Apple's New Calling: The iPhone

In article <[email protected]>,
Lefty Bigfoot <[email protected]> wrote:

> RAZRs are popular and all, but not the
> same buzz.

Exactly. RAZRs are popular because the stores push them and they are in
the magic price range. Nothing cool about 'em, really. Crap-ass OS(s),
that's for sure!

---

› See More: Apple's New Calling: The iPhone

In article <[email protected]>,
Todd Allcock <[email protected]> wrote:

> At 10 Jan 2007 15:07:11 +0000 [email protected] wrote:
>
>
> > You apparently haven't been reading a fair cross section of reviews...
> >
>
> Good reviews won't make a $500 phone more attractive to those not willing
> to spend half a grand on a phone. It will certainly be a success, but
> not a RAZR-like success, at least not at first.

The iPhone is more than a phone, though, and plenty of people will see
that and be willing to pony up half a grand for all the things is does.
Apple may have to drop the iPhone name because they are being sued by
Cisco, who hold the trademark. It may be good for Apple to come up with
a name that is more inclusive of its functionality. It's clearly not
_just_ a phone.

--
John S. Heaney
I don't train in Aikido to protect myself from the world,
but to protect the world from me.

John Heaney wrote:
> In article <[email protected]>,
> "larwe" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> Looks as if there was an iCal icon on the iPhone, and likely that will
>> sync with a .mac account. What more do you want out of a PDA?
>
> Ironically, despite Steve's disdain, a stylus. The last generation
> Newton actually had excellent handwriting recognition. Apple invented
> the PDA, but killed it just when it fulfilled its promise. I actually
> used one for seven years before I finally couldn't deal with the battery
> situation and the lack of syncing.

Very good points. I've used the tablet PCs since the beginning, since I
worked on the concept unit that Microsoft built. The handwriting
recognition was awesome. A stylus, with the proper screen, could turn
the iPhone into more of a new Newton. Then the $500-600 price wouldn't
seem high. They could even do a phone-less version for those of us that
can't use Cingular.

larwe wrote:
> SMS wrote:
>
>>> What is the actual market penetration of 3G in general in the United
>>> States (Apple's primary market)?
>> 3G is available in all major metro areas, and most minor metro areas.
>
> That's coverage; not what I was asking. I know the carriers want to
> sell streaming pornography to every cellphone in the world, but who is
> buying 3G service right now, and for what are they using it?

They are selling it to people with wireless modems in their notebook and
tablet computers.

If you look at the iPhone as more of a web-pad, 3G is essential. No one
will be buying an iPhone just for the phone function. I think Cisco is
doing Apple a favor. They should rename it to something that emphasizes
its web browsing, video, and audio capabilities. They can expand the
market to people that can't or won't use Cingular.

In article <[email protected]>,
Tim McNamara <[email protected]> wrote:

> In article <[email protected]>,
> Lefty Bigfoot <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > On Wed, 10 Jan 2007 20:50:44 -0600, Kurt wrote (in article
> > <[email protected]>):
> >
> > > It was downhill from the Startac for Motorola.
> >
> > Very good point. That was the last "Gee, I gotta have one of those"
> > cell phones, and that was a long time ago.
>
> I dunno. I see a *lot* of RAZR phones around here. Seems like about a
> third of the phones I see are RAZRs.

The RAZR looks cool, I guess, but it has crappy reception and badly
designed software.

I know a couple of people with RAZRs on T-Mobile who complain they only
get reception in my apartment right next to a window. A couple of them
has taken to leaving their phones sitting by the window when they come
over so they don't miss calls. This is, mind you, in the middle of
Manhattan, which probably has some of the best cellular coverage in the
country.

For comparison, I have a four year old Nokia 3650 on T-Mobile that gets
*good* reception anywhere in the apartment. It's really almost comical.
The phone will have three or four bars and make or receive calls in
places where RAZRs don't even see the network.

Hopefully Apple, while implementing all the slick features on the
iPhone, has also paid attention to the basics.

--
"That's George Washington, the first president, of course. The interesting thing
about him is that I read three--three or four books about him last year. Isn't
that interesting?"
- George W. Bush to reporter Kai Diekmann, May 5, 2006

In article <[email protected]>,
"larwe" <[email protected]> wrote:

> SMS wrote:
>
> > > What is the actual market penetration of 3G in general in the United
> > > States (Apple's primary market)?
> >
> > 3G is available in all major metro areas, and most minor metro areas.
>
> That's coverage; not what I was asking. I know the carriers want to
> sell streaming pornography to every cellphone in the world, but who is
> buying 3G service right now, and for what are they using it?
>
> Besides streaming video, I haven't yet seen an application. All the
> carriers either lock out or charge EXORBITANT rates for the one
> application I'd find useful, which is using the phone as a cellular
> modem with my laptop.

My hope is that Jobs has been beating Cingular executives with his
anodized aluminum clue stick, and convinced them that in a few years,
everyone will have an iPhone, and they'll make a lot more money selling
cheap high-speed data services to everyone instead of obscenely priced
high-speed data services to, well, almost nobody.

[snip]

--
"That's George Washington, the first president, of course. The interesting thing
about him is that I read three--three or four books about him last year. Isn't
that interesting?"
- George W. Bush to reporter Kai Diekmann, May 5, 2006

In article <1hrrpfh.lnwt64x2ki1fN%[email protected]>,
[email protected]lid (Per Rønne) wrote:

> Mij Adyaw <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > Apple may have made a serious mistake in not offering the phone on America's
> > Most Reliable Network. It is interesting that they chose GSM rather than the
> > technically superior CDMA.
>
> Had they done that it had been unusable outside the US.
>
> They did, however, make an error when they choosed to support EDGE but
> not 3G.

Jobs said during they keynote they'd have 3G models later. Cingular is
doing a pretty big 3G rollout this year, and of course they'll want 3G
when they launch in non-US markets.

> And what about FM and DAB radio support?

--
"That's George Washington, the first president, of course. The interesting thing
about him is that I read three--three or four books about him last year. Isn't
that interesting?"
- George W. Bush to reporter Kai Diekmann, May 5, 2006

In article <100120071943213051%[email protected]>,
Randall Ainsworth <[email protected]> wrote:

> In article <[email protected]>, Kurt
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > But the Razr is a crap phone. Tons of user complaints.
>
> I like mine fine. It lets me place and receive calls. What more do you
> want?

According to many, it has often has problems even doing that.

--
To reply by email, remove the word "space"

In article <[email protected]>,
John Heaney <[email protected]> wrote:

> Apple may have to drop the iPhone name because they are being sued by
> Cisco, who hold the trademark.

That's almost ironed out.

> It may be good for Apple to come up with
> a name that is more inclusive of its functionality. It's clearly not
> _just_ a phone.

Yeah, but if the new iPods that ultimately come out have similar
features and a similar look it will help differentiate them.

Todd Allcock wrote, inter alia:

> IMHO, Apple is very form (including ease-of-use) over substance-
> iPods aren't the best spec'd MP3 players out there, but they've got the
> style and ergonomics down better than everyone else.

IMHO you have it wrong by 180 degrees. Substance? With a device such as
the iPod ergonomics *is* the substance. As far as specs are concerned,
I used to take money from people on bets over blindfold tests -- audio
gear*, wines**, and the like. I don't do that anymore, because it's
like stealing candy from a baby. /You/ couldn't consistently tell the
difference between an iPod and the best "spec'd" MP3 player that you
can name. Or possibly the worst.

Substance? Aperture, Final Cut Studio, Logic Pro, Shake... these are
applications with some /serious/ substance due to great specs, great
usability, and great style. Ditto Apple's consumer-level creative apps,
and the OS they run under.

In short, I would say that, broadly speaking, Apple gets it all:
performance, usability, style. Perfect? Of course not. But way ahead of
the pack. Evidence of that? When was the last time Dell issued a
product that made the front pages of practically every major newspaper
on the U.S.? Yesterday's product announcements were also reported in
the press in China, France, India, Japan, South Africa, the UK, and
numerous other countries.

Davoud

*In the case of audio gear, the vinyl-is-good, digital-is-abominable
crowd could always tell the difference, of course; they apparently
think that hiss, clicks, and pops are an essential element in the
finest musical performances. The tube vs. solid-state could not pass
the blindfold test, however, even when the tubes were in McIntosh gear
and the transistors were in Sears gear.

** In the mid-1970's French wine scandal, in which vin de table, or vin
ordinaire, was being sold as fine wine, the tasters for Château
Mouton-Rothschild testified under oath that, in truth, they could not
tell the difference between the most expensive and the cheapest wines
of the same variety in a blind test. The difference between $1200 per
bottle and $6.95 per bottle, it turns out, is likely to be nothing more
the name on the label!

--
usenet *at* davidillig dawt com

SMS wrote:

> If you look at the iPhone as more of a web-pad, 3G is essential. No one

It's too small to be one's primary web access device. This is an
inherent limitation of handheld appliances. Can you imagine trying to
read a 300 page datasheet on a 3.5" LCD? Can you imagine trying to use
Writely (or whatever Google renamed it) on this thing?

Mobile Internet is quick emails, checking bank balances, looking at
pictures, that sort of thing. It's games and video content to amuse you
while you're waiting for an appointment, or maybe while sitting on the
toilet

It's very nice that Apple includes a full web browser - I certainly do
want one - but this thing is not going to replace my laptop, it's only
going to replace my Blackberry.

([email protected]) got drunk after typing this drivel in
news:[email protected]...

> Tim Smith <[email protected]> writes:
>
>> The fact that Apple already had worked with Cingular on a phone
>> probably was a factor, too--the Motorola ROKR. Apple was pleased
>> with the collaboration with Cingular on that. It was Motorola that
>> screwed that phone up, not Cingular.
>
> That's not entirely obvious. That's what's usually blamed,
> but my experience talking to folks - regardless of their
> interest in the ROKR or not - shows that (a) folks don't
> change cellular carriers often, even for a cool phone and
> (b) almost uniform hatred of Cingular in particular as a
> carrier. Moreover (c) unless someone's up for a contract
> renewal - even if they don't have to change carriers to do
> it - that's a big deterrent.
>

(a) I really have no idea on this. I wonder if there is any data on it?

(b) I keep hearing this now, yet they have more subscribers in the U.S.
than anyone else. Surely _someone_ must be happy with them! I can't help
but wonder if the iPhone were a Verizon-only device if we'd be hearing
how Verizon sucks, why didn't they go with Cingular, etc.

(c) In general I believe this is ture.

> Tying a product to cellular carriers - and their contracts -
> has a huge impact on potential market penetration. About the
> only exception that's made it above that is probably the RAZR,
> but note that that's available on *all* carriers, and unlocked
> as well.
>

The RAZR was not initially avaialable on all carriers. It was exclusinve,
though I cannot remember to who. It's also interesting to note that the
RAZR's price in the beginning was deemed way to high by "analysts", yet
it sold like hotcakes.

--
Tom Reestman

Todd Allcock wrote, inter alia:

> ...All true, perhaps, but Toyota sells more Camrys than Rolls Royce sells
> anything.

All other things remaining equal, Camrys would likely outsell Rolls
Royces if the two were comparably priced. By the measures most people
apply to cars -- reliability, ease and low cost of repairs, and other
tangibles -- the Camry is the better car.

Davoud

--
usenet *at* davidillig dawt com

At 11 Jan 2007 07:44:53 -0800 SMS wrote:

> If you look at the iPhone as more of a web-pad, 3G is essential.

Perhaps, but again, I doubt many will use a device with a half-VGA screen
and finger-tapping input as a webpad. I stand by my opinion that EDGE is
acceptable (but certainly not preferable) for occasional phone/PDA
browsing UNLESS you intend to tether a laptop. (Of course, this opinion
is coming from someone who started in mobile data six years ago by
tethering a Casio Pocket PC to a TDMA Nokia via IR at 9.6kbps to get e-
mail, so I obviously have low expectations!)

Going without 3G at first simplifies things greatly, as they can sell the
same model worldwide. (IIRC, GSM 3G isn't a world standard- different
frequencies are used here than in Europe. EDGE, however, is EDGE
wherever you go.)

> No one will be buying an iPhone just for the phone function.

No, but many will buy it simply to have a "real" iPod integrated into
their phone and never use the web/e-mail stuff! I've got a good friend
(and a fairly tech savvy guy) who bought an unlocked Treo 600 in Europe
before his carrier offered it here just to integrate phone and PIM in one
device. He doesn't do data on it- not even e-mail, but he carries it,
and his iPod, everywhere. He'll be all over this thing to get everything
he wants in one device.

> I think Cisco is doing Apple a favor. They should rename it to
>something that emphasizes its web browsing, video, and audio capabilities.



Naah, their target market (IMHO) is the person who is afraid of those
devices because they're too complicated, the same way iPods are touted
for making portable music simple.
I suspect they'll secure the rights to the iPhone name, but if not,
they'll probably go with "Apple Phone" (since they're going with "Apple
TV" for their PMP/media server thingy.)

> They can expand the market to people that can't or won't use Cingular.

Maybe in '08 or '09 but Cingular has a multi-year exclusivity on this
thing.


--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

In article <[email protected]>,
Todd Allcock <[email protected]> wrote:

> At 11 Jan 2007 07:44:53 -0800 SMS wrote:
>
> > If you look at the iPhone as more of a web-pad, 3G is essential.
>
> Perhaps, but again, I doubt many will use a device with a half-VGA screen
> and finger-tapping input as a webpad. I stand by my opinion that EDGE is
> acceptable (but certainly not preferable) for occasional phone/PDA
> browsing UNLESS you intend to tether a laptop. (Of course, this opinion
> is coming from someone who started in mobile data six years ago by
> tethering a Casio Pocket PC to a TDMA Nokia via IR at 9.6kbps to get e-
> mail, so I obviously have low expectations!)
>
> Going without 3G at first simplifies things greatly, as they can sell the
> same model worldwide. (IIRC, GSM 3G isn't a world standard- different
> frequencies are used here than in Europe. EDGE, however, is EDGE
> wherever you go.)
>
> > No one will be buying an iPhone just for the phone function.
>
> No, but many will buy it simply to have a "real" iPod integrated into
> their phone and never use the web/e-mail stuff!

Keep in mind the Web/e-mail stuff works on Wi-Fi as well.

[snip]

--
"That's George Washington, the first president, of course. The interesting thing
about him is that I read three--three or four books about him last year. Isn't
that interesting?"
- George W. Bush to reporter Kai Diekmann, May 5, 2006