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  1. #1
    SMS
    Guest
    See "http://tinyurl.com/jtasv"

    As soon as Sprint and T-Mobile post results I'll update the web site
    with the graphs on market share.



    See More: Verizon adds 1.8 million wireless users, Industry's No. 2 closesgap on market leader Cingular




  2. #2
    Thomas T. Veldhouse
    Guest

    Re: Verizon adds 1.8 million wireless users, Industry's No. 2 closes gap on market leader Cingular

    In alt.cellular.cingular SMS <[email protected]> wrote:
    > See "http://tinyurl.com/jtasv"
    >
    > As soon as Sprint and T-Mobile post results I'll update the web site
    > with the graphs on market share.


    Interesting. It looks like Verizon is doing well. However, it looks as
    Cingular stands to show improvement as well. I am curious how this shakes out
    12 months from now.

    --
    Thomas T. Veldhouse
    Key Fingerprint: 2DB9 813F F510 82C2 E1AE 34D0 D69D 1EDC D5EC AED1




  3. #3
    SMS
    Guest

    Re: Verizon adds 1.8 million wireless users, Industry's No. 2 closesgap on market leader Cingular

    Thomas T. Veldhouse wrote:
    > In alt.cellular.cingular SMS <[email protected]> wrote:
    >> See "http://tinyurl.com/jtasv"
    >>
    >> As soon as Sprint and T-Mobile post results I'll update the web site
    >> with the graphs on market share.

    >
    > Interesting. It looks like Verizon is doing well. However, it looks as
    > Cingular stands to show improvement as well. I am curious how this shakes out
    > 12 months from now.


    The analysts were not thrilled with Cingular's results due to their
    falling net additions, their falling ARPU, too many pre-paid additions,
    and their declining market share. OTOH, profits were way up, and margins
    were up, which was a positive, but the analysts complained that margins
    should have been up even more because the lower net additions meant
    lower acquisition costs.

    In this environment it seems like _every_ metric needs to exceed
    expectations in order for the analysts to grudgingly admit that a
    company is doing well.

    See "http://tinyurl.com/ehhx5".



  4. #4
    Jack Zwick
    Guest

    Re: Verizon adds 1.8 million wireless users, Industry's No. 2 closes gap on market leader Cingular

    In article <[email protected]>,
    SMS <[email protected]> wrote:

    > Thomas T. Veldhouse wrote:
    > > In alt.cellular.cingular SMS <[email protected]> wrote:
    > >> See "http://tinyurl.com/jtasv"
    > >>
    > >> As soon as Sprint and T-Mobile post results I'll update the web site
    > >> with the graphs on market share.

    > >
    > > Interesting. It looks like Verizon is doing well. However, it looks as
    > > Cingular stands to show improvement as well. I am curious how this shakes
    > > out
    > > 12 months from now.

    >
    > The analysts were not thrilled with Cingular's results due to their
    > falling net additions, their falling ARPU, too many pre-paid additions,
    > and their declining market share. OTOH, profits were way up, and margins
    > were up, which was a positive, but the analysts complained that margins
    > should have been up even more because the lower net additions meant
    > lower acquisition costs.
    >
    > In this environment it seems like _every_ metric needs to exceed
    > expectations in order for the analysts to grudgingly admit that a
    > company is doing well.


    AND NAVAS WOULD NEVER ADMIT THAT AT THIS RATE (AS I PREDICTED LONG AGO)
    VERIZON WILL SOON HAVE MORE CUSTOMERS THAN CINGULAR.



  5. #5
    bernard farquart
    Guest

    Re: Verizon adds 1.8 million wireless users, Industry's No. 2 closes gap on market leader Cingular


    "Jack Zwick" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...

    > AND NAVAS WOULD NEVER ADMIT THAT AT THIS RATE (AS I PREDICTED LONG AGO)
    > VERIZON WILL SOON HAVE MORE CUSTOMERS THAN CINGULAR.


    If you predicted "long ago" that this would happen "soon"
    then you are already wrong, by definition.

    Bernard





  6. #6
    Charles
    Guest

    Re: Verizon adds 1.8 million wireless users, Industry's No. 2 closes gap on market leader Cingular

    In article <[email protected]>, bernard
    farquart <[email protected]> wrote:

    > If you predicted "long ago" that this would happen "soon"
    > then you are already wrong, by definition.


    I can't see why it is important. That is which has the most customers
    or predicting that one will have more than the other. I don't pick a
    carrier by which one has the most customers. Do most? I just hope
    there are multiple carriers so there is a choice.

    --
    Charles



  7. #7
    SMS
    Guest

    Re: Verizon adds 1.8 million wireless users, Industry's No. 2 closesgap on market leader Cingular

    Jack Zwick wrote:

    >> In this environment it seems like _every_ metric needs to exceed
    >> expectations in order for the analysts to grudgingly admit that a
    >> company is doing well.

    >
    > AND NAVAS WOULD NEVER ADMIT THAT AT THIS RATE (AS I PREDICTED LONG AGO)
    > VERIZON WILL SOON HAVE MORE CUSTOMERS THAN CINGULAR.


    Not soon. At the current rate of quarterly additions, 300K more per
    quarter, it would still take about eight quarters for Verizon to pass
    Cingular, and there is no telling whether future quarters will be better
    or worse for each carrier in terms of net additions. Cingular has really
    cut their churn, so they're not doing as poorly as before in terms of
    net additions.

    The loss of Radio Shack as a sales outlet helped Verizon's financials,
    but it did have a negative effect on their net additions. It really hurt
    Radio Shack's financial's, as they were doing extremely well with
    Verizon, and now they're doing very poorly with Cingular.



  8. #8
    SMS
    Guest

    Re: Verizon adds 1.8 million wireless users, Industry's No. 2 closesgap on market leader Cingular

    Charles wrote:
    > In article <[email protected]>, bernard
    > farquart <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >> If you predicted "long ago" that this would happen "soon"
    >> then you are already wrong, by definition.

    >
    > I can't see why it is important. That is which has the most customers
    > or predicting that one will have more than the other. I don't pick a
    > carrier by which one has the most customers. Do most? I just hope
    > there are multiple carriers so there is a choice.


    If there were a huge difference in the number of customers it would have
    an effect on which carrier to choose because of mobile to mobile
    minutes. If everything else were equal, it would make sense to choose
    the carrier that most of the people you call have. Of course everything
    else is not equal. Coverage varies by carrier by location, but Verizon
    tends to have the best coverage of any carrier judging by all the
    independent surveys. In my area, the San Francisco Bay Area, Cingular
    coverage is adequate, but not nearly as good as Verizon's coverage with
    a tri-mode phone. It seems that every week I'm someplace where there is
    no Cingular coverage, but where Verizon does have coverage.



  9. #9
    Jack Zwick
    Guest

    Re: Verizon adds 1.8 million wireless users, Industry's No. 2 closes gap on market leader Cingular

    In article <240720062019014649%[email protected]>,
    Charles <[email protected]> wrote:

    > In article <[email protected]>, bernard
    > farquart <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > > If you predicted "long ago" that this would happen "soon"
    > > then you are already wrong, by definition.

    >
    > I can't see why it is important. That is which has the most customers
    > or predicting that one will have more than the other. I don't pick a
    > carrier by which one has the most customers. Do most? I just hope
    > there are multiple carriers so there is a choice.


    Judging by the fact that the lowest price plan keeps getting more
    expensive, and fewer and fewer minutes are given with a $60 family plan,
    the negative effects of all the mergers is already here.



  10. #10
    John Navas
    Guest

    Re: Verizon adds 1.8 million wireless users, Industry's No. 2 closes gap on market leader Cingular

    On Mon, 24 Jul 2006 18:50:43 -0700, SMS <[email protected]>
    wrote in <[email protected]>:

    >... Coverage varies by carrier by location, but Verizon
    >tends to have the best coverage of any carrier judging by all the
    >independent surveys. In my area, the San Francisco Bay Area, Cingular
    >coverage is adequate, but not nearly as good as Verizon's coverage with
    >a tri-mode phone. It seems that every week I'm someplace where there is
    >no Cingular coverage, but where Verizon does have coverage.


    In fact Cingular has very good digital coverage in the San Francisco Bay
    Area, arguably the best overall digital network of all carriers, Verizon
    included. Time to upgrade that old single-band PacBell phone and find
    out.

    --
    Best regards, SEE THE FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS AT
    John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>



  11. #11
    John Navas
    Guest

    Re: Verizon adds 1.8 million wireless users, Industry's No. 2 closes gap on market leader Cingular

    On Mon, 24 Jul 2006 18:47:23 -0700, SMS <[email protected]>
    wrote in <[email protected]>:

    >Jack Zwick wrote:
    >
    >>> In this environment it seems like _every_ metric needs to exceed
    >>> expectations in order for the analysts to grudgingly admit that a
    >>> company is doing well.

    >>
    >> AND NAVAS WOULD NEVER ADMIT THAT AT THIS RATE (AS I PREDICTED LONG AGO)
    >> VERIZON WILL SOON HAVE MORE CUSTOMERS THAN CINGULAR.

    >
    >Not soon. At the current rate of quarterly additions, 300K more per
    >quarter, it would still take about eight quarters for Verizon to pass
    >Cingular, and there is no telling whether future quarters will be better
    >or worse for each carrier in terms of net additions. Cingular has really
    >cut their churn, so they're not doing as poorly as before in terms of
    >net additions.


    So much for your prior forecasts of Verizon rapidly passing Cingular.
    I guess you're now seeing the handwriting on the wall.

    >The loss of Radio Shack as a sales outlet helped Verizon's financials,
    >but it did have a negative effect on their net additions. It really hurt
    >Radio Shack's financial's, as they were doing extremely well with
    >Verizon, and now they're doing very poorly with Cingular.


    Radio Shack actually dumped Verizon due to poor sales performance in
    2005, and switched to Cingular as part of an improvement plan that's
    starting to pay off now that the transition is pretty much over.
    The result is a boost for Cingular at the expense of Verizon.

    --
    Best regards, SEE THE FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS AT
    John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>



  12. #12
    John Navas
    Guest

    Re: Verizon adds 1.8 million wireless users, Industry's No. 2 closes gap on market leader Cingular

    On Mon, 24 Jul 2006 20:19:01 -0400, Charles <[email protected]> wrote in
    <240720062019014649%[email protected]>:

    >In article <[email protected]>, bernard
    >farquart <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >> If you predicted "long ago" that this would happen "soon"
    >> then you are already wrong, by definition.

    >
    >I can't see why it is important. That is which has the most customers
    >or predicting that one will have more than the other. I don't pick a
    >carrier by which one has the most customers. Do most? I just hope
    >there are multiple carriers so there is a choice.


    It not important. Subscriber base bashing is silly.

    --
    Best regards, SEE THE FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS AT
    John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>



  13. #13
    John Navas
    Guest

    Re: Verizon adds 1.8 million wireless users, Industry's No. 2 closes gap on market leader Cingular

    On Mon, 24 Jul 2006 10:57:06 -0700, SMS <[email protected]>
    wrote in <[email protected]>:

    >Thomas T. Veldhouse wrote:
    >> In alt.cellular.cingular SMS <[email protected]> wrote:
    >>> See "http://tinyurl.com/jtasv"
    >>>
    >>> As soon as Sprint and T-Mobile post results I'll update the web site
    >>> with the graphs on market share.

    >>
    >> Interesting. It looks like Verizon is doing well. However, it looks as
    >> Cingular stands to show improvement as well. I am curious how this shakes out
    >> 12 months from now.

    >
    >The analysts were not thrilled with Cingular's results due to their
    >falling net additions, their falling ARPU, too many pre-paid additions,
    >and their declining market share. OTOH, profits were way up, and margins
    >were up, which was a positive, but the analysts complained that margins
    >should have been up even more because the lower net additions meant
    >lower acquisition costs.


    Many analysts were actually quite positive.

    <http://news.yahoo.com/s/ibd/20060720/bs_ibd_ibd/2006720tech01>:

    Cingular Wireless tripled its second-quarter profit to $540 million as
    customer disconnects fell to an all-time low.
    ...
    Verizon Wireless' main edge over Cingular has been network
    reliability. But Cingular has been closing that gap, analysts say.
    ...
    Cingular said its monthly churn rate fell to 1.7% in the second
    quarter. That's down from 2.2% a year ago and 2.7% in 2004.
    ...
    Cingular's average monthly revenue per user fell 3.3% to $48.84.

    The drop is due to Cingular having more prepaid customers that spend
    less monthly. Cingular's revenue from data services rose 38% to an
    average per user of $5.77 a month.

    [MORE]

    <http://www.ajc.com/business/content/business/stories/0721bizcingular.html>

    Cingular's subscriber growth and churn exceeded the estimates of
    analyst Jason Armstrong of Goldman Sachs. "Cingular's strong
    subscriber result indicates market share gains, in particular from
    T-Mobile and Sprint," he said in a research note. "However, we
    continue to expect robust overall market growth."

    --
    Best regards, SEE THE FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS AT
    John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>



  14. #14
    Scott
    Guest

    Re: Verizon adds 1.8 million wireless users, Industry's No. 2 closes gap on market leader Cingular


    "John Navas" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...
    > On Mon, 24 Jul 2006 18:50:43 -0700, SMS <[email protected]>
    > wrote in <[email protected]>:
    >
    >>... Coverage varies by carrier by location, but Verizon
    >>tends to have the best coverage of any carrier judging by all the
    >>independent surveys. In my area, the San Francisco Bay Area, Cingular
    >>coverage is adequate, but not nearly as good as Verizon's coverage with
    >>a tri-mode phone. It seems that every week I'm someplace where there is
    >>no Cingular coverage, but where Verizon does have coverage.

    >
    > In fact Cingular has very good digital coverage in the San Francisco Bay
    > Area, arguably the best overall digital network of all carriers, Verizon
    > included. Time to upgrade that old single-band PacBell phone and find
    > out.
    >


    And yet you are still unable to show verification of this personal opinion.
    Why is that?





  15. #15
    Scott
    Guest

    Re: Verizon adds 1.8 million wireless users, Industry's No. 2 closes gap on market leader Cingular


    "John Navas" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]...

    >
    > Radio Shack actually dumped Verizon due to poor sales performance in
    > 2005,


    Incorrect again, Skippy.

    > and switched to Cingular as part of an improvement plan that's
    > starting to pay off now that the transition is pretty much over.


    And you base this opinion on what?


    > The result is a boost for Cingular at the expense of Verizon.


    Boost for Cingular? Based on what?





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