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- 07-21-2006, 03:22 PM #16ScottGuest
Re: New TDMA charge
"SMS" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Jack Zwick wrote:
>
>> But Sprint's phones use 1900 Mhz, which means on any call over a couple
>> of minutes, the phone gets hot, and after a some months of that, the
>> phone dies. Usually 2 days after the warranty is up.
>
> Huh?
"Jack" is a former disgruntled Sprint customer who flooded the
alt.cellular.sprintpcs group with his rantings and conspiracy theories a few
years back. IIRC, he used about 100 different ID's and was convinced that
he knew the real behind-the scenes workings of Sprint. His rantings made
Navas seem informational and accurate in comparison.
› See More: New TDMA charge
- 07-21-2006, 04:02 PM #17DecaturTxCowboyGuest
Re: New TDMA charge
Scott wrote:
> Still bitter, Phillipe?
wow, I haven't seen him on here in well...long long time.
- 07-24-2006, 06:36 AM #18Thomas T. VeldhouseGuest
Re: New TDMA charge
DecaturTxCowboy <[email protected]> wrote:
> Scott wrote:
>> Still bitter, Phillipe?
>
>
> wow, I haven't seen him on here in well...long long time.
No, it hasn't been long, you just failed to notice him.
--
Thomas T. Veldhouse
Key Fingerprint: 2DB9 813F F510 82C2 E1AE 34D0 D69D 1EDC D5EC AED1
- 07-24-2006, 06:38 AM #19Thomas T. VeldhouseGuest
Re: New TDMA charge
Scott <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> "Jack" is a former disgruntled Sprint customer who flooded the
> alt.cellular.sprintpcs group with his rantings and conspiracy theories a few
> years back. IIRC, he used about 100 different ID's and was convinced that
> he knew the real behind-the scenes workings of Sprint. His rantings made
> Navas seem informational and accurate in comparison.
>
Jack used to use many different IDs, in particular, he was well known to have
used Phillipe ... and he was caught supporting his own arguments with a sock
puppet named Phillipe. Unfortunately, this means you can not trust Jack Zwick
very far ... and it is best to double check who is "supporters" are in a
conversation if you do not know who they are.
--
Thomas T. Veldhouse
Key Fingerprint: 2DB9 813F F510 82C2 E1AE 34D0 D69D 1EDC D5EC AED1
- 07-25-2006, 01:40 PM #20John NavasGuest
Re: New TDMA charge
On Fri, 21 Jul 2006 14:00:28 -0500, "Thomas T. Veldhouse"
<[email protected]> wrote in
<[email protected]>:
>Jack Zwick <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> But Sprint's phones use 1900 Mhz, which means on any call over a couple
>> of minutes, the phone gets hot, and after a some months of that, the
>> phone dies. Usually 2 days after the warranty is up.
>
>What are you talking about? I have had many Sprint PCS phones and not one has
>died. None. They don't get hot; at most a little warm, and that has NOTHING
>to do with the phone being PCS.
True, but my old Samsung SCH-8500 did get distinctly warm (not hot) on
long calls, although that may have been more to do with the poor Sprint
network coverage in my area than with the phone itself.
--
Best regards, SEE THE FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS AT
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>
- 07-25-2006, 01:45 PM #21John NavasGuest
Re: New TDMA charge
On Fri, 21 Jul 2006 09:37:10 -0700, SMS <[email protected]>
wrote in <[email protected]>:
>It's not GSM versus TDMA or GSM versus CDMA where the big coverage
>difference exists, it's GSM versus TDMA+AMPS and GSM versus CDMA+AMPS.
>With a tri-mode phone of Verizon or Sprint, you have far more coverage
>than with a GSM phone. If you go to the mountains, or outside urban
>areas, AMPS is still very useful.
That straw is getting pretty thin -- there are now relatively few areas
with only analog, not digital, coverage.
--
Best regards, SEE THE FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS AT
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>
- 07-25-2006, 06:56 PM #22Jud HardcastleGuest
Re: New TDMA charge
In article <[email protected]>, spamfilter0
@navasgroup.com says...
> On Fri, 21 Jul 2006 09:37:10 -0700, SMS <[email protected]>
> wrote in <[email protected]>:
>
> >It's not GSM versus TDMA or GSM versus CDMA where the big coverage
> >difference exists, it's GSM versus TDMA+AMPS and GSM versus CDMA+AMPS.
> >With a tri-mode phone of Verizon or Sprint, you have far more coverage
> >than with a GSM phone. If you go to the mountains, or outside urban
> >areas, AMPS is still very useful.
>
> That straw is getting pretty thin -- there are now relatively few areas
> with only analog, not digital, coverage.
>
We still have some analog only areas but that's not the point. It's not
analog-only areas he's talking about--it's areas where there is no
digital OF THE KIND YOU NEED--if you don't have a phone with AMPS then
you have no coverage there.
We know from reports here, and I know from my drives around Texas, that
there are still major areas that DON'T HAVE GSM (or CDMA) but do have
TDMA+AMPS. There are probably some CMDA+AMPS areas also. Say a state has
GSM in 50% of the total land area (not population--land), CDMA in 40% of
the total area, TDMA in 75%, and ANALOG in 99%. Of course the analog
overlaps the digital in MOST areas and is not all analog only. A GSM-
only phone has a maximum coverage of 50% of the state. A CDMA-only phone
is going to cover only 40%. But BOTH TDMA+AMPS *and* CDMA+AMPS phones
(and my GAIT phone) is going to cover 99% even 100% because analog is
STILL the base common denominator. The AMPS sunset as written assumes
that one of the digital methods will by that time be the new base--if
that DOESN'T HAPPEN by then the SUNSET COULD BE EXTENDED.
Anyway, he's saying that right now *ANY* digital+AMPS phone has more
coverage than a digital-only phone--and I agree 100%. A GSM+AMPS phone
would also--if there was one anymore.
--
Jud
Dallas TX USA
- 07-25-2006, 07:08 PM #23SMSGuest
Re: New TDMA charge
Jud Hardcastle wrote:
> We still have some analog only areas but that's not the point. It's not
> analog-only areas he's talking about--it's areas where there is no
> digital OF THE KIND YOU NEED--if you don't have a phone with AMPS then
> you have no coverage there.
Well it's really where there's no digital at all. There are many parts
of the San Francisco Bay Area that are relatively close to the urban
areas, but that are up in the surrounding hills and mountains that have
little or no population, but that are popular areas for recreation or
popular roads to get to parks and beaches. Often these areas have no
digital coverage at all, but the roads are sufficiently busy that call
boxes were installed so AMPS is there by default.
I think that one of the reasons that Verizon is consistently rated as
the best carrier is because enough subscribers still have AMPS capable
handsets, so they're not complaining about coverage as much as Cingular
customers.
There still are a lot of rural areas around here where the digital
carrier went to CDMA, i.e. Golden State Cellular
(http://www.goldenstatecellular.com).
> Anyway, he's saying that right now *ANY* digital+AMPS phone has more
> coverage than a digital-only phone--and I agree 100%. A GSM+AMPS phone
> would also--if there was one anymore.
It's really too bad that these are no longer available, but of course no
one wants to add cost to their handsets when most people don't
understand why they would want AMPS.
- 07-26-2006, 04:39 AM #24Joe VersaggiGuest
Re: New TDMA charge
Why aren't there any GSM/AMPS phones ? If I remember, that GAIT phone
that Cingular had a few years ago was TDMA/GSM/AMPS, but kept dropping
calls as various towers competed for one another as you were in motion.
Jud Hardcastle wrote:
> Anyway, he's saying that right now *ANY* digital+AMPS phone has more
> coverage than a digital-only phone--and I agree 100%. A GSM+AMPS phone
> would also--if there was one anymore.
- 07-26-2006, 06:38 AM #25Thomas T. VeldhouseGuest
Re: New TDMA charge
John Navas <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Fri, 21 Jul 2006 14:00:28 -0500, "Thomas T. Veldhouse"
> <[email protected]> wrote in
> <[email protected]>:
>
>>Jack Zwick <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>> But Sprint's phones use 1900 Mhz, which means on any call over a couple
>>> of minutes, the phone gets hot, and after a some months of that, the
>>> phone dies. Usually 2 days after the warranty is up.
>>
>>What are you talking about? I have had many Sprint PCS phones and not one has
>>died. None. They don't get hot; at most a little warm, and that has NOTHING
>>to do with the phone being PCS.
>
> True, but my old Samsung SCH-8500 did get distinctly warm (not hot) on
> long calls, although that may have been more to do with the poor Sprint
> network coverage in my area than with the phone itself.
>
There was an issue with a couple of the old Samsung models, but this isn't a
Sprint PCS issue as Phillipe tried to indicate; nor does it have anything at
all to do with 1900MHz.
--
Thomas T. Veldhouse
Key Fingerprint: 2DB9 813F F510 82C2 E1AE 34D0 D69D 1EDC D5EC AED1
- 07-26-2006, 06:42 AM #26Thomas T. VeldhouseGuest
Re: New TDMA charge
SMS <[email protected]> wrote:
> Jud Hardcastle wrote:
>
>> We still have some analog only areas but that's not the point. It's not
>> analog-only areas he's talking about--it's areas where there is no
>> digital OF THE KIND YOU NEED--if you don't have a phone with AMPS then
>> you have no coverage there.
>
> Well it's really where there's no digital at all. There are many parts
> of the San Francisco Bay Area that are relatively close to the urban
> areas, but that are up in the surrounding hills and mountains that have
> little or no population, but that are popular areas for recreation or
> popular roads to get to parks and beaches. Often these areas have no
> digital coverage at all, but the roads are sufficiently busy that call
> boxes were installed so AMPS is there by default.
>
> I think that one of the reasons that Verizon is consistently rated as
> the best carrier is because enough subscribers still have AMPS capable
> handsets, so they're not complaining about coverage as much as Cingular
> customers.
>
> There still are a lot of rural areas around here where the digital
> carrier went to CDMA, i.e. Golden State Cellular
> (http://www.goldenstatecellular.com).
>
>> Anyway, he's saying that right now *ANY* digital+AMPS phone has more
>> coverage than a digital-only phone--and I agree 100%. A GSM+AMPS phone
>> would also--if there was one anymore.
>
> It's really too bad that these are no longer available, but of course no
> one wants to add cost to their handsets when most people don't
> understand why they would want AMPS.
Price handsets between Verizon, Sprint, Cingular and T-Mobile and compare
features. I think you will find that there is no actual premium on the price
of a handset with AMPS included, in spite of the fact that they may actually
cost more to manufacture ... they don't seem to pass it on [directly] to the
customer, but rather, spread the cost out through all of the product lines
whether they contain an AMPS radio or not.
--
Thomas T. Veldhouse
Key Fingerprint: 2DB9 813F F510 82C2 E1AE 34D0 D69D 1EDC D5EC AED1
- 07-26-2006, 07:15 AM #27DecaturTxCowboyGuest
Re: New TDMA charge
Joe Versaggi wrote:
> Why aren't there any GSM/AMPS phones ? If I remember, that GAIT phone
> that Cingular had a few years ago was TDMA/GSM/AMPS, but kept dropping
> calls as various towers competed for one another as you were in motion.
One significant issue in my area was the calls would always drop once
you got about 8 miles out of town.
At the time, GSM could not hand off a call to TDMA. Decatur was GSM, but
the surrounding towers were not...so once you left the Decatur GSM
coverage area, the call would drop.
But the most significant issue was people that upgraded from the older
TDMA Nokia 51xx/61xx phones that were the most popular around here to a
GSM only, they lost a lot of coverage and had to go back and go with the
Nokia GAIT phone.
- 07-26-2006, 08:53 AM #28SMSGuest
Re: New TDMA charge
Joe Versaggi wrote:
> Why aren't there any GSM/AMPS phones ?
I think because the U.S. GSM phones evolved from the European and Asian
GSM phones, where AMPS was not an issue. Nokia had an "AMPS Sleeve" that
fit a couple of their GSM phones, and Voicestream (now T-Mobile)
supported it.
> If I remember, that GAIT phone
> that Cingular had a few years ago was TDMA/GSM/AMPS, but kept dropping
> calls as various towers competed for one another as you were in motion.
It dropped calls if you began a call on a system that had no towers in
the area you moved into.
- 07-26-2006, 09:00 AM #29John NavasGuest
Re: New TDMA charge
1. GSM is a worldwide standard with the majority of the market outside
of the USA, so our GSM phones tend to be minor variations (primarily
just different bands) on standard designs. It would be expensive to add
AMPS just for our market.
2. AMPS is inefficient and wasteful of spectrum, and will soon be phased
out. Carriers are trying to wean customers away in the meantime so
there will be as little disruption as possible.
3. GAIT, which takes special carrier support, was only to help in the
transition from TDMA to GSM. Now that the transition is almost
complete, there's no reason for carriers to support it.
On Wed, 26 Jul 2006 10:39:31 GMT, Joe Versaggi <[email protected]> wrote
in <[email protected]>:
>Why aren't there any GSM/AMPS phones ? If I remember, that GAIT phone
>that Cingular had a few years ago was TDMA/GSM/AMPS, but kept dropping
>calls as various towers competed for one another as you were in motion.
>
>Jud Hardcastle wrote:
>
>> Anyway, he's saying that right now *ANY* digital+AMPS phone has more
>> coverage than a digital-only phone--and I agree 100%. A GSM+AMPS phone
>> would also--if there was one anymore.
--
Best regards, SEE THE FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS AT
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>
- 07-26-2006, 10:06 AM #30John NavasGuest
Re: New TDMA charge
On Tue, 25 Jul 2006 18:08:04 -0700, SMS <[email protected]>
wrote in <[email protected]>:
>Jud Hardcastle wrote:
>
>> We still have some analog only areas but that's not the point. It's not
>> analog-only areas he's talking about--it's areas where there is no
>> digital OF THE KIND YOU NEED--if you don't have a phone with AMPS then
>> you have no coverage there.
>
>Well it's really where there's no digital at all. There are many parts
>of the San Francisco Bay Area that are relatively close to the urban
>areas, but that are up in the surrounding hills and mountains that have
>little or no population, but that are popular areas for recreation or
>popular roads to get to parks and beaches. Often these areas have no
>digital coverage at all, but the roads are sufficiently busy that call
>boxes were installed so AMPS is there by default.
There is actually digital coverage in most of the popular recreation
areas.
--
Best regards, SEE THE FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS AT
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>
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