Dissappointed with V3xx sensitivity

On Mon, 28 May 2007 18:47:03 GMT, Dennis Ferguson
<[email protected]> wrote in
<[email protected]>:

>On 2007-05-28, Dick <[email protected]> wrote:
>> On Mon, 28 May 2007 16:41:08 GMT, Dennis Ferguson wrote:
>>>You are right that antenna performance is a problem when space is limited,
>>>but the compromises generally show up in the low frequency bands where
>>>efficient antennas need to be big (and hence the space which can be saved
>>>is largest).
>[...]
>> Interestingly, The KRZR K1 has only 85% of the volume of the V3xx, but
>> is a quad-band phone.
>
>Yes, but note that the KRZR K3, which adds UMTS/HSDPA, also loses one of
>the low frequency bands.

Doesn't affect the size.

>My current theory is that it is the addition of the electronics to
>do the extra computing needed to support WCDMA which makes space a
>problem, and that compromising the low frequency support helps get
>some of that back. If the theory is true we'll need to wait for the
>electronics to shrink before we'll get all-band phones in something like
>the form factor of current quadband GSM phones.

3G is probably a factor, but there are other space consuming features as
well.

--
Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

---

› See More: Dissappointed with V3xx sensitivity

On Tue, 05 Jun 2007 14:50:05 -0700, XS11E <[email protected]> wrote
in <[email protected]>:

>SMS <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> It would be hard for any software to be worse than the flaky
>> Motorola Phone Tools.
>
>I run MPT on my laptop with Windows XP Home, on my desktop with Windows
>XP Pro and Vista Ultimate 64, I've never had any problem with
>installing, connecting to my E815, synchronizing or transferring files.
>MPT has been solid and trouble free for me.
>
>I'm wondering what kind of problems you've had?

Distaste for anything GSM in general, and Cingular in particular; i.e.,
guilt by association.

--
Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

On Mon, 28 May 2007 05:17:25 +0000 (UTC), [email protected] wrote in
<[email protected]>:

>I live in a pretty marginal area for Cingular signal.
>I upgraded from a Motorola V551 to a Razr V3xx about a week ago.
>So far, I am unimpressed with the receive sensitivity.
>
>The V551 would occasionally show no signal strength when I pulled it out of
>my pocket, but I would almost always be able to make calls.
>
>The V3xx shows no signal, and call attempts fail, in the same places
>around the house. The web browser is almost useless, rarely able to
>display a page in places where the V551 would work.

I'm doing some work today in the Danville Public Library
<http://tinyurl.com/2n5rbe>, and I happen to have with me both a V3xx
and a V551, so I decided to give them a quick comparison.

The V3xx gets a fairly good signal inside the library, both listening to
611 on voice and data connections.

The V551 (with the same SIM) gets such a poor signal that I have to go
outside to use it reliably.

This results is consistent with my past experience. For me the V3xx is
clearly superior to the V551.

--
Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

In alt.cellular.cingular SMS <[email protected]> wrote:
> But no HSDPA, only Edge.

I thought 3G (does HSDPA always follow?) would be cool, but the nearest 3G
is quite a ways away from me.

The 6126 has an icon that shows a G with a slash, a G, or a G with a box,
for poor network, GPRS and EDGE. It varies when the signal varies. I
didn't see that with the V3xx. It would show E all the time if the tower
had EDGE, even if a browse attempt failed.

--
Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley Lake, CA, USA GPS: 38.8,-122.5

In alt.cellular.cingular XS11E <[email protected]> wrote:
> I run MPT on my laptop with Windows XP Home, on my desktop with Windows
> XP Pro and Vista Ultimate 64, I've never had any problem with
> installing, connecting to my E815, synchronizing or transferring files.
> MPT has been solid and trouble free for me.

> I'm wondering what kind of problems you've had?

A search of this group, or a perusal of the BVRP forums, would give you an
inkling of how much trouble lots of people have with the software.

I had no trouble with it and my V3xx, although I would occasionally have
trouble with other phones.

My V551 was officially abandoned, supposedly at Motorola's request, and
would not operate with MPT later than 4.04b.

--
Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley Lake, CA, USA GPS: 38.8,-122.5

[email protected] wrote:

> In alt.cellular.cingular XS11E <[email protected]> wrote:
>> I run MPT on my laptop with Windows XP Home, on my desktop with
>> Windows XP Pro and Vista Ultimate 64, I've never had any problem
>> with installing, connecting to my E815, synchronizing or
>> transferring files. MPT has been solid and trouble free for me.
>
>> I'm wondering what kind of problems you've had?
>
> A search of this group, or a perusal of the BVRP forums, would
> give you an inkling of how much trouble lots of people have with
> the software.

Thanks but that does NOT answer the question I asked.


--
XS11E, Killing all posts from Google Groups
The Usenet Improvement Project: http://blinkynet.net/comp/uip5.html

In alt.cellular.cingular John Navas <[email protected]> wrote:
> You might want to try a different phone before giving up on the V3xx --
> my own V3xx has significantly better reception than any of several
> V551's I've compared it to, both on voice and on data.

I spoke to a couple of people that have some broad cellular device experience.
One preps the phones for everyone in his company.

He agrees with John's generally: The same handset differs from one item to
the next. RF is always good enough to pass muster in the city, but may
be different enough to matter in fringe areas.

The other, coincidentally, has handled the phones of interest in recent
days. He has had a V557, Krzr, and V3xx. He returned the Krzr because
of noise in the Bluetooth connection in multiple handsets that some
people hear, and others not, on the same handset.

He really likes the V3xx, and also encouraged me to try another sample.

I called premier support. They couldn't exchange the phone, and
transferred me to another number, who could have exchanged the phone, but
couldn't open my business account. I called back on the business number,
but their computer was being upgraded. She told me to hang up and call the
same number again, which might reach a different call center.
I did, and it did. But, she wants me to pay full price for the phone,
which would be credited when they receive my old phone.

My telephone experiences in the last couple of weeks with premier support
have permanently tarnished my impressions of the company. None of these
people seem to be knowledgeable or capable of performing their jobs.

--
Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley Lake, CA, USA GPS: 38.8,-122.5

On Wed, 6 Jun 2007 16:20:51 +0000 (UTC), [email protected] wrote in
<[email protected]>:

>In alt.cellular.cingular XS11E <[email protected]> wrote:
>> I run MPT on my laptop with Windows XP Home, on my desktop with Windows
>> XP Pro and Vista Ultimate 64, I've never had any problem with
>> installing, connecting to my E815, synchronizing or transferring files.
>> MPT has been solid and trouble free for me.
>
>> I'm wondering what kind of problems you've had?
>
>A search of this group, or a perusal of the BVRP forums, would give you an
>inkling of how much trouble lots of people have with the software.

Actually a relative few people.

>My V551 was officially abandoned, supposedly at Motorola's request, and
>would not operate with MPT later than 4.04b.

No biggie -- just stick with the version that works, as I did.

--
Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

On Wed, 6 Jun 2007 16:14:49 +0000 (UTC), [email protected] wrote in
<[email protected]>:

>In alt.cellular.cingular SMS <[email protected]> wrote:
>> But no HSDPA, only Edge.
>
>I thought 3G (does HSDPA always follow?) would be cool, but the nearest 3G
>is quite a ways away from me.

3G is UMTS. HSDPA is UMTS on steroids.

>The 6126 has an icon that shows a G with a slash, a G, or a G with a box,
>for poor network, GPRS and EDGE. It varies when the signal varies. I
>didn't see that with the V3xx. It would show E all the time if the tower
>had EDGE, even if a browse attempt failed.

EDGE is actually EGPRS, which is simply a more advanced form of GPRS.
Pretty much all AT&T/Cingular towers are now EGPRS. The signal quality
on the V3xx is shown with bars, so a symbol isn't really necessary.

--
Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

In alt.cellular.cingular John Navas <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Wed, 6 Jun 2007 16:20:51 +0000 (UTC), [email protected] wrote in
> >A search of this group, or a perusal of the BVRP forums, would give you an
> >inkling of how much trouble lots of people have with the software.

> Actually a relative few people.

Between this group and the BVRP forums, it seems to number in excess of
100. That might be relatively few in comparison to the number of installed
clients, or not. The recurrence of common themes makes me believe that
many people would give up if they encountered some of the common problems.

> >My V551 was officially abandoned, supposedly at Motorola's request, and
> >would not operate with MPT later than 4.04b.

> No biggie -- just stick with the version that works, as I did.

Do you maintain the old version on a separate PC?
If not a biggie, it at least seems irregular to drop support for a very
popular phone that is less than two years old, the length of time some
people are indirectly tied to owning the phone due to contracts.

Or maybe my reaction was the one Motorola hoped for. I bought a new phone.

Oh, wait, it's a Nokia, and I like their sync program better than MPT.
That's probably not what Motorola wanted.

--
Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley Lake, CA, USA GPS: 38.8,-122.5

On Wed, 13 Jun 2007 07:27:02 +0000 (UTC), [email protected] wrote in
<[email protected]>:

>In alt.cellular.cingular John Navas <[email protected]> wrote:
>> On Wed, 6 Jun 2007 16:20:51 +0000 (UTC), [email protected] wrote in
>> >A search of this group, or a perusal of the BVRP forums, would give you an
>> >inkling of how much trouble lots of people have with the software.
>
>> Actually a relative few people.
>
>Between this group and the BVRP forums, it seems to number in excess of
>100.

I'd say it's only a fraction of that.

>That might be relatively few in comparison to the number of installed
>clients, or not.

It's clearly a small fraction of the total user base.

>The recurrence of common themes makes me believe that
>many people would give up if they encountered some of the common problems.

By that standard you condemn virtually all products.

>> >My V551 was officially abandoned, supposedly at Motorola's request, and
>> >would not operate with MPT later than 4.04b.
>
>> No biggie -- just stick with the version that works, as I did.
>
>Do you maintain the old version on a separate PC?

I kept it running on my primary machines.

>If not a biggie, it at least seems irregular to drop support for a very
>popular phone that is less than two years old, the length of time some
>people are indirectly tied to owning the phone due to contracts.

Any other examples, or are you basing this entirely on a single phone?

>Or maybe my reaction was the one Motorola hoped for. I bought a new phone.
>
>Oh, wait, it's a Nokia, and I like their sync program better than MPT.
>That's probably not what Motorola wanted.

There's no real evidence that "Motorola wanted" anything.

--
Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

[email protected] wrote:
> In alt.cellular.cingular John Navas <[email protected]> wrote:
>> On Wed, 6 Jun 2007 16:20:51 +0000 (UTC), [email protected] wrote in
>>> A search of this group, or a perusal of the BVRP forums, would give you an
>>> inkling of how much trouble lots of people have with the software.
>
>> Actually a relative few people.
>
> Between this group and the BVRP forums, it seems to number in excess of
> 100. That might be relatively few in comparison to the number of installed
> clients, or not.

LOL, of course the number of people reporting their problems on these
forums is only a tiny tiny percentage of people with problems.

The biggest problem with MPT appears to be that whether or not the
program connects with the phone each time you connect seems to be random.

On Wed, 13 Jun 2007 07:52:45 -0700, SMS <[email protected]>
wrote in <[email protected]>:

>[email protected] wrote:
>> In alt.cellular.cingular John Navas <[email protected]> wrote:
>>> On Wed, 6 Jun 2007 16:20:51 +0000 (UTC), [email protected] wrote in
>>>> A search of this group, or a perusal of the BVRP forums, would give you an
>>>> inkling of how much trouble lots of people have with the software.
>>
>>> Actually a relative few people.
>>
>> Between this group and the BVRP forums, it seems to number in excess of
>> 100. That might be relatively few in comparison to the number of installed
>> clients, or not.
>
>LOL, of course the number of people reporting their problems on these
>forums is only a tiny tiny percentage of people with problems.
>
>The biggest problem with MPT appears to be that whether or not the
>program connects with the phone each time you connect seems to be random.

When MPT and the phone are properly installed, connection is reliable.

--
Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>

In alt.cellular.cingular John Navas <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Wed, 13 Jun 2007 07:27:02 +0000 (UTC), [email protected] wrote in
> <[email protected]>:

> >In alt.cellular.cingular John Navas <[email protected]> wrote:
> >> On Wed, 6 Jun 2007 16:20:51 +0000 (UTC), [email protected] wrote in
> >> >A search of this group, or a perusal of the BVRP forums, would give
> >> >you an inkling of how much trouble lots of people have with the
> >> >software.

> >> Actually a relative few people.

> >Between this group and the BVRP forums, it seems to number in excess of
> >100.

> I'd say it's only a fraction of that.

I respectfully disagree. I would guess that the number of individual
threads is 100, with many "me too" posters chiming in. Within the last six
months, it certainly exceeds a "fraction" of 100.

> >That might be relatively few in comparison to the number of installed
> >clients, or not.

> It's clearly a small fraction of the total user base.

What do you think the installed user base is?

> >The recurrence of common themes makes me believe that
> >many people would give up if they encountered some of the common problems.

> By that standard you condemn virtually all products.

There are many products that are tried and abandoned if they don't seem to
work.

> >> >My V551 was officially abandoned, supposedly at Motorola's request, and
> >> >would not operate with MPT later than 4.04b.
> >
> >> No biggie -- just stick with the version that works, as I did.
> >
> >Do you maintain the old version on a separate PC?

> I kept it running on my primary machines.

How do you interface with the V3xx, then, that needs 4.51c?

> >If not a biggie, it at least seems irregular to drop support for a very
> >popular phone that is less than two years old, the length of time some
> >people are indirectly tied to owning the phone due to contracts.

> Any other examples, or are you basing this entirely on a single phone?

I'm not sure what you are asking. My V551 is not supported. My V551 is a
single example of a telephone that sold in quantity.

> >Or maybe my reaction was the one Motorola hoped for. I bought a new phone.
> >
> >Oh, wait, it's a Nokia, and I like their sync program better than MPT.
> >That's probably not what Motorola wanted.

> There's no real evidence that "Motorola wanted" anything.

Does your V551 work with MPT 4.51c? I recall that it is about the same age
as mine. Tech support from BVRP-USA told me that support was dropped at
the request of Motorola.

--
Clarence A Dold - Hidden Valley Lake, CA, USA GPS: 38.8,-122.5

On Wed, 13 Jun 2007 21:58:02 +0000 (UTC), [email protected] wrote in
<[email protected]>:

>In alt.cellular.cingular John Navas <[email protected]> wrote:
>> On Wed, 13 Jun 2007 07:27:02 +0000 (UTC), [email protected] wrote in
>> <[email protected]>:

>> >Between this group and the BVRP forums, it seems to number in excess of
>> >100.
>
>> I'd say it's only a fraction of that.
>
>I respectfully disagree. ...

OK. We disagree.

>> >That might be relatively few in comparison to the number of installed
>> >clients, or not.
>
>> It's clearly a small fraction of the total user base.
>
>What do you think the installed user base is?

Probably hundreds of thousands, plus or minus.

>> >The recurrence of common themes makes me believe that
>> >many people would give up if they encountered some of the common problems.
>
>> By that standard you condemn virtually all products.
>
>There are many products that are tried and abandoned if they don't seem to
>work.

MPT actually works quite well.

>> >Do you maintain the old version on a separate PC?
>
>> I kept it running on my primary machines.
>
>How do you interface with the V3xx, then, that needs 4.51c?

My V551 is in the dustbin.

>> >If not a biggie, it at least seems irregular to drop support for a very
>> >popular phone that is less than two years old, the length of time some
>> >people are indirectly tied to owning the phone due to contracts.
>
>> Any other examples, or are you basing this entirely on a single phone?
>
>I'm not sure what you are asking. My V551 is not supported. My V551 is a
>single example of a telephone that sold in quantity.

In other words, just a single data point.

>> There's no real evidence that "Motorola wanted" anything.
>
>Does your V551 work with MPT 4.51c? I recall that it is about the same age
>as mine.

Not well. See my prior posts.

>Tech support from BVRP-USA told me that support was dropped at
>the request of Motorola.

That sounds like Urban Legend to me.

--
Best regards, FAQ FOR CINGULAR WIRELESS:
John Navas <http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Cingular_Wireless_FAQ>