CARK91 aerial feed

Steve Terry

<[email protected]> wrote:

> [email protected] (SteveH) wrote in message
> <1hsm1xu.enn8h073f4qqN%[email protected]>:
>
> >On the whole, mobile coverage in the UK is ****e - especially in
> >comparison with most other European countries.
>
> Rubbish.

I lose my signal almost everywhere in South Wales.

In the depths of Portugal, I can't remember where I've lost my signal.

Most of my working week I'm out of reach at the moment.
--
SteveH 'You're not a real petrolhead unless you've owned an Alfa Romeo'
www.italiancar.co.uk - Honda VFR800 - Hongdou GY200 - Alfa 75 TSpark
Alfa 156 TSpark - B6 Passat 2.0TDI SE - COSOC KOTL
BOTAFOT #87 - BOTAFOF #18 - MRO # - UKRMSBC #7 - Apostle #2 - YTC #

In message <1hsmbi0.1rfcnwh1hw7lpnN%[email protected]>, SteveH
<[email protected]> writes

>I lose my signal almost everywhere in South Wales.

Because it's full of valleys and the sheep do not make enough calls to
justify more masts

>In the depths of Portugal, I can't remember where I've lost my signal.

Flatter with more affluent and chatty sheep

>Most of my working week I'm out of reach at the moment.

Much to the relief of everyone in your phone book ;-)
--
Gyp
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