Confirmation from Cingular on SmartPhone tethering

This is what I was told this morning when talking with Cingular's PDA
data connectivity department... Here is the information provided to me.

"...The SmartPhone unlimited data connect package gives you unlimited
data access to Cingular's WAP gatway at WAP.CINGULAR... bandwidth using
of the WAP.CINGULAR gateway is not audited on unlimited accounts as you
are paying for unlimited usage..... Since the SmartPhone devices can
tether data to a laptop using the WAP.CINGULAR gateway over GPRS EDGE,
you can use the Cingular 2125 (and presumably the 8125) in this way
with a SmartPhone unlimited account and you will not be billed
additional fees, THIS IS COVERED"

"... If you want higher connect speeds you need a Laptop data connect
account which will give you authorized access to the ISP.CINGULAR
gateway. If you configure your device to use the ISP.CINGULAR gateway
without purchasing the service, you stand to be billed for it and/or
have your account terminated"

Hopefully this clears it up for everyone. Notice I bolded THIS IS
COVERED because when he said that it just confirmed everything.

---

› See More: Confirmation from Cingular on SmartPhone tethering

On 15 Aug 2006 10:38:06 -0700, [email protected] wrote in
<[email protected]>:

>This is what I was told this morning when talking with Cingular's PDA
>data connectivity department... Here is the information provided to me.
>
>"...The SmartPhone unlimited data connect package gives you unlimited
>data access to Cingular's WAP gatway at WAP.CINGULAR... bandwidth using
>of the WAP.CINGULAR gateway is not audited on unlimited accounts as you
>are paying for unlimited usage..... Since the SmartPhone devices can
>tether data to a laptop using the WAP.CINGULAR gateway over GPRS EDGE,
>you can use the Cingular 2125 (and presumably the 8125) in this way
>with a SmartPhone unlimited account and you will not be billed
>additional fees, THIS IS COVERED"
>
>"... If you want higher connect speeds you need a Laptop data connect
>account which will give you authorized access to the ISP.CINGULAR
>gateway. If you configure your device to use the ISP.CINGULAR gateway
>without purchasing the service, you stand to be billed for it and/or
>have your account terminated"
>
>Hopefully this clears it up for everyone. Notice I bolded THIS IS
>COVERED because when he said that it just confirmed everything.

I suggest you get that in writing, because it's in direct conflict with
Terms and Conditions:

Furthermore, unlimited plans (except for DataConnect and Blackberry
Tethered) CANNOT BE USED FOR ANY APPLICATIONS THAT TETHER THE DEVICE
(through use of, including without limitation, connection kits, other
phone/PDA-to-computer accessories, Bluetooth® or any other wireless
technology) TO LAPTOPS, PCS, OR OTHER EQUIPMENT FOR ANY PURPOSE.
[emphasis in the original]

and Service Agreement
<https://onlinecare.cingular.com/my-account/legal/service-agreement.jsp>

36 Entire Agreement. This Agreement, together with the Sales Information
and all other documents and policies referenced herein, represent the
entire agreement between you and us, which may only be amended as
described in this Agreement. This Agreement supersedes any
inconsistent or additional representations made to you by any of our
representatives, agents or dealers. ...

--
Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

Well, in light of what I was finally able to get a Cingular support rep
to tell me... I think the terms your quoting can be easily interpreted
to support what I was told.

For example, notice how it says "... Furthermore, unlimited plans
(except for DataConnect and Blackberry Tethered) CANNOT BE USED FOR ANY
APPLICATIONS THAT TETHER THE DEVICE".

Notice it states except for: DataConnect and Blackberry Tethered.... It
does not say SmartPhone DataConnect tethered and Blackberry Thethered,
because according to the Cingular's service offerings there is no such
thing as a "SmartPhone DataConnect tethered" plan, there is however a
Blackberry Tethered plan.

So I think you could subtitie "DataConnect" in terms quoted for
"SmartPhone DataConnect", if you do that the terms you quoted would
read:

Furthermore, unlimited plans (except for [SmartPhone] DataConnect and
Blackberry Tethered) CANNOT BE USED FOR ANY APPLICATIONS THAT TETHER
THE DEVICE (through use of, including without limitation, connection
kits, other phone/PDA-to-computer accessories, Bluetooth® or any other
wireless technology) TO LAPTOPS, PCS, OR OTHER EQUIPMENT FOR ANY
PURPOSE. [emphasis in the original]

Now that would make sense, it's still confusing but it makes sense and
it lines up with what Cingular support has stated, what sales reps are
stating and what end users are experiencing....




John Navas wrote:
> On 15 Aug 2006 10:38:06 -0700, [email protected] wrote in
> <[email protected]>:
>
> >This is what I was told this morning when talking with Cingular's PDA
> >data connectivity department... Here is the information provided to me.
> >
> >"...The SmartPhone unlimited data connect package gives you unlimited
> >data access to Cingular's WAP gatway at WAP.CINGULAR... bandwidth using
> >of the WAP.CINGULAR gateway is not audited on unlimited accounts as you
> >are paying for unlimited usage..... Since the SmartPhone devices can
> >tether data to a laptop using the WAP.CINGULAR gateway over GPRS EDGE,
> >you can use the Cingular 2125 (and presumably the 8125) in this way
> >with a SmartPhone unlimited account and you will not be billed
> >additional fees, THIS IS COVERED"
> >
> >"... If you want higher connect speeds you need a Laptop data connect
> >account which will give you authorized access to the ISP.CINGULAR
> >gateway. If you configure your device to use the ISP.CINGULAR gateway
> >without purchasing the service, you stand to be billed for it and/or
> >have your account terminated"
> >
> >Hopefully this clears it up for everyone. Notice I bolded THIS IS
> >COVERED because when he said that it just confirmed everything.
>
> I suggest you get that in writing, because it's in direct conflict with
> Terms and Conditions:
>
> Furthermore, unlimited plans (except for DataConnect and Blackberry
> Tethered) CANNOT BE USED FOR ANY APPLICATIONS THAT TETHER THE DEVICE
> (through use of, including without limitation, connection kits, other
> phone/PDA-to-computer accessories, Bluetooth® or any other wireless
> technology) TO LAPTOPS, PCS, OR OTHER EQUIPMENT FOR ANY PURPOSE.
> [emphasis in the original]
>
> and Service Agreement
> <https://onlinecare.cingular.com/my-account/legal/service-agreement.jsp>
>
> 36 Entire Agreement. This Agreement, together with the Sales Information
> and all other documents and policies referenced herein, represent the
> entire agreement between you and us, which may only be amended as
> described in this Agreement. This Agreement supersedes any
> inconsistent or additional representations made to you by any of our
> representatives, agents or dealers. ...
>
> --
> Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
> John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

I disagree completely.

On 15 Aug 2006 12:05:37 -0700, [email protected] wrote in
<[email protected]>:

>Well, in light of what I was finally able to get a Cingular support rep
>to tell me... I think the terms your quoting can be easily interpreted
>to support what I was told.
>
>For example, notice how it says "... Furthermore, unlimited plans
>(except for DataConnect and Blackberry Tethered) CANNOT BE USED FOR ANY
>APPLICATIONS THAT TETHER THE DEVICE".
>
>Notice it states except for: DataConnect and Blackberry Tethered.... It
>does not say SmartPhone DataConnect tethered and Blackberry Thethered,
>because according to the Cingular's service offerings there is no such
>thing as a "SmartPhone DataConnect tethered" plan, there is however a
>Blackberry Tethered plan.
>
>So I think you could subtitie "DataConnect" in terms quoted for
>"SmartPhone DataConnect", if you do that the terms you quoted would
>read:
>
> Furthermore, unlimited plans (except for [SmartPhone] DataConnect and
>Blackberry Tethered) CANNOT BE USED FOR ANY APPLICATIONS THAT TETHER
>THE DEVICE (through use of, including without limitation, connection
>kits, other phone/PDA-to-computer accessories, Bluetooth® or any other
>wireless technology) TO LAPTOPS, PCS, OR OTHER EQUIPMENT FOR ANY
>PURPOSE. [emphasis in the original]
>
>Now that would make sense, it's still confusing but it makes sense and
>it lines up with what Cingular support has stated, what sales reps are
>stating and what end users are experiencing....
>
>
>
>
>John Navas wrote:
>> On 15 Aug 2006 10:38:06 -0700, [email protected] wrote in
>> <[email protected]>:
>>
>> >This is what I was told this morning when talking with Cingular's PDA
>> >data connectivity department... Here is the information provided to me.
>> >
>> >"...The SmartPhone unlimited data connect package gives you unlimited
>> >data access to Cingular's WAP gatway at WAP.CINGULAR... bandwidth using
>> >of the WAP.CINGULAR gateway is not audited on unlimited accounts as you
>> >are paying for unlimited usage..... Since the SmartPhone devices can
>> >tether data to a laptop using the WAP.CINGULAR gateway over GPRS EDGE,
>> >you can use the Cingular 2125 (and presumably the 8125) in this way
>> >with a SmartPhone unlimited account and you will not be billed
>> >additional fees, THIS IS COVERED"
>> >
>> >"... If you want higher connect speeds you need a Laptop data connect
>> >account which will give you authorized access to the ISP.CINGULAR
>> >gateway. If you configure your device to use the ISP.CINGULAR gateway
>> >without purchasing the service, you stand to be billed for it and/or
>> >have your account terminated"
>> >
>> >Hopefully this clears it up for everyone. Notice I bolded THIS IS
>> >COVERED because when he said that it just confirmed everything.
>>
>> I suggest you get that in writing, because it's in direct conflict with
>> Terms and Conditions:
>>
>> Furthermore, unlimited plans (except for DataConnect and Blackberry
>> Tethered) CANNOT BE USED FOR ANY APPLICATIONS THAT TETHER THE DEVICE
>> (through use of, including without limitation, connection kits, other
>> phone/PDA-to-computer accessories, Bluetooth® or any other wireless
>> technology) TO LAPTOPS, PCS, OR OTHER EQUIPMENT FOR ANY PURPOSE.
>> [emphasis in the original]
>>
>> and Service Agreement
>> <https://onlinecare.cingular.com/my-account/legal/service-agreement.jsp>
>>
>> 36 Entire Agreement. This Agreement, together with the Sales Information
>> and all other documents and policies referenced herein, represent the
>> entire agreement between you and us, which may only be amended as
>> described in this Agreement. This Agreement supersedes any
>> inconsistent or additional representations made to you by any of our
>> representatives, agents or dealers. ...
>>
>> --
>> Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
>> John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

--
Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

Ok, well I can see how two people could interpret those terms
differently. You're basically saying "no way.... It's got to be the way
I see it", except all tangible evidence is against you.

Which leads me to wonder what exactly it would it take to convince
you....

Out of curiosoity what's your primary mobile device? Do you even own s
SmartPhone?



John Navas wrote:
> I disagree completely.
>
> On 15 Aug 2006 12:05:37 -0700, [email protected] wrote in
> <[email protected]>:
>
> >Well, in light of what I was finally able to get a Cingular support rep
> >to tell me... I think the terms your quoting can be easily interpreted
> >to support what I was told.
> >
> >For example, notice how it says "... Furthermore, unlimited plans
> >(except for DataConnect and Blackberry Tethered) CANNOT BE USED FOR ANY
> >APPLICATIONS THAT TETHER THE DEVICE".
> >
> >Notice it states except for: DataConnect and Blackberry Tethered.... It
> >does not say SmartPhone DataConnect tethered and Blackberry Thethered,
> >because according to the Cingular's service offerings there is no such
> >thing as a "SmartPhone DataConnect tethered" plan, there is however a
> >Blackberry Tethered plan.
> >
> >So I think you could subtitie "DataConnect" in terms quoted for
> >"SmartPhone DataConnect", if you do that the terms you quoted would
> >read:
> >
> > Furthermore, unlimited plans (except for [SmartPhone] DataConnect and
> >Blackberry Tethered) CANNOT BE USED FOR ANY APPLICATIONS THAT TETHER
> >THE DEVICE (through use of, including without limitation, connection
> >kits, other phone/PDA-to-computer accessories, Bluetooth® or any other
> >wireless technology) TO LAPTOPS, PCS, OR OTHER EQUIPMENT FOR ANY
> >PURPOSE. [emphasis in the original]
> >
> >Now that would make sense, it's still confusing but it makes sense and
> >it lines up with what Cingular support has stated, what sales reps are
> >stating and what end users are experiencing....
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >John Navas wrote:
> >> On 15 Aug 2006 10:38:06 -0700, [email protected] wrote in
> >> <[email protected]>:
> >>
> >> >This is what I was told this morning when talking with Cingular's PDA
> >> >data connectivity department... Here is the information provided to me.
> >> >
> >> >"...The SmartPhone unlimited data connect package gives you unlimited
> >> >data access to Cingular's WAP gatway at WAP.CINGULAR... bandwidth using
> >> >of the WAP.CINGULAR gateway is not audited on unlimited accounts as you
> >> >are paying for unlimited usage..... Since the SmartPhone devices can
> >> >tether data to a laptop using the WAP.CINGULAR gateway over GPRS EDGE,
> >> >you can use the Cingular 2125 (and presumably the 8125) in this way
> >> >with a SmartPhone unlimited account and you will not be billed
> >> >additional fees, THIS IS COVERED"
> >> >
> >> >"... If you want higher connect speeds you need a Laptop data connect
> >> >account which will give you authorized access to the ISP.CINGULAR
> >> >gateway. If you configure your device to use the ISP.CINGULAR gateway
> >> >without purchasing the service, you stand to be billed for it and/or
> >> >have your account terminated"
> >> >
> >> >Hopefully this clears it up for everyone. Notice I bolded THIS IS
> >> >COVERED because when he said that it just confirmed everything.
> >>
> >> I suggest you get that in writing, because it's in direct conflict with
> >> Terms and Conditions:
> >>
> >> Furthermore, unlimited plans (except for DataConnect and Blackberry
> >> Tethered) CANNOT BE USED FOR ANY APPLICATIONS THAT TETHER THE DEVICE
> >> (through use of, including without limitation, connection kits, other
> >> phone/PDA-to-computer accessories, Bluetooth® or any other wireless
> >> technology) TO LAPTOPS, PCS, OR OTHER EQUIPMENT FOR ANY PURPOSE.
> >> [emphasis in the original]
> >>
> >> and Service Agreement
> >> <https://onlinecare.cingular.com/my-account/legal/service-agreement.jsp>
> >>
> >> 36 Entire Agreement. This Agreement, together with the Sales Information
> >> and all other documents and policies referenced herein, represent the
> >> entire agreement between you and us, which may only be amended as
> >> described in this Agreement. This Agreement supersedes any
> >> inconsistent or additional representations made to you by any of our
> >> representatives, agents or dealers. ...
> >>
> >> --
> >> Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
> >> John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>
>
> --
> Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
> John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

[email protected] wrote:
> Ok, well I can see how two people could interpret those terms
> differently. You're basically saying "no way.... It's got to be the way
> I see it", except all tangible evidence is against you.

Welcome to Navasland...

No thanks, I'm leaving Navasland now....

DecaturTxCowboy wrote:
> [email protected] wrote:
> > Ok, well I can see how two people could interpret those terms
> > differently. You're basically saying "no way.... It's got to be the way
> > I see it", except all tangible evidence is against you.
>
> Welcome to Navasland...

Jeremy,

Your point is that there is no such thing as "Smartphone DataConnect
tethered," but where your confusion lies, is that there really isn't even a
such a thing as Smartphone DataConnect. It is called "Smartphone Connect,"
without the word Data. Big difference, completely different product
offering.

They break it down into simple terms on this page:
http://www.cingular.com/midtolarge/data_connect

The first chart is for "Smartphone Connect"

The second chart is for "DataConnect or tethered devices," and notice the
price for unlimited.

The rep you spoke to is a dumb ass. There is no way that you would be able
to get in writing what he told you over the phone. To insert the word
Smartphone in there before DataConnect would not make sense, and would
probably cause quite a laugh if the argument were heard in a court. Your
best bet on any legal protection would probably be to record the entire call
from beginning to end with the rep stating what you said. But even then, it
probably would not hold up, because there is still no such thing as
Smartphone unlimited Data Connect.

John is correct here, even though he does not have a Smartphone or data
connect. However, his reply of "I disagree completely," shows how his
personality disorder prevents him from explaining why he is right.

My opinion is that none of this even matters. Cingular has never taken away
unlimited data privileges for tethering yet, and there is nothing to suggest
that they will in the future. The dispute would never make it to court, and
you will not get charged even for violating the terms.

By the way, how much are you paying for this data plan, 19.99 or 44.99?

jay420



<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
Ok, well I can see how two people could interpret those terms
differently. You're basically saying "no way.... It's got to be the way
I see it", except all tangible evidence is against you.

Which leads me to wonder what exactly it would it take to convince
you....

Out of curiosoity what's your primary mobile device? Do you even own s
SmartPhone?



John Navas wrote:
> I disagree completely.
>
> On 15 Aug 2006 12:05:37 -0700, [email protected] wrote in
> <[email protected]>:
>
> >Well, in light of what I was finally able to get a Cingular support rep
> >to tell me... I think the terms your quoting can be easily interpreted
> >to support what I was told.
> >
> >For example, notice how it says "... Furthermore, unlimited plans
> >(except for DataConnect and Blackberry Tethered) CANNOT BE USED FOR ANY
> >APPLICATIONS THAT TETHER THE DEVICE".
> >
> >Notice it states except for: DataConnect and Blackberry Tethered.... It
> >does not say SmartPhone DataConnect tethered and Blackberry Thethered,
> >because according to the Cingular's service offerings there is no such
> >thing as a "SmartPhone DataConnect tethered" plan, there is however a
> >Blackberry Tethered plan.
> >
> >So I think you could subtitie "DataConnect" in terms quoted for
> >"SmartPhone DataConnect", if you do that the terms you quoted would
> >read:
> >
> > Furthermore, unlimited plans (except for [SmartPhone] DataConnect and
> >Blackberry Tethered) CANNOT BE USED FOR ANY APPLICATIONS THAT TETHER
> >THE DEVICE (through use of, including without limitation, connection
> >kits, other phone/PDA-to-computer accessories, Bluetooth® or any other
> >wireless technology) TO LAPTOPS, PCS, OR OTHER EQUIPMENT FOR ANY
> >PURPOSE. [emphasis in the original]
> >
> >Now that would make sense, it's still confusing but it makes sense and
> >it lines up with what Cingular support has stated, what sales reps are
> >stating and what end users are experiencing....
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >John Navas wrote:
> >> On 15 Aug 2006 10:38:06 -0700, [email protected] wrote in
> >> <[email protected]>:
> >>
> >> >This is what I was told this morning when talking with Cingular's PDA
> >> >data connectivity department... Here is the information provided to
> >> >me.
> >> >
> >> >"...The SmartPhone unlimited data connect package gives you unlimited
> >> >data access to Cingular's WAP gatway at WAP.CINGULAR... bandwidth
> >> >using
> >> >of the WAP.CINGULAR gateway is not audited on unlimited accounts as
> >> >you
> >> >are paying for unlimited usage..... Since the SmartPhone devices can
> >> >tether data to a laptop using the WAP.CINGULAR gateway over GPRS EDGE,
> >> >you can use the Cingular 2125 (and presumably the 8125) in this way
> >> >with a SmartPhone unlimited account and you will not be billed
> >> >additional fees, THIS IS COVERED"
> >> >
> >> >"... If you want higher connect speeds you need a Laptop data connect
> >> >account which will give you authorized access to the ISP.CINGULAR
> >> >gateway. If you configure your device to use the ISP.CINGULAR gateway
> >> >without purchasing the service, you stand to be billed for it and/or
> >> >have your account terminated"
> >> >
> >> >Hopefully this clears it up for everyone. Notice I bolded THIS IS
> >> >COVERED because when he said that it just confirmed everything.
> >>
> >> I suggest you get that in writing, because it's in direct conflict with
> >> Terms and Conditions:
> >>
> >> Furthermore, unlimited plans (except for DataConnect and Blackberry
> >> Tethered) CANNOT BE USED FOR ANY APPLICATIONS THAT TETHER THE DEVICE
> >> (through use of, including without limitation, connection kits,
> >> other
> >> phone/PDA-to-computer accessories, Bluetooth® or any other wireless
> >> technology) TO LAPTOPS, PCS, OR OTHER EQUIPMENT FOR ANY PURPOSE.
> >> [emphasis in the original]
> >>
> >> and Service Agreement
> >> <https://onlinecare.cingular.com/my-account/legal/service-agreement.jsp>
> >>
> >> 36 Entire Agreement. This Agreement, together with the Sales
> >> Information
> >> and all other documents and policies referenced herein, represent
> >> the
> >> entire agreement between you and us, which may only be amended as
> >> described in this Agreement. This Agreement supersedes any
> >> inconsistent or additional representations made to you by any of our
> >> representatives, agents or dealers. ...
> >>
> >> --
> >> Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
> >> John Navas
> >> <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>
>
> --
> Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
> John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

On Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:38:35 -0400, "jay420" <[email protected]> wrote
in <[email protected]>:

>John is correct here, even though he does not have a Smartphone or data
>connect.

I've actually had both.

>However, his reply of "I disagree completely," shows how his
>personality disorder prevents him from explaining why he is right.

Was that supposed to be funny?

I didn't explain further because: (1) I had already explained the reason
in detail, complete with citations, and saw no point in repeating
myself; and (2) Jeremy has a closed mind, is quite rude, and I'm not
going to waste time on a pointless argument.

--
Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

"John Navas" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Tue, 15 Aug 2006 21:38:35 -0400, "jay420" <[email protected]> wrote
> in <[email protected]>:
>
>>John is correct here, even though he does not have a Smartphone or data
>>connect.
>
> I've actually had both.
>

You HAD both, but you don't HAVE both. What you HAVE is old MediaWorks
unlimited that is no longer offered. I was only talking about the present.
What you had in the past is most likely completely different from the terms
of today, and one would assume that you make your points based on what
Cingular's terms say, as would I.



>>However, his reply of "I disagree completely," shows how his
>>personality disorder prevents him from explaining why he is right.
>
> Was that supposed to be funny?
>
> I didn't explain further because: (1) I had already explained the reason
> in detail, complete with citations, and saw no point in repeating
> myself; and (2) Jeremy has a closed mind, is quite rude, and I'm not
> going to waste time on a pointless argument.
>

Yeah, I was just being funny. I rescind the statement.

http://onlinestorez.cingular.com/cel...tid=2206800007


Good point, the plan is called SmartPhone connect unlimited. For
billing purposes it shows up as MediaNet Data Connect Unlimited. It's
$20 month. If you take a look at the page I sent it is a bit confusing
because the section at the bottom is for SmartPhone devices.... For
example, I can not add Unlimted Data Connect to my account, but I can
add SmartPhone data connect. I've had this confirmed twice now. Once by
the sales clerk who added the SmartPhone connect/MediaNet data connect
to my account and once by PDA customer support.

Also, the Cingular 8125 is a PDA, but it's also a SmartPhone.... I was
told "that PDA counts as a SmartPhone so it qualifies for the $20/month
SmartPhone connect plan, which would save you quite a bit". The clerk
was comparing the SmartPhone data plan to the normal PDA data connect..

There will be no going to court. It's highly unlikely Cingular would
sue a customer. The worst action they would likely take is to terminate
your account if you did not pay up for a service they thought you
shouldn't have, but as you said they haven't yet.

FACTS we have to work with:

* According to populat blog postings, Cingular customers have been
using the described method to tether a laptop connection over
WAP.CINGULAR using the Cingular 2125 and 8125 devices for at least
since Jan 06 (the past seven months) with no termination of service or
billing problems

* Cingular sales clerks and support staff are telling customers that
with SmartPhone devices tethering over WAP.CINGULAR is acceptable

* The two products Cingular currently carries that qualify as
SmartPhone (i.e. Microsoft SmartPhone) devices are the 8125 and 2125.
Both of these devices are Cingular branded, Cingular is the US vendor
for these products and in the users manual for both devices it is
described in detail how to use the device as a "ModemLink" though USB
to "tether".

* On Cingular's offical (moderated) message board, detailed
instructions for setting up the device are provided many months ago.
Following the advice in these instructions successfully puts the device
in tethering mode.

* There have media reviews by popular magazines that discuss using the
device as a modem for laptop with MediaNet (MediaNet implies WAP, not
laptop connect or PDA data connect).

*This link (which was written by an end user)
http://www.momathome.com/viewfromhom...data_plans.php
Also supports what I was told, that PDA data connect makes use of
ISP.CINGULAR while WAP.CINGULAR is a different gateway altogeather with
a different pricing model against it.




jay420 wrote:
> Jeremy,
>
> Your point is that there is no such thing as "Smartphone DataConnect
> tethered," but where your confusion lies, is that there really isn't evena
> such a thing as Smartphone DataConnect. It is called "Smartphone Connect,"
> without the word Data. Big difference, completely different product
> offering.
>
> They break it down into simple terms on this page:
> http://www.cingular.com/midtolarge/data_connect
>
> The first chart is for "Smartphone Connect"
>
> The second chart is for "DataConnect or tethered devices," and notice the
> price for unlimited.
>
> The rep you spoke to is a dumb ass. There is no way that you would be able
> to get in writing what he told you over the phone. To insert the word
> Smartphone in there before DataConnect would not make sense, and would
> probably cause quite a laugh if the argument were heard in a court. Your
> best bet on any legal protection would probably be to record the entire call
> from beginning to end with the rep stating what you said. But even then,it
> probably would not hold up, because there is still no such thing as
> Smartphone unlimited Data Connect.
>
> John is correct here, even though he does not have a Smartphone or data
> connect. However, his reply of "I disagree completely," shows how his
> personality disorder prevents him from explaining why he is right.
>
> My opinion is that none of this even matters. Cingular has never taken away
> unlimited data privileges for tethering yet, and there is nothing to suggest
> that they will in the future. The dispute would never make it to court, and
> you will not get charged even for violating the terms.
>
> By the way, how much are you paying for this data plan, 19.99 or 44.99?
>
> jay420
>
>
>
> <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> Ok, well I can see how two people could interpret those terms
> differently. You're basically saying "no way.... It's got to be the way
> I see it", except all tangible evidence is against you.
>
> Which leads me to wonder what exactly it would it take to convince
> you....
>
> Out of curiosoity what's your primary mobile device? Do you even own s
> SmartPhone?
>
>
>
> John Navas wrote:
> > I disagree completely.
> >
> > On 15 Aug 2006 12:05:37 -0700, [email protected] wrote in
> > <[email protected]>:
> >
> > >Well, in light of what I was finally able to get a Cingular support rep
> > >to tell me... I think the terms your quoting can be easily interpreted
> > >to support what I was told.
> > >
> > >For example, notice how it says "... Furthermore, unlimited plans
> > >(except for DataConnect and Blackberry Tethered) CANNOT BE USED FOR ANY
> > >APPLICATIONS THAT TETHER THE DEVICE".
> > >
> > >Notice it states except for: DataConnect and Blackberry Tethered.... It
> > >does not say SmartPhone DataConnect tethered and Blackberry Thethered,
> > >because according to the Cingular's service offerings there is no such
> > >thing as a "SmartPhone DataConnect tethered" plan, there is however a
> > >Blackberry Tethered plan.
> > >
> > >So I think you could subtitie "DataConnect" in terms quoted for
> > >"SmartPhone DataConnect", if you do that the terms you quoted would
> > >read:
> > >
> > > Furthermore, unlimited plans (except for [SmartPhone] DataConnect and
> > >Blackberry Tethered) CANNOT BE USED FOR ANY APPLICATIONS THAT TETHER
> > >THE DEVICE (through use of, including without limitation, connection
> > >kits, other phone/PDA-to-computer accessories, Bluetooth® or any other
> > >wireless technology) TO LAPTOPS, PCS, OR OTHER EQUIPMENT FOR ANY
> > >PURPOSE. [emphasis in the original]
> > >
> > >Now that would make sense, it's still confusing but it makes sense and
> > >it lines up with what Cingular support has stated, what sales reps are
> > >stating and what end users are experiencing....
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >John Navas wrote:
> > >> On 15 Aug 2006 10:38:06 -0700, [email protected] wrote in
> > >> <[email protected]>:
> > >>
> > >> >This is what I was told this morning when talking with Cingular's PDA
> > >> >data connectivity department... Here is the information provided to
> > >> >me.
> > >> >
> > >> >"...The SmartPhone unlimited data connect package gives you unlimited
> > >> >data access to Cingular's WAP gatway at WAP.CINGULAR... bandwidth
> > >> >using
> > >> >of the WAP.CINGULAR gateway is not audited on unlimited accounts as
> > >> >you
> > >> >are paying for unlimited usage..... Since the SmartPhone devices can
> > >> >tether data to a laptop using the WAP.CINGULAR gateway over GPRS EDGE,
> > >> >you can use the Cingular 2125 (and presumably the 8125) in this way
> > >> >with a SmartPhone unlimited account and you will not be billed
> > >> >additional fees, THIS IS COVERED"
> > >> >
> > >> >"... If you want higher connect speeds you need a Laptop data connect
> > >> >account which will give you authorized access to the ISP.CINGULAR
> > >> >gateway. If you configure your device to use the ISP.CINGULAR gateway
> > >> >without purchasing the service, you stand to be billed for it and/or
> > >> >have your account terminated"
> > >> >
> > >> >Hopefully this clears it up for everyone. Notice I bolded THIS IS
> > >> >COVERED because when he said that it just confirmed everything.
> > >>
> > >> I suggest you get that in writing, because it's in direct conflict with
> > >> Terms and Conditions:
> > >>
> > >> Furthermore, unlimited plans (except for DataConnect and Blackberry
> > >> Tethered) CANNOT BE USED FOR ANY APPLICATIONS THAT TETHER THE DEVICE
> > >> (through use of, including without limitation, connection kits,
> > >> other
> > >> phone/PDA-to-computer accessories, Bluetooth® or any other wireless
> > >> technology) TO LAPTOPS, PCS, OR OTHER EQUIPMENT FOR ANY PURPOSE.
> > >> [emphasis in the original]
> > >>
> > >> and Service Agreement
> > >> <https://onlinecare.cingular.com/my-account/legal/service-agreement.jsp>
> > >>
> > >> 36 Entire Agreement. This Agreement, together with the Sales
> > >> Information
> > >> and all other documents and policies referenced herein, represent
> > >> the
> > >> entire agreement between you and us, which may only be amended as
> > >> described in this Agreement. This Agreement supersedes any
> > >> inconsistent or additional representations made to you by any of our
> > >> representatives, agents or dealers. ...
> > >>
> > >> --
> > >> Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
> > >> John Navas
> > >> <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>
> >
> > --
> > Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
> > John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

[email protected] wrote:
> There will be no going to court. It's highly unlikely Cingular would
> sue a customer. The worst action they would likely take is to terminate
> your account if you did not pay up for a service they thought you
> shouldn't have, but as you said they haven't yet.

The suing would be by a customer trying to get out from under a $4,000
bill after the MEdiaNet Unlimited was dropped and tethering led to huge
charges before the pay-as-you-go was discovered (probably when the bill
arrived).

I'm surprised you didn't find those commentaries when you did your web
research.

--
---
Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley Lake, CA, USA GPS: 38.8,-122.5

On Tue, 15 Aug 2006 22:46:44 -0400, "jay420" <[email protected]> wrote
in <[email protected]>:

>"John Navas" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...

>> I've actually had both.
>
>You HAD both, but you don't HAVE both. What you HAVE is old MediaWorks
>unlimited that is no longer offered. I was only talking about the present.
>What you had in the past is most likely completely different from the terms
>of today, and one would assume that you make your points based on what
>Cingular's terms say, as would I.

I don't need to HAVE it to be able to read and understand the Terms and
Conditions. I'm guessing you don't either. Your point?

--
Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

On Wed, 16 Aug 2006 03:30:05 +0000 (UTC), [email protected]
wrote in <[email protected]>:

>[email protected] wrote:
>> There will be no going to court. It's highly unlikely Cingular would
>> sue a customer. The worst action they would likely take is to terminate
>> your account if you did not pay up for a service they thought you
>> shouldn't have, but as you said they haven't yet.
>
>The suing would be by a customer trying to get out from under a $4,000
>bill after the MEdiaNet Unlimited was dropped and tethering led to huge
>charges before the pay-as-you-go was discovered (probably when the bill
>arrived).

There would be no suing either way -- the Service Agreement specifies
mandatory arbitration.

--
Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

Not being sarcastic in the slightest, I just honestly want to know if
you can find a link to one person detailing this actually happening to
them...

I've searced and can't find one instance, if there was one it would be
relatively isolated based on what I've found, it would also contradict
what I've been told (and what others appear to have been told) by
Cingular, but at least it would give some weight to the other side of
this argument, which so far consist of a series of personal
disagreements without merit by a seemingly over confident end user who
happens to manage a Wikipedia info page on the topic.
..


[email protected] wrote:
> [email protected] wrote:
> > There will be no going to court. It's highly unlikely Cingular would
> > sue a customer. The worst action they would likely take is to terminate
> > your account if you did not pay up for a service they thought you
> > shouldn't have, but as you said they haven't yet.
>
> The suing would be by a customer trying to get out from under a $4,000
> bill after the MEdiaNet Unlimited was dropped and tethering led to huge
> charges before the pay-as-you-go was discovered (probably when the bill
> arrived).
>
> I'm surprised you didn't find those commentaries when you did your web
> research.
>
> --
> ---
> Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley Lake, CA, USA GPS: 38.8,-122.5