The future of CDMA and EV-DO now in doubt.

Verizon and Sprint telecoms network are based on Qualcomm technology
and the courts have just ruled against Qualcomm BIG TIME for patent
infringement. No more chips with Qualcomm EV-DO chip designs starting
in 2009. They can ship during 2008 but the telcoms must pay a royalty
for each phone imported which will drive up the price of any new
Verizon or Sprint phone.

This is in effect a big blow to non GSM networks located in the USA.
Plus Qualcomm will immediately not be allowed to ship any more
advanced WCDMA chips locking Qualcomm's advanced CDMA technology out
of high speed data beyond 3 EV-DO as I understand it.

http://www.reuters.com/article/techn...technologyNews

also

http://stocks.us.reuters.com/stocks/...?symbol=QCOM.O

Verizon signed an agreement with Broadcom where they agreed to pay
through the nose to still be able to import phones with Qualcomm chips
last August.

This is incredible to have your chip supplier castrated and leaving
your own future in uncharted territory. Verizon and Sprint have far
more than a little iPhone to worry about now. One article mentioned
that they would move to have the US government declare an emergency
and over turn the ruling.

What ever happens this is fascinating.

---

› See More: The future of CDMA and EV-DO now in doubt.

4phun <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:

> Verizon and Sprint telecoms network are based on Qualcomm technology
> and the courts have just ruled against Qualcomm BIG TIME for patent
> infringement. No more chips with Qualcomm EV-DO chip designs starting
> in 2009. They can ship during 2008 but the telcoms must pay a royalty
> for each phone imported which will drive up the price of any new
> Verizon or Sprint phone.
>
> This is in effect a big blow to non GSM networks located in the USA.
> Plus Qualcomm will immediately not be allowed to ship any more
> advanced WCDMA chips locking Qualcomm's advanced CDMA technology out
> of high speed data beyond 3 EV-DO as I understand it.
>
> http://www.reuters.com/article/techn...3420071231?fee
> dType=RSS&feedName=technologyNews
>
> also
>
> http://stocks.us.reuters.com/stocks/...?symbol=QCOM.O
>
> Verizon signed an agreement with Broadcom where they agreed to pay
> through the nose to still be able to import phones with Qualcomm chips
> last August.
>
> This is incredible to have your chip supplier castrated and leaving
> your own future in uncharted territory. Verizon and Sprint have far
> more than a little iPhone to worry about now. One article mentioned
> that they would move to have the US government declare an emergency
> and over turn the ruling.
>
> What ever happens this is fascinating.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

Actually , with Verizon already having signed a deal with Broadcom (and the
amount hardly qualifies as paying through the nose) and Sprint rumored to
be close to agreement with Broadcom, this is almost a non-issue.

But thanks for proving once again what a clueless moron you are.

"4phun" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Verizon and Sprint telecoms network are based on Qualcomm technology
> and the courts have just ruled against Qualcomm BIG TIME for patent
> infringement. No more chips with Qualcomm EV-DO chip designs starting
> in 2009. They can ship during 2008 but the telcoms must pay a royalty
> for each phone imported which will drive up the price of any new
> Verizon or Sprint phone.
>
> This is in effect a big blow to non GSM networks located in the USA.
> Plus Qualcomm will immediately not be allowed to ship any more
> advanced WCDMA chips locking Qualcomm's advanced CDMA technology out
> of high speed data beyond 3 EV-DO as I understand it.
>
> http://www.reuters.com/article/techn...technologyNews
>
> also
>
> http://stocks.us.reuters.com/stocks/...?symbol=QCOM.O
>
> Verizon signed an agreement with Broadcom where they agreed to pay
> through the nose to still be able to import phones with Qualcomm chips
> last August.
>
> This is incredible to have your chip supplier castrated and leaving
> your own future in uncharted territory. Verizon and Sprint have far
> more than a little iPhone to worry about now. One article mentioned
> that they would move to have the US government declare an emergency
> and over turn the ruling.
>
> What ever happens this is fascinating.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>


Key words in the above... "as I understand it"......

Obviously - you (4phun) don't.

4phun wrote:
> What ever happens this is fascinating.

True, some fantasies are fascinating.

On Jan 1, 2:51 pm, "Ness-Net" <[email protected]> wrote:
> "4phun" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>
> news:[email protected]...
>
> > Verizon and Sprint telecoms network are based on Qualcomm technology
> > and the courts have just ruled against Qualcomm BIG TIME for patent
> > infringement. No more chips with Qualcomm EV-DO chip designs starting
> > in 2009. They can ship during 2008 but the telcoms must pay a royalty
> > for each phone imported which will drive up the price of any new
> > Verizon or Sprint phone.
>
> > This is in effect a big blow to non GSM networks located in the USA.
> > Plus Qualcomm will immediately not be allowed to ship any more
> > advanced WCDMA chips locking Qualcomm's advanced CDMA technology out
> > of high speed data beyond 3 EV-DO as I understand it.
>
> >http://www.reuters.com/article/techn...063420071231?f...
>
> > also
>
> >http://stocks.us.reuters.com/stocks/...?symbol=QCOM.O
>
> > Verizon signed an agreement with Broadcom where they agreed to pay
> > through the nose to still be able to import phones with Qualcomm chips
> > last August.
>
> > This is incredible to have your chip supplier castrated and leaving
> > your own future in uncharted territory. Verizon and Sprint have far
> > more than a little iPhone to worry about now. One article mentioned
> > that they would move to have the US government declare an emergency
> > and over turn the ruling.
>
> > What ever happens this is fascinating.
>
> Key words in the above... "as I understand it"......
>
> Obviously - you (4phun) don't.

Interesting, no one here seems to care enough to research the subject.
I just noticed that Qualcomm was also permanently banned from
supporting the stuff they have already sold in the USA effective
immediately. This related to all that 'high speed' EV-DO CDMA
Qualcomm technology now used by Verizon and Sprint and others like
them.

Stick your head in the sand but a lot of people just got screwed and
they do not realize it yet.

Verizon has taken an unpleasant hit that will affect their future.

4phun <[email protected]> wrote in
news:fd857c2e-6794-4a90-99cd-0ac799960f3c@r60g2000hsc.googlegroups.com:

> On Jan 1, 2:51 pm, "Ness-Net" <[email protected]> wrote:
>> "4phun" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>
>> news:965a899f-949b-41fc-bbcb-1f7cc47e8317
@s8g2000prg.googlegroups.com.
>> ..
>>
>> > Verizon and Sprint telecoms network are based on Qualcomm
>> > technology and the courts have just ruled against Qualcomm BIG TIME
>> > for patent infringement. No more chips with Qualcomm EV-DO chip
>> > designs starting in 2009. They can ship during 2008 but the telcoms
>> > must pay a royalty for each phone imported which will drive up the
>> > price of any new Verizon or Sprint phone.
>>
>> > This is in effect a big blow to non GSM networks located in the
>> > USA. Plus Qualcomm will immediately not be allowed to ship any more
>> > advanced WCDMA chips locking Qualcomm's advanced CDMA technology
>> > out of high speed data beyond 3 EV-DO as I understand it.
>>
>> >http://www.reuters.com/article/techn...9063420071231?
f
>> >...
>>
>> > also
>>
>> >http://stocks.us.reuters.com/stocks/..*****iption.asp?
symbol=QCOM.O
>>
>> > Verizon signed an agreement with Broadcom where they agreed to pay
>> > through the nose to still be able to import phones with Qualcomm
>> > chips last August.
>>
>> > This is incredible to have your chip supplier castrated and leaving
>> > your own future in uncharted territory. Verizon and Sprint have far
>> > more than a little iPhone to worry about now. One article mentioned
>> > that they would move to have the US government declare an emergency
>> > and over turn the ruling.
>>
>> > What ever happens this is fascinating.
>>
>> Key words in the above... "as I understand it"......
>>
>> Obviously - you (4phun) don't.
>
> Interesting, no one here seems to care enough to research the subject.

Yeah- having a real life just sucks sometimes.

> I just noticed that Qualcomm was also permanently banned from
> supporting the stuff they have already sold in the USA effective
> immediately. This related to all that 'high speed' EV-DO CDMA
> Qualcomm technology now used by Verizon and Sprint and others like
> them.

Except that the Broadcom deal Verizon signed (and Sprint will soon sign)
makes provision for that support, tardboy.

>
> Stick your head in the sand but a lot of people just got screwed and
> they do not realize it yet.

Why don't you stick your head somewhere else and realize that you are
reporting inaccurate fanboi opinion, not fact.

>
> Verizon has taken an unpleasant hit that will affect their future.
>

Where is the reaction on Wall St?

4phun <[email protected]> wrote in news:fd857c2e-6794-4a90-99cd-
[email protected]:

> Stick your head in the sand but a lot of people just got screwed and
> they do not realize it yet.
>
> Verizon has taken an unpleasant hit that will affect their future.
>

AS you may have notice, I'm no "friend of Verizon"....but, I just came from
Best Buy and used the VZW laptop kiosk to check some prices. While
sneaking in to do that, I ran www.speakeasy.net/speedtest from the tiny
aircard blinking away in the side of a cheap laptop. Verizon doesn't seem
to be hurting too bad. Download speed was 900Kbps and upload was around
300Kbps.

What's your EDGE doing today while Verizon is being trampled under the
iPhone jackboots??


Larry
--
Do remember to put 2008 on your checks!...(c;

CozmicDebris <isheforreal> wrote in news:Xns9A18945B64555isheforreal@
216.196.97.136:

> Where is the reaction on Wall St?
>

Doesn't matter. Verizon WIRELESS isn't on Wall Street's Radar
screens.....not listed.

Larry
--
Do remember to put 2008 on your checks!...(c;

Larry <[email protected]> wrote in news:Xns9A18AFA122C94noonehomecom@
208.49.80.253:

> CozmicDebris <isheforreal> wrote in news:Xns9A18945B64555isheforreal@
> 216.196.97.136:
>
>> Where is the reaction on Wall St?
>>
>
> Doesn't matter. Verizon WIRELESS isn't on Wall Street's Radar
> screens.....not listed.
>
> Larry

Stop being an idiot for once. Verizon, 60% owner of Verizon Wireless and
who derives much of their overall reveniue from sadi wireless company, is
listed. And you knew that.

Go back to your bottle of moonshine, you stupid troll. And put another
twist into your tinfoil hat- it seems to be coming lose.

On 2008-01-01, 4phun <[email protected]> wrote:
> Interesting, no one here seems to care enough to research the subject.
> I just noticed that Qualcomm was also permanently banned from
> supporting the stuff they have already sold in the USA effective
> immediately. This related to all that 'high speed' EV-DO CDMA
> Qualcomm technology now used by Verizon and Sprint and others like
> them.

You are a bit behind the times already. Not only is Qualcomm not enjoined
from shipping all "'high speed' EV-DO CDMA" chips (only chipsets which
include the patented technology, and those patents are only peripherally
related to their core business), but the chips they're currently shipping
are claimed by Qualcomm to work around the patents while retaining the
functionality. See

http://www.dslreports.com/shownews/B...rt-Again-90458

Broadcom of course disagrees with this claim, but it will take another
go around in court to prove who is right now, and by the time that is
done Qualcomm will no doubt be several chipset generations further down
the road and all the issues will be (claimed to be) different again.

This doesn't, of course, mean Qualcomm is free and clear. All this
litigation makes Qualcomm an uncertain supplier and no one wants that,
so if this continues Qualcomm's customers will no doubt have increasing
incentive to keep their distance. On the other hand, Qualcomm has it
within its power to end the uncertainty instantly. What Broadcom
really wants is a technology cross-licensing agreement with Qualcomm
so that Broadcomm can compete in the wireless space without interference
from Qualcomm patents, which have caused them problems in the past.
Qualcomm has clearly found it in its business interests to instead try
to ride out IPR litigation and keep Broadcom out of the market, but this
decision could be revisited at any time if things begin to look more dire.

> Stick your head in the sand but a lot of people just got screwed and
> they do not realize it yet.
>
> Verizon has taken an unpleasant hit that will affect their future.

You are misreading the situation completely. Broadcom isn't an IPR
company trying to milk a patent portfolio for license fees, it is
a communications chip maker which would like to compete more broadly
in the wireless market. Business 101 says you don't screw over people
you would like to have as customers; Verizon, and the other big CDMA
operators, may be inconvenienced but in the end they'll be taken care
of.

This is not to say that this won't affect Verizon's future; it probably
already has. Verizon has done very well sticking with Qualcomm from
the latter company's original entry into the wireless market. Verizon
got the benefit of Qualcomm's incremental upgrade path, and got to
spend money improving their network's reach that other companies were
spending on useless forklift technology changes (i.e. TDMA->GSM) while
otherwise standing still, so the fact that Verizon has committed to LTE,
a standard defined by its avoidance of all the Qualcomm technology (and
IPR) it possibly could, is a huge shift in Verizon's direction. This
doesn't mean there is no "hit" but the company which takes the hit
will ultimately be Qualcomm, not Verizon.

Dennis Ferguson

CozmicDebris <isheforreal> wrote in
news:[email protected]:

> Larry <[email protected]> wrote in news:Xns9A18AFA122C94noonehomecom@
> 208.49.80.253:
>
>> CozmicDebris <isheforreal> wrote in news:Xns9A18945B64555isheforreal@
>> 216.196.97.136:
>>
>>> Where is the reaction on Wall St?
>>>
>>
>> Doesn't matter. Verizon WIRELESS isn't on Wall Street's Radar
>> screens.....not listed.
>>
>> Larry
>
> Stop being an idiot for once. Verizon, 60% owner of Verizon Wireless
> and who derives much of their overall reveniue from sadi wireless
> company, is listed. And you knew that.
>
> Go back to your bottle of moonshine, you stupid troll. And put
> another twist into your tinfoil hat- it seems to be coming lose.
>

But, alas, my hyperfriend, we could bankrupt VZW and, though it would
make a dent in Verizon and Vodaphone's balance sheet, would NOT put
either company in the pink sheets. Verizon is HUGE....SO IS VODAPHONE!

Chillpill....Meds late, tonight?

Larry
--
Do remember to put 2008 on your checks!...(c;

Larry <[email protected]> wrote in news:Xns9A18C34F5A0ADnoonehomecom@
208.49.80.253:

> CozmicDebris <isheforreal> wrote in
> news:[email protected]:
>
>> Larry <[email protected]> wrote in news:Xns9A18AFA122C94noonehomecom@
>> 208.49.80.253:
>>
>>> CozmicDebris <isheforreal> wrote in news:Xns9A18945B64555isheforreal@
>>> 216.196.97.136:
>>>
>>>> Where is the reaction on Wall St?
>>>>
>>>
>>> Doesn't matter. Verizon WIRELESS isn't on Wall Street's Radar
>>> screens.....not listed.
>>>
>>> Larry
>>
>> Stop being an idiot for once. Verizon, 60% owner of Verizon Wireless
>> and who derives much of their overall reveniue from sadi wireless
>> company, is listed. And you knew that.
>>
>> Go back to your bottle of moonshine, you stupid troll. And put
>> another twist into your tinfoil hat- it seems to be coming lose.
>>
>
> But, alas, my hyperfriend, we could bankrupt VZW and, though it would
> make a dent in Verizon and Vodaphone's balance sheet, would NOT put
> either company in the pink sheets. Verizon is HUGE....SO IS VODAPHONE!
>
> Chillpill....Meds late, tonight?
>
> Larry

Better check those balance sheets again for Verizon- wireless is the cash
cow for them.

"4phun" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:fd857c2e-6794-4a90-99cd-0ac799960f3c@r60g2000hsc.googlegroups.com...
> On Jan 1, 2:51 pm, "Ness-Net" <[email protected]> wrote:
>> "4phun" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>
>> news:[email protected]...
>>
>> > Verizon and Sprint telecoms network are based on Qualcomm technology
>> > and the courts have just ruled against Qualcomm BIG TIME for patent
>> > infringement. No more chips with Qualcomm EV-DO chip designs starting
>> > in 2009. They can ship during 2008 but the telcoms must pay a royalty
>> > for each phone imported which will drive up the price of any new
>> > Verizon or Sprint phone.
>>
>> > This is in effect a big blow to non GSM networks located in the USA.
>> > Plus Qualcomm will immediately not be allowed to ship any more
>> > advanced WCDMA chips locking Qualcomm's advanced CDMA technology out
>> > of high speed data beyond 3 EV-DO as I understand it.
>>
>> >http://www.reuters.com/article/techn...063420071231?f...
>>
>> > also
>>
>> >http://stocks.us.reuters.com/stocks/...?symbol=QCOM.O
>>
>> > Verizon signed an agreement with Broadcom where they agreed to pay
>> > through the nose to still be able to import phones with Qualcomm chips
>> > last August.
>>
>> > This is incredible to have your chip supplier castrated and leaving
>> > your own future in uncharted territory. Verizon and Sprint have far
>> > more than a little iPhone to worry about now. One article mentioned
>> > that they would move to have the US government declare an emergency
>> > and over turn the ruling.
>>
>> > What ever happens this is fascinating.
>>
>> Key words in the above... "as I understand it"......
>>
>> Obviously - you (4phun) don't.
>
> Interesting, no one here seems to care enough to research the subject.
> I just noticed that Qualcomm was also permanently banned from
> supporting the stuff they have already sold in the USA effective
> immediately. This related to all that 'high speed' EV-DO CDMA
> Qualcomm technology now used by Verizon and Sprint and others like
> them.
>
> Stick your head in the sand but a lot of people just got screwed and
> they do not realize it yet.
>
> Verizon has taken an unpleasant hit that will affect their future.


How do you figure ?

Verizon could easy support them. You think there going to let this get out
of hand ? If anything they will replace the phone. Being it's under warr of
course. And if not covered they will make some kind of deal on a new phone.
It's almost like the amps phone deal. Sorry, were not going to support it,
You can upgrade for a reduced price.

On Tue, 1 Jan 2008, Dennis Ferguson posted:
> On 2008-01-01, 4phun <[email protected]> wrote:
> You are a bit behind the times already. Not only is Qualcomm not enjoined
> from shipping all "'high speed' EV-DO CDMA" chips (only chipsets which
> include the patented technology, and those patents are only peripherally
> related to their core business), but the chips they're currently shipping
> are claimed by Qualcomm to work around the patents while retaining the
> functionality.

What's more, the issue impacts the GSM world far more, as the main focus
of the patents in question is on WCDMA (a.k.a. UMTS) rather than EV-DO.
This has the potential of keeping AT&T (and iPhone) on s-l-o-w EDGE for
years!

The patents in question are 5,657,317, 6,847,686, and 6,389,010.

The iPhone trolls fail to realize that this is far worse news for them
than it is for Verizon. Qualcomm makes the only viable 3G chipset today.
Broadcom can't fill the gap with its own chips because they need Qualcomm
patented technology to do it.

Hence this game of chicken. Broadcom wants to enter the market, but can't
because Qualcomm won't license the necessary patents to Broadcom. Hence,
Broadcom is trying to force Qualcomm into a cross-licensing settlement by
dragging Qualcomm into the patent license prison with them.

Verizon already has its EV-DO based 3G network, and paid off Broadcom.
The only question for Verizon is which chip supplier they will ultimately
end up with, not whether they will have chips.

AT&T, and to a lesser extent T-Mobile, are screwed because their UMTS
based 3G network is embryonic (unlike Verizon's EV-DO network which is
widely deployed). This dispute delays, or even blocks, 3G deployment by
the US GSM carriers.

Apple is screwed as well. They will have a difficult time getting a 3G
chipset from anyone, and face the very real possibility that if they do
commit to a particular chipset, they will get slapped with an import ban.
There is a very real possibility that iPhone could be rendered into a
flash in the ban by this problem alone.

Last, but not least, Qualcomm is screwed, because this is what was finally
needed to get the carriers off their duffs and look towards technology
that is not (or is minimally) encumbered by Qualcomm patents. This also
applies to Broadcom, because if this dispute is not resolved soon both
companies will miss out on 4G.

-- Mark --

http://panda.com/mrc
Democracy is two wolves and a sheep deciding what to eat for lunch.
Liberty is a well-armed sheep contesting the vote.

Mark Crispin wrote:

> Apple is screwed as well. They will have a difficult time getting a 3G
> chipset from anyone, and face the very real possibility that if they do
> commit to a particular chipset, they will get slapped with an import
> ban. There is a very real possibility that iPhone could be rendered into
> a flash in the ban by this problem alone.

Indeed, this is one of the reasons for the lack of 3G in the iPhone.

> Last, but not least, Qualcomm is screwed, because this is what was
> finally needed to get the carriers off their duffs and look towards
> technology that is not (or is minimally) encumbered by Qualcomm
> patents. This also applies to Broadcom, because if this dispute is not
> resolved soon both companies will miss out on 4G.

Like the RIM dispute, eventually the companies realize that if they
don't settle, it'll hurt both of them.