Contacting Orange?

Does anyone have a contact telephone number for Orange, that has
intelligent life on the other end?
My wife wants to upgrade from Everyday 50 to a current tarriff, with a
new phone (Nokia N73).
If she went as a new custoner the phone would be free, but as an upgrade
it's £150. No-one wants to discuss this!!

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› See More: Contacting Orange?

John Moppett wrote:
> Does anyone have a contact telephone number for Orange, that has
> intelligent life on the other end?
> My wife wants to upgrade from Everyday 50 to a current tarriff, with a
> new phone (Nokia N73).
> If she went as a new custoner the phone would be free, but as an upgrade
> it's £150. No-one wants to discuss this!!

1.) Get PAC from Orange.
2.) Transfer existing number to disposable, free, non-Orange PAYG service.
3.) Order new N73 for free on a new contract (with new number).
4.) 30 days after PAC was issued, get PAC from new PAYG service for old
number.
5.) Provide PAC to Orange and get old number transferred to new contract.

Hey presto, you've got it for free (with a bit of hassle.)

D

In message <[email protected]>, John Moppett
<[email protected]> writes
>Does anyone have a contact telephone number for Orange, that has
>intelligent life on the other end?
>My wife wants to upgrade from Everyday 50 to a current tarriff, with a
>new phone (Nokia N73).
>If she went as a new custoner the phone would be free, but as an
>upgrade it's £150. No-one wants to discuss this!!

Why not just contact them and ask for a PAC. That will get their
attention and if they don't make a decent offer go elsewhere. Most
companies, including Orange, seem to welcome new customers with special
deals (although you can normally do even better through the various
mobile web sites) but couldn't care less about their existing customers
despite what they say.
--
Paul Harris

Paul Harris wrote:
> In message <[email protected]>, John Moppett
> <[email protected]> writes
>> Does anyone have a contact telephone number for Orange, that has
>> intelligent life on the other end?
>> My wife wants to upgrade from Everyday 50 to a current tarriff, with a
>> new phone (Nokia N73).
>> If she went as a new custoner the phone would be free, but as an
>> upgrade it's £150. No-one wants to discuss this!!
>
> Why not just contact them and ask for a PAC. That will get their
> attention and if they don't make a decent offer go elsewhere. Most
> companies, including Orange, seem to welcome new customers with special
> deals (although you can normally do even better through the various
> mobile web sites) but couldn't care less about their existing customers
> despite what they say.

The ironic thing is that Orange make a great thing about how they look
after existing customers!!
I wrote an e-mail to them, in my wife's name, asking them to sort this
out, or give me a PAC. 24 hours later - no reply.
I really don't think they care!!

In message <[email protected]>, John Moppett
<[email protected]> writes
>Paul Harris wrote:

>> Why not just contact them and ask for a PAC. That will get their
>>attention and if they don't make a decent offer go elsewhere. Most
>>companies, including Orange, seem to welcome new customers with
>>special deals (although you can normally do even better through the
>>various mobile web sites) but couldn't care less about their existing
>>customers despite what they say.
>
>The ironic thing is that Orange make a great thing about how they look
>after existing customers!!

They certainly do but having been in a similar situation I found that
they don't deliver on what they say about existing customers and so I am
now an ex-customer.

>I wrote an e-mail to them, in my wife's name, asking them to sort this
>out, or give me a PAC. 24 hours later - no reply.
>I really don't think they care!!

I think that you will find that it takes something nearer to a couple of
days before a PAC gets issued let alone sent to you.
--
Paul Harris

About 6 months ago I was looking to upgrade with Orange so gave them a ring.

About two weeks before, my daughter, who was just about to upgrade with them
for the first time after a 12 month contract, was offered a great deal
compared to the one I had for the same price as I was paying. It was
something like 500 free minutes cross network and a 1000 free texts for lets
say £35. I was on something like 300 minutes plus about 300 free texts for
the same price. She also got the phone she wanted - Samsung D900 if I
remember correctly.

Anyway, when I made contact, I was offered exactly the same deal as I was on
already. I told the salesperson about my daughters' deal and that she was
just starting the second year with them whereas I was a customer of 8 years.
The person said "Loyalty doesn't mean anything".

I was absolutely gobsmacked. Payments for the rental and any extra minutes
used went out by direct debit on time, every time. I asked for my PAC code
which arrived within a few days and I changed to O2 for a better deal but I
lost out on coverage in my home area. I like cycling, fishing and generally
being out and about in the countryside but O2's signal is abysmal/non
existent. Orange, after many letters from me over several years eventually
erected a transmitter about 200 metres from a location that I had suggested
they put one and they just blitzed a previously signal free area and, as a
result, have benefited from many new subscribers. None of the other
providers have followed their lead.

I did send a letter to Orange, which they acknowledged, saying that the
operator was spoken to but I think the problem was not the salesperson (she
was probably following given guidelines). I further know that when you do
phone customer services and select the option where you are "thinking of
leaving" Orange, you are connected to an external company - agents for
Orange. The reason I know this is that when I started my last 18 month
contract with Orange, I did so at the same time as my wife. We were offered
(what we thought was) a good deal with half line rental for the first six
months. We had to fight to get the discount four months down the line and
Orange blamed the company who upgraded us. It was admitted that it wasn't
their upgrade team I spoke to even though I had phoned Orange customer
services. Furthermore, extra texts that my wife opted for appeared on my
agreement.

Absolute shambles - but if coverage in my area doesn't improve, I think I
will have to go back to them but at least I will be starting again afresh -
or will I???

[email protected] declared for all the world to hear...
> Does anyone have a contact telephone number for Orange, that has
> intelligent life on the other end?
> My wife wants to upgrade from Everyday 50 to a current tarriff, with a
> new phone (Nokia N73).
> If she went as a new custoner the phone would be free, but as an upgrade
> it's £150. No-one wants to discuss this!!

Whats you're wifes average bill? If it's below £20 there won't be any
room for negotiation. Sign her up as a new customer. if you want to get
a cheap deal.

If she continues to spend low though it will be the same scenario again
in 12-18 months time.
--
Regards
Jon

[email protected] declared for all the world to hear...
> The ironic thing is that Orange make a great thing about how they look
> after existing customers!!

If you spend enough money. SOme customers simply are not worth hanging
on to.

> I wrote an e-mail to them, in my wife's name, asking them to sort this
> out, or give me a PAC. 24 hours later - no reply.
> I really don't think they care!!

You wont get info like that over email, it's not secure enough.
--
Regards
Jon

[email protected] declared for all the world to hear...
> Their loss.

Not really. Vodafone have subsidised you £200 more than orange were
prepared to, because orange would not have made enough from you to
justify that.

At the end of your current contract when you ask vodafone for a £600
handset for nothing, they will probably come to the same conclusion and
wave goodbye to you.

It's all about the money.
--
Regards
Jon

[email protected] declared for all the world to hear...
> You miss my point, I could have got the same phone on Orange free if I
> wasn't an existing customer but a new customer. The phone was free on
> a new contract with a similarly priced tariff to what I was on.

It is you who misses the point sir.

As a new customer the network has no idea how much you're going to spend
and weighs in with a heavy subsidy just in case. Because all networks do
this as time goes on the subsidy keeps going up and up as they all try
and fall over themselves to acquire "new" customers.

Having had a spending history on you it's very easy to accurately
calculate how much subsidy you are "worth" and offer you an upgrade
based on that.
--
Regards
Jon

Jon wrote:
> [email protected] declared for all the world to hear...
>> You miss my point, I could have got the same phone on Orange free if I
>> wasn't an existing customer but a new customer. The phone was free on
>> a new contract with a similarly priced tariff to what I was on.
>
> It is you who misses the point sir.
>
> As a new customer the network has no idea how much you're going to spend
> and weighs in with a heavy subsidy just in case. Because all networks do
> this as time goes on the subsidy keeps going up and up as they all try
> and fall over themselves to acquire "new" customers.
>
> Having had a spending history on you it's very easy to accurately
> calculate how much subsidy you are "worth" and offer you an upgrade
> based on that.

Yet they seem to have never considered (or more correctly, implemented)
a system whereby an ex-customer (or current customer) takes out a new
contract to bypass this upgrade nonsense.

If they were that set on assessing customers' 'value' to the company,
then they'd start to look at ex-customers returning and change the
subsidy according to their previous spend.

That may not be easy to implement as I assume resellers get a fixed
commission for a particular contract. Maybe the number of customers
actually doing this is low, compared to the number who willingly pay
quite strange upgrade fees.

D

Ivor Jones wrote:
> "David Hearn" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]
>
> [snip]
>
> : : Yet they seem to have never considered (or more
> : : correctly, implemented) a system whereby an ex-customer
> : : (or current customer) takes out a new contract to
> : : bypass this upgrade nonsense.
> : :
> : : If they were that set on assessing customers' 'value'
> : : to the company, then they'd start to look at
> : : ex-customers returning and change the subsidy according
> : : to their previous spend.
> : :
> : : That may not be easy to implement as I assume resellers
> : : get a fixed commission for a particular contract.
> : : Maybe the number of customers actually doing this is
> : : low, compared to the number who willingly pay quite
> : : strange upgrade fees.
>
> Of course we could always have a system whereby people paid realistic
> prices for phones and calls and do away with all this "free" this and
> "cashback" that nonsense.
>
>
> Ivor

You mean like the iPhone? Exact same contract prices and benefits as a
subsidised phone, and you have to pay full whack for the handset as well?

You really think that the networks will actually offer a serious
discount to line rental prices in exchange for no handset subsidy?
They'll offer a tiny discount and swallow the rest. ARPU is all
important and excludes one off charges (ie. activation fees, handset
costs and subsidies), only including recurring charges (eg. line rental
etc). By having a higher monthly line rental, they can claim higher
ARPUs which make them appear good to the markets. If they reduced their
line rentals (and reduced their subsidy) then their ARPU would drop.

Mobile networks are already doing this by moving to 18 month contracts.
Handsets (and subsidy) is likely, over time, to remain or return to 12
month levels even though they're guaranteeing the customer for longer,
and spreading the cost of the handset/subsidy over a longer period.

T-Mobile do a £5 per month discount for forgoing a handset upgrade (but
still extending the contract). At worst case 18 month contract would
save 18 * £5 = £90. Is that really the level of subsidy T-Mobile
provide to handsets?

D

[email protected] declared for all the world to hear...
> Yet they seem to have never considered (or more correctly, implemented)
> a system whereby an ex-customer (or current customer) takes out a new
> contract to bypass this upgrade nonsense.

If they did, such a system would work to the detriment of someone doing
a ditch 'n' stitch to try and get a handset cheaper. Imagine going to
get a new phone, giving your details and being told "ah, we know you
only spend £15 a month therefore we're going to charge you £200 for the
N95."

> If they were that set on assessing customers' 'value' to the company,
> then they'd start to look at ex-customers returning and change the
> subsidy according to their previous spend.

If the spend is high enough offers will be made to retain the custom. If
spend is not high enough no offers will be made. If networks used
historical data for returning customers (I.e. customers with low spend)
then it would work against them!

> That may not be easy to implement as I assume resellers get a fixed
> commission for a particular contract. Maybe the number of customers
> actually doing this is low, compared to the number who willingly pay
> quite strange upgrade fees.

You would only have to pay silly fees if you're not spending enough with
that network. The N95 is an exception as it has a very high trade cost,
and can only be given away free (with a profit for the dealer) on very
big contracts.
--
Regards
Jon

[email protected]lid declared for all the world to hear...
> Of course we could always have a system whereby people paid realistic
> prices for phones and calls and do away with all this "free" this and
> "cashback" that nonsense.

A sensible idea, but one which will never happen in the UK in the
forseeable future.
--
Regards
Jon

[email protected] declared for all the world to hear...
> On Fri, 24 Aug 2007 20:50:31 +0100, Jon <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
> >[email protected] declared for all the world to hear...
> >> You mean like the iPhone? Exact same contract prices and benefits as a
> >> subsidised phone, and you have to pay full whack for the handset as well?
> >
> >Dream on. The iPhone will be free when it launches. It's nothing
> >special.
>
> Doubtful, Apple are insisting it will not be subsidised and they get
> 10% of the monthy revinue.
>
> Give it 6 months and it will probably be free, but not at launch.
>
> http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2007/08...networks_deal/

If it's not subsidised it won't sell in the uk. Especially as it's not a
remarkable handset.

--
Regards
Jon