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  1. #16
    Jack Zwick
    Guest

    Re: $5 monthly surcharge

    In article
    <[email protected]>,
    Joe Versaggi <[email protected]> wrote:

    > Bucky wrote:
    > > Douglas C. Neidermeyer wrote:
    > >
    > >>Saw a headline crawler on one of the cable news channels that Cingular was
    > >>going to impose a $5 monthly surcharge to non-GSM phone customers starting
    > >>in September.

    > >
    > > Bastards. Anyone know where I can sign up for a free/discount phone
    > > without paying the $36 activation charge?
    > >

    >
    > Just do this:
    > - go to Sprint PCS Online (like I just did),
    > - pick a $29.99 Fair & Flexible plan,
    > - they'll have UPS drop it off in 3 business days. $36 fee waived.
    > - do indepdendent research on the various free and cheap CDMA/AMPS
    > phones. Some are bad, some are good.
    > - Forget local number portability to keep it simple and in case Sprint
    > doesn't work out.
    >
    > I just got a Nokia 6016i. Backup plan was a Sanyo RL-4930 brick phone.
    > Once you try it out for a week, call up Stinkular, and tell them to
    > stick their $39.99 GSM plans up their ass.


    Out of the frying pan into the fire with Sprint.

    Uses only the inferior 1900 Mhz band (works less well indoors)
    Much poorer coverage nationwide
    Inferior Sanyo/Samsung phones
    Inferior CDMA (worse voice quality)
    Strange "Fair and Flexible" plan. Go 1 minute over your plan, get
    charged $10.
    No such thing as Rollover Minutes with Sprint
    Horrible 800# support. Long hold times, CSRs on strict handle time limits



    See More: $5 monthly surcharge




  2. #17
    John Navas
    Guest

    Re: $5 monthly surcharge

    On Tue, 01 Aug 2006 21:31:22 GMT, Jack Zwick <[email protected]> wrote
    in <[email protected]>:

    >Out of the frying pan into the fire with Sprint.
    >
    >Uses only the inferior 1900 Mhz band (works less well indoors)


    Not necessarily -- depends on tower locations and other factors. 1900
    generally penetrates small openings (e.g., windows) better than 800.

    >Much poorer coverage nationwide


    Depends on where you are. It's the worst carrier in my area, but I know
    of areas where it's the best carrier.

    >Inferior Sanyo/Samsung phones


    Samsung phones are pretty good.

    >Inferior CDMA (worse voice quality)


    True in some cases, but it's typically comparable to GSM.

    >Strange "Fair and Flexible" plan. Go 1 minute over your plan, get
    > charged $10.


    Actually $5 for 50 additional minutes (in this area at least), which
    I think is a pretty good deal.

    >No such thing as Rollover Minutes with Sprint


    Or any carrier other than Cingular, but Fair and Flexible is a
    worthwhile alternative.

    >Horrible 800# support. Long hold times, CSRs on strict handle time limits


    My experiences have generally been pretty good.

    There is no one best carrier for everyone, and Sprint can be a good fit
    for certain people.

    --
    Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
    John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>



  3. #18
    Jack Zwick
    Guest

    Re: $5 monthly surcharge

    In article <[email protected]>,
    "Elmo P. Shagnasty" <[email protected]> wrote:

    > In article
    > <[email protected]>,
    > Jack Zwick <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > > Inferior Sanyo/Samsung phones

    >
    > My brother has a 5 year old Samsung flip phone from Sprint that shows no
    > sign of dying or otherwise being inferior.


    Exactly, before Sprint insisted they make them cheaper.



  4. #19
    John Navas
    Guest

    Re: $5 monthly surcharge

    On Tue, 01 Aug 2006 12:37:28 -0700, SMS <[email protected]>
    wrote in <[email protected]>:

    >They simply don't care if the few million remaining TDMA/AMPS customers
    >leave.


    On the contrary -- "they" (Cingular) want them to upgrade to GSM.

    >They even stated that there will be a hit in regards to churn by
    >their action.


    What "they" actually stated
    <http://www.easybourse.com/Website/dynamic/News.php?NewsID=27229>:

    The Atlanta carrier looks to have all of its customers on the same
    billing platform, and move most of its customers away from the old
    AT&T Wireless technology by early 2007. The company plans to
    discontinue the old network by 2008. Cingular acquired AT&T Wireless
    in October 2004.

    While the improvement in network quality and increased focus in
    customer care has been instrumental in reducing the turnover rate,
    there will likely be a seasonal increase in cancellations in the
    third quarter, Ritcher said during a Thursday conference call to
    discuss the company's second-quarter results.

    "That will create some pressure, but we're going to try to minimize
    that pressure," he said. "At the end of the day, there will be some
    that don't want to move over."

    --
    Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
    John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>



  5. #20
    Kevin K
    Guest

    Re: $5 monthly surcharge

    If Sprint had decent coverage at my home, I would probably still have
    them. Their 3G coverage is, as of today, still better.



  6. #21

    Re: $5 monthly surcharge

    Douglas C. Neidermeyer wrote:
    > Saw a headline crawler on one of the cable news channels that Cingular was
    > going to impose a $5 monthly surcharge to non-GSM phone customers starting
    > in September.
    >
    > Doug




    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060731/...r_older_phones

    I found it first on Phonescoop, which is a good resource for cellular
    news-links.

    http://www.phonescoop.com/news/

    Cingular To Charge Non-GSM Subscribers

    Today, 5:03 PM source: Associated Press
    "Cingular will soon begin charging subscribers with older phones $5 per
    month. In an effort to get subscribers off of older analog and TDMA
    handsets, Cingular will begin charging users on the older protocols as
    early as September. An FCC ruling declared Cingular and others like
    Verizon must continue to provide analog service until 2008...."

    This further disincentive is another unpleasant reminder that Cingular
    will likely shut down the TDMA network, as soon as they are allowed to
    turn off Analog by the FCC
    And with a TDMA service shut down, Cingular will also be abandoning
    many rural customers who have depended upon AMPS roaming provided by
    TDMA/AMPS capable handsets and plans.
    When all Cingular customers have a GSM phone, I foresee huge
    geographical areas (particularly out west), disappearing from the
    Cingular's coverage map.

    I suspect many CIngular customers are still using TDMA/AMPS plans
    because they would get reduced coverage on GSM, since current GSM
    phones are incapable of analog roaming.

    Of course, some customers are keeping grandfathered plans for the
    price, plan or simplified features.
    When the Analog TDMA plans are finally turned off, it will be
    interesting to see how many customers switch to another provider.
    Either Verizon, or Sprint, and (others?) are going to see a big bump in
    activations.
    It will be interesting to see how many trimode activations VZW picks
    up. That might provide some clues as to the number of people that still
    require analog capability.
    Any prognostications?

    -
    Dave




  7. #22
    John Navas
    Guest

    Re: $5 monthly surcharge

    On 1 Aug 2006 16:55:52 -0700, [email protected] wrote in
    <[email protected]>:

    >When all Cingular customers have a GSM phone, I foresee huge
    >geographical areas (particularly out west), disappearing from the
    >Cingular's coverage map.


    The Cingular coverage map is already limited to GSM coverage.
    <http://onlinestorez.cingular.com/cell-phone-service/images/maps/nat_gsm.gif>

    >I suspect many CIngular customers are still using TDMA/AMPS plans
    >because they would get reduced coverage on GSM, since current GSM
    >phones are incapable of analog roaming.


    I doubt that. According to figures released by Cingular, the remaining
    D-AMPS ("TDMA") customers are low volume callers that don't use their
    phones very much (8% of subscribers making only 2% of calls).

    > Of course, some customers are keeping grandfathered plans for the
    >price, plan or simplified features.


    I suspect that's the big factor, given the data above. The problem for
    these people is that none of the major carriers really want low revenue
    accounts. Their best bets may be prepaid plans.

    >When the Analog TDMA plans are finally turned off, it will be
    >interesting to see how many customers switch to another provider.
    >Either Verizon, or Sprint, and (others?) are going to see a big bump in
    >activations.


    I doubt that too, for reasons stated above.

    >It will be interesting to see how many trimode activations VZW picks
    >up. That might provide some clues as to the number of people that still
    >require analog capability.


    With AMPS going away, there's no real benefit to be had.

    >Any prognostications?


    Cingular will probably keep most of them.

    --
    Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
    John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>



  8. #23
    Joe Versaggi
    Guest

    Re: $5 monthly surcharge

    Jack Zwick wrote:
    > In article
    > <[email protected]>,
    > Joe Versaggi <[email protected]> wrote:
    > Uses only the inferior 1900 Mhz band (works less well indoors)
    > Much poorer coverage nationwide
    > Inferior Sanyo/Samsung phones
    > Inferior CDMA (worse voice quality)
    > Strange "Fair and Flexible" plan. Go 1 minute over your plan, get
    > charged $10.
    > No such thing as Rollover Minutes with Sprint
    > Horrible 800# support. Long hold times, CSRs on strict handle time limits


    Nokia CDMA works just fine with 5 of 7 bars about 40 feet in from the
    windows of a steel office building. People on the other end said I
    sounded as good as land line as slightly better than before with TDMA.

    Keep track of your minutes, and peak ends at 7pm, not 9pm.
    I had no Rollover with Stinkular.
    I need no 800# support other than to set up discounts at start-up.




  9. #24
    Jack Zwick
    Guest

    Re: $5 monthly surcharge

    In article
    <Jq%[email protected]>,
    Joe Versaggi <[email protected]> wrote:

    > Jack Zwick wrote:
    > > In article
    > > <[email protected]>,
    > > Joe Versaggi <[email protected]> wrote:
    > > Uses only the inferior 1900 Mhz band (works less well indoors)
    > > Much poorer coverage nationwide
    > > Inferior Sanyo/Samsung phones
    > > Inferior CDMA (worse voice quality)
    > > Strange "Fair and Flexible" plan. Go 1 minute over your plan, get
    > > charged $10.
    > > No such thing as Rollover Minutes with Sprint
    > > Horrible 800# support. Long hold times, CSRs on strict handle time limits

    >
    > Nokia CDMA works just fine with 5 of 7 bars about 40 feet in from the
    > windows of a steel office building. People on the other end said I
    > sounded as good as land line as slightly better than before with TDMA.
    >
    > Keep track of your minutes, and peak ends at 7pm, not 9pm.
    > I had no Rollover with Stinkular.
    > I need no 800# support other than to set up discounts at start-up.


    With any Carrier, likely you can't trust the "bars" on the phone any
    more. Carriers figured out they got fewer support calls if phones showed
    many bars with even the weakest signal.



  10. #25
    Thomas T. Veldhouse
    Guest

    Re: $5 monthly surcharge

    Kevin K <[email protected]> wrote:
    > If Sprint had decent coverage at my home, I would probably still have
    > them. Their 3G coverage is, as of today, still better.


    My experience with comparing Sprint and Cingular is that they are very
    comparable in coverage with the advantage going to Sprint because of their
    AMPS roaming ability. There are exceptions though. I get better Cingular
    coverage on the top floor with my current client (Cingular 800MHz), but I get
    better coverage on the bottom floor with Sprint PCS ... and inside room, I
    roam onto Verizon 800Mhz ... on Cingular I get nothing (Go Phone ... there is
    a T-Mobile antenna on top of the building, so perhaps it would roam on a
    regular plan). In any event, it is nearly a wash. However, in some locations
    that I am aware of (like a previous employer), Cingular has a little better
    coverage. In all cases, I see that Verizon has better coverage with digital
    than either SPrint or Cingular. In short, because I work with a diverse
    client base, I am often in trouble areas for all carriers, and Verizon seems
    to top the heap with ability to function in trouble areas with Cingular and
    Sprint being a near wash.

    If it wasn't for the fact that changing plans reinstitutes a new 2-year
    contract AND changing ESNs starts your two year timer over to get a discount
    on a new phone, I would probably consider Sprint for the future, but these
    issues really irk me. Plans and extras with Sprint are pretty good (free long
    distance on my home phone for 50 minutes / month and free calls to my home
    phone from my cellular phones ... no minutes used).

    --
    Thomas T. Veldhouse
    Key Fingerprint: 2DB9 813F F510 82C2 E1AE 34D0 D69D 1EDC D5EC AED1





  11. #26
    Thomas T. Veldhouse
    Guest

    Re: $5 monthly surcharge

    John Navas <[email protected]> wrote:
    >>It will be interesting to see how many trimode activations VZW picks
    >>up. That might provide some clues as to the number of people that still
    >>require analog capability.

    >
    > With AMPS going away, there's no real benefit to be had.
    >


    For two years AMPS will be around ... by mandate, and I suspect it will be
    around much longer in remote areas [where most users are likely to need it].
    Since most contracts with a carrier are two-years in length and often phones
    are replace every two years, I see absolutely no detriment to signing up with
    a tri-mode phone if it is what you are looking for.

    >>Any prognostications?

    >
    > Cingular will probably keep most of them.
    >


    Most likely, as those people have already shown resistance to change, and thus
    an implied brand loyalty.

    --
    Thomas T. Veldhouse
    Key Fingerprint: 2DB9 813F F510 82C2 E1AE 34D0 D69D 1EDC D5EC AED1





  12. #27
    Jud Hardcastle
    Guest

    Re: $5 monthly surcharge

    In article <[email protected]>, spamfilter0
    @navasgroup.com says...
    >
    > The Cingular coverage map is already limited to GSM coverage.
    > <http://onlinestorez.cingular.com/cell-phone-service/images/maps/nat_gsm.gif>
    >

    Which should carry a warning "Wear high boots when viewing" since it is
    still very inaccurate. It reflects TDMA carriers that have NOT finished
    their conversion and some that are going CDMA. TX doesn't have anywhere
    near that GSM coverage and probably never will.
    --
    Jud
    Dallas TX USA



  13. #28
    John Navas
    Guest

    Re: $5 monthly surcharge

    On Wed, 02 Aug 2006 13:43:40 GMT, "Thomas T. Veldhouse"
    <[email protected]> wrote in <[email protected]>:

    >John Navas <[email protected]> wrote:
    >>>It will be interesting to see how many trimode activations VZW picks
    >>>up. That might provide some clues as to the number of people that still
    >>>require analog capability.

    >>
    >> With AMPS going away, there's no real benefit to be had.

    >
    >For two years AMPS will be around ... by mandate,


    Actually just 18 months.

    >and I suspect it will be
    >around much longer in remote areas [where most users are likely to need it].
    >...


    I think it will go away much faster than you expect. It's expensive to
    maintain, and demand is falling.

    --
    Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
    John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>



  14. #29
    John Navas
    Guest

    Re: $5 monthly surcharge

    On Wed, 02 Aug 2006 13:39:53 GMT, "Thomas T. Veldhouse"
    <[email protected]> wrote in <[email protected]>:

    >Kevin K <[email protected]> wrote:
    >> If Sprint had decent coverage at my home, I would probably still have
    >> them. Their 3G coverage is, as of today, still better.

    >
    >My experience with comparing Sprint and Cingular is that they are very
    >comparable in coverage with the advantage going to Sprint because of their
    >AMPS roaming ability. There are exceptions though. I get better Cingular
    >coverage on the top floor with my current client (Cingular 800MHz), but I get
    >better coverage on the bottom floor with Sprint PCS ... and inside room, I
    >roam onto Verizon 800Mhz ... on Cingular I get nothing (Go Phone ... there is
    >a T-Mobile antenna on top of the building, so perhaps it would roam on a
    >regular plan). In any event, it is nearly a wash. However, in some locations
    >that I am aware of (like a previous employer), Cingular has a little better
    >coverage. In all cases, I see that Verizon has better coverage with digital
    >than either SPrint or Cingular. In short, because I work with a diverse
    >client base, I am often in trouble areas for all carriers, and Verizon seems
    >to top the heap with ability to function in trouble areas with Cingular and
    >Sprint being a near wash.


    Around here (Tri-Valley part of the San Francisco Bay Area), Cingular
    has the best coverage overall, followed by Verizon and T-Mobile, with
    Sprint-Nextel last.

    --
    Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
    John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>



  15. #30
    John Navas
    Guest

    Re: $5 monthly surcharge

    On Wed, 02 Aug 2006 13:03:16 GMT, Jack Zwick <[email protected]> wrote
    in <[email protected]>:

    >With any Carrier, likely you can't trust the "bars" on the phone any
    >more. Carriers figured out they got fewer support calls if phones showed
    >many bars with even the weakest signal.


    There's no evidence of phones have been changed that way.

    What is true is that you can't compare bars of signal between different
    brands, or even different models of the same brand, because there's no
    generally accepted standard for what bars mean.

    --
    Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
    John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>



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