NEXTEL Flarion outperforms CDMA 1x EV-DO

http://www.rcrnews.com/cgi-bin/news.pl?newsId=17740

Nextel Communications Inc.'s decision earlier this week to expand its
wireless broadband network trial in the Raleigh, N.C., market may have
proven well founded as network testing conducted by RBC Capital
Markets indicated Flarion Technologies' Flash-OFDM based technology is
providing data speeds nearly three times faster than CDMA2000 1x EV-DO
networks and equal to wireline-based broadband offerings.

---

› See More: NEXTEL Flarion outperforms CDMA 1x EV-DO

On 17 Apr 2004 04:34:05 -0700, [email protected] (MarkF) wrote:

>http://www.rcrnews.com/cgi-bin/news.pl?newsId=17740
>
>Nextel Communications Inc.'s decision earlier this week to expand its
>wireless broadband network trial in the Raleigh, N.C., market may have
>proven well founded as network testing conducted by RBC Capital
>Markets indicated Flarion Technologies' Flash-OFDM based technology is
>providing data speeds nearly three times faster than CDMA2000 1x EV-DO
>networks and equal to wireline-based broadband offerings.

If you look at the central part of that link you'll see the text:

"The speeds were triple the 329 kbps average throughput similar
testing produced using Verizon Wireless?f EV-DO network/..."

But it uses 4 times the bandwidth. So, it's less spectrally efficient.
Spectrum costs $$$.

Since Nextel's rolling out the service on MMDS bands (not cellular),
if Nextel doesn't have MMDS spectrum in your market, don't plan on
having the Flarion based service. There will be very few markets that
ever have it.

<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...

> If you look at the central part of that link you'll see the text:
>
> "The speeds were triple the 329 kbps average throughput similar
> testing produced using Verizon Wireless?f EV-DO network/..."
>
> But it uses 4 times the bandwidth. So, it's less spectrally efficient.
> Spectrum costs $$$.
>
> Since Nextel's rolling out the service on MMDS bands (not cellular),
> if Nextel doesn't have MMDS spectrum in your market, don't plan on
> having the Flarion based service. There will be very few markets that
> ever have it.

I didn't see the MMDS part in the article. Did you find that somewhere else?
Since one of Nextel's problems is lack of spectrum it would seem they would
need to run it in some other band.

Sounds like "Vaporware"....will believe it when it's REALLY available.
Nextel's coverage in rural areas and off the "beaten" path has been dismal
to say the least. I won't hold my breath waiting for them to impliment THIS
feature anytime soon.....Eddie (was a Nextel customer for 18 months)

"MarkF" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> http://www.rcrnews.com/cgi-bin/news.pl?newsId=17740
>
> Nextel Communications Inc.'s decision earlier this week to expand its
> wireless broadband network trial in the Raleigh, N.C., market may have
> proven well founded as network testing conducted by RBC Capital
> Markets indicated Flarion Technologies' Flash-OFDM based technology is
> providing data speeds nearly three times faster than CDMA2000 1x EV-DO
> networks and equal to wireline-based broadband offerings.

On Sat, 17 Apr 2004 09:02:13 -0400, "George" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>
><[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>
>> If you look at the central part of that link you'll see the text:
>>
>> "The speeds were triple the 329 kbps average throughput similar
>> testing produced using Verizon Wireless?f EV-DO network/..."
>>
>> But it uses 4 times the bandwidth. So, it's less spectrally efficient.
>> Spectrum costs $$$.
>>
>> Since Nextel's rolling out the service on MMDS bands (not cellular),
>> if Nextel doesn't have MMDS spectrum in your market, don't plan on
>> having the Flarion based service. There will be very few markets that
>> ever have it.
>
>I didn't see the MMDS part in the article. Did you find that somewhere else?
>Since one of Nextel's problems is lack of spectrum it would seem they would
>need to run it in some other band.

http://www.dailywireless.org/modules...ticle&sid=2031

Look about 1/4 way down the page.

http://www.equitekcapital.com/Invest...less111003.htm

Looks like they've shifted to 1.25 MHz of spectrum instead of 5. (They
used to offer it in 5 MHz.)

http://www.flarion.com/news/pr_2004/031704.asp

The whole point is that they already have made it available and it is
the fastest mobile wireless data service to date. The trial in N.C.
was recently 'cut short' in that it was working so well they have
started accepting paying customers.

Pricing was posted in another thread but it ran from $35/month for
slower MB limited plans to $80 for full speed unlimited plans.

Does anyone have a list of markets in which Nextel owns the spectrum
to support this service?

-D

"Eddie Haskel" <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> Sounds like "Vaporware"....will believe it when it's REALLY available.
> Nextel's coverage in rural areas and off the "beaten" path has been dismal
> to say the least. I won't hold my breath waiting for them to impliment THIS
> feature anytime soon.....Eddie (was a Nextel customer for 18 months)
>
> "MarkF" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
> > http://www.rcrnews.com/cgi-bin/news.pl?newsId=17740
> >
> > Nextel Communications Inc.'s decision earlier this week to expand its
> > wireless broadband network trial in the Raleigh, N.C., market may have
> > proven well founded as network testing conducted by RBC Capital
> > Markets indicated Flarion Technologies' Flash-OFDM based technology is
> > providing data speeds nearly three times faster than CDMA2000 1x EV-DO
> > networks and equal to wireline-based broadband offerings.

Try as I may, I cannot uncover a definitive answer as to which
spectrum Nextel is utilizing for its trial deployment of FLASH-OFDM in
the Research Triangle metro. Three possibilities seem to emerge: SMR
800, MMDS, or PCS.

Additionally, the Flarion documentation is somewhat vague as to
whether FLASH-OFDM deployment requires 1.25 MHz paired FDD
(frequency-division duplex) for a total spectrum outlay of 2.5 MHz or
625 KHz paired FDD for a total of 1.25 MHz. Flarion ambiguously
states 1.25 MHz FDD, though I would suspect the former, that 1.25 MHz
"green field" spectrum is required for each of the forward &
reverse-links.

As its name would suggest - Orthogonal Frequency-Division Multiplexing
- it is a frequency-division interface, but the precise tonal spacing
required for frequency-orthogonality eliminates as a possibility the
interleaved portions of Nextel's SMR 800 MHz spectrum - the same
spectrum intertwined w/ public safety channels that Nextel wishes to
return to the FCC in exchange for a nationwide 10 MHz PCS license.
However, assuming that disregard of the established 25 KHz
channelization would be permitted under SMR regulations, the
contiguous 5 MHz paired of the SMR 800 A-C licenses or the 3.75 MHz
paired of the D-FF licenses - all of which are typically held by
Nextel - could be utilized for FLASH-OFDM deployment, albeit at the
great expense of iDEN capacity, which makes SMR spectrum utilization
unlikely.

http://wireless.fcc.gov/auctions/dat...800smrband.pdf

As Craig has astutely pointed out, Nextel has acquired a sizeable
holding of MMDS (Multichannel Multipoint Distribution System)
spectrum, largely through the bankruptcy purchase of WorldCom's MMDS
assets. The MMDS spectrum in the 2.6 GHz band was not originally
designed for two-way transmission. It is not paired FDD. But two-way
data communication has been approved by the FCC. And the 6 MHz
channelization (designed for 6 MHz NTSC analog TV channels) is large
enough that FLASH-OFDM FDD operation could possibly be contained w/in
a channel or certainly w/in separate channels w/in the MMDS band.

http://wireless.fcc.gov/auctions/dat...ns/mdsband.pdf

Finally, others have reported that Nextel is leasing PCS spectrum for
the FLASH-OFDM trial in Raleigh-Durham-Chapel Hill. The PCS A & PCS B
licenses in MTA006 are AT&TWS & Cingular, respectively, neither of
which would be likely to lease any of their spectrum to competitor
Nextel. The same could be said of Sprint PCS, the PCS D licensee in
BTA368. That leaves the BTA368 PCS C, PCS E, & PCS F licensees:
Urban Comm - North Carolina, ALLTEL, & Comscape Telecommunications of
Raleigh-Durham, respectively.

http://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/UlsS...sp?licKey=9049
http://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/UlsS...sp?licKey=9723
http://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/UlsS...p?licKey=10068

ALLTEL as well is certainly a competitor to Nextel, but ALLTEL
controls the Cellular B-side license in the Raleigh-Durham CMA, hence
its PCS spectrum in that market could be expendable. The more likely
contender, though, would be either of the two entrepreneurial
companies, about which little information seems to be available.

Andrew
--
Andrew Shepherd
[email protected]
[email protected]
http://www.ku.edu/home/cinema/

On 21 Apr 2004 12:21:46 -0700, [email protected] (Andrew Shepherd) wrote:

>Try as I may, I cannot uncover a definitive answer as to which
>spectrum Nextel is utilizing for its trial deployment of FLASH-OFDM in
>the Research Triangle metro. Three possibilities seem to emerge: SMR
>800, MMDS, or PCS.

PCS.


Regulators Mulling Nextel Spectrum Proposal
BY REINHARDT KRAUSE, INVESTOR'S BUSINESS DAILY, Monday, March 8, 2004

<snip>

"However, Nextel is testing a wireless data network developed by startup
Flarion Technologies. The trial, in North Carolina, uses gear that operates
at 1.9 GHz."

<snip>


http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WFHSG/message/5540


--
John Bartley K7AAY http://celdata.cjb.net
This post quad-ROT-13 encrypted; reading it violates the DMCA.
Nobody but a fool goes into a federal counterrorism operation without duct tape - Richard Preston, THE COBRA EVENT.

[email protected] wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...

> PCS.
>
>
> Regulators Mulling Nextel Spectrum Proposal
> BY REINHARDT KRAUSE, INVESTOR'S BUSINESS DAILY, Monday, March 8, 2004
>
> <snip>
>
> "However, Nextel is testing a wireless data network developed by startup
> Flarion Technologies. The trial, in North Carolina, uses gear that operates
> at 1.9 GHz."
>
> <snip>
>
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/WFHSG/message/5540

MMDS.

"Nextel's market trial is using Flarion in the MMDS (2.5-2.6GHz) band."

http://www.dailywireless.org/modules...ticle&sid=2031

So which is it - leased PCS or licensed MMDS? The ambiguity persists...

Andrew
--
Andrew Shepherd
[email protected]
[email protected]
http://www.ku.edu/home/cinema/

See More info below-

Andrew Shepherd <[email protected]> wrote:

> Try as I may, I cannot uncover a definitive answer as to which
> spectrum Nextel is utilizing for its trial deployment of FLASH-OFDM in
> the Research Triangle metro. Three possibilities seem to emerge: SMR
> 800, MMDS, or PCS.

PCS

>
>
> Additionally, the Flarion documentation is somewhat vague as to
> whether FLASH-OFDM deployment requires 1.25 MHz paired FDD
> (frequency-division duplex) for a total spectrum outlay of 2.5 MHz or
> 625 KHz paired FDD for a total of 1.25 MHz. Flarion ambiguously
> states 1.25 MHz FDD, though I would suspect the former, that 1.25 MHz
> "green field" spectrum is required for each of the forward &
> reverse-links.
>

I spoke to Ray (Flarion's CEO) at CTIA He said they use 400KHZ carriers
with a small "Guard Band"
The FLASH-OFDM is a proprietary OFMD unlike Texas Instruments and does not
conform to all of the industry standards

>
> As its name would suggest - Orthogonal Frequency-Division Multiplexing
> - it is a frequency-division interface, but the precise tonal spacing
> required for frequency-orthogonality eliminates as a possibility the
> interleaved portions of Nextel's SMR 800 MHz spectrum - the same
> spectrum intertwined w/ public safety channels that Nextel wishes to
> return to the FCC in exchange for a nationwide 10 MHz PCS license.

Not exactly true Nextel does have some contiguous blocks of spectrum.
I asked Ray if they could "Break Out" a 400 Khz carrier
for use he said " Yes, but not in its current config"

>
> However, assuming that disregard of the established 25 KHz
> channelization would be permitted under SMR regulations, the
> contiguous 5 MHz paired of the SMR 800 A-C licenses or the 3.75 MHz
> paired of the D-FF licenses - all of which are typically held by
> Nextel - could be utilized for FLASH-OFDM deployment, albeit at the
> great expense of iDEN capacity, which makes SMR spectrum utilization
> unlikely.
>
> http://wireless.fcc.gov/auctions/dat...800smrband.pdf

If you have contiguous blocks of 25Khz channel you can use them.
I.E. WiDEN which uses multiple 25 Khz channels.

>
>
> As Craig has astutely pointed out, Nextel has acquired a sizeable
> holding of MMDS (Multichannel Multipoint Distribution System)
> spectrum, largely through the bankruptcy purchase of WorldCom's MMDS
> assets. The MMDS spectrum in the 2.6 GHz band was not originally
> designed for two-way transmission. It is not paired FDD. But two-way
> data communication has been approved by the FCC. And the 6 MHz
> channelization (designed for 6 MHz NTSC analog TV channels) is large
> enough that FLASH-OFDM FDD operation could possibly be contained w/in
> a channel or certainly w/in separate channels w/in the MMDS band.
>
> http://wireless.fcc.gov/auctions/dat...ns/mdsband.pdf

Yep, Yep, that is Nextel's back up plan to the "SCAM PLAN".

>
>
> Finally, others have reported that Nextel is leasing PCS spectrum for
> the FLASH-OFDM trial in Raleigh-Durham-Chapel Hill. The PCS A & PCS B
> licenses in MTA006 are AT&TWS & Cingular, respectively, neither of
> which would be likely to lease any of their spectrum to competitor
> Nextel. The same could be said of Sprint PCS, the PCS D licensee in
> BTA368. That leaves the BTA368 PCS C, PCS E, & PCS F licensees:
> Urban Comm - North Carolina, ALLTEL, & Comscape Telecommunications of
> Raleigh-Durham, respectively.
>
> http://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/UlsS...sp?licKey=9049
> http://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/UlsS...sp?licKey=9723
> http://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/UlsS...p?licKey=10068

It's Comscape

Likely? The way Timmy throws around nextel's cash these carriers will
lease their 1st Born.
Look at Nextel's SEC filing. Do a little math and you will see COMSCAPE is
getting big bucks.

>
>
> ALLTEL as well is certainly a competitor to Nextel, but ALLTEL
> controls the Cellular B-side license in the Raleigh-Durham CMA, hence
> its PCS spectrum in that market could be expendable. The more likely
> contender, though, would be either of the two entrepreneurial
> companies, about which little information seems to be available.

There is plenty of info around .

ComScape Telecommunications, Inc./Kiwi PCS is headquartered in West Palm
Beach, Florida and is
constructing a CDMA2000 1X wireless system in North Carolina with
expansion into Ohio, West Virginia and
Kentucky. They now offer their Kiwi Free service in Wilmington, North
Carolina. ComScape is privately-held
and has virtually no debt. They are a facilities-based, fully integrated,
telecommunications services company
with switching centers in Raleigh, North Carolina and Charleston, West
Virginia. In addition, they have a call
center in West Palm Beach, Florida.

>
>
> Andrew
> --
> Andrew Shepherd
> [email protected]
> [email protected]
> http://www.ku.edu/home/cinema/

--
"NEXTEL-1 IT'S NOT JUST NEXTEL"
Note The New address
Subscribe to Nextel-1: http://www.groups.yahoo.com/subscribe/NEXTEL-1

"NEXTEL2 FOR iDEN SOFTWARE DEVELOPERS"
Subscribe to Nextel2: http://www.groups.yahoo.com/subscribe/NEXTEL2

"WIRELESS FORUM HOMELAND SECURITY GROUP"
The Complete Resource for Wireless Homeland Security.
Subscribe to WFHSG: http://www.groups.yahoo.com/subscribe/WFHSG

Flarion Is On FIRE~~~~~~

Timmy said publicly a few months ago at one of the Nextel Dog & Pony Shows
for Investors that Nextel was "renting" some
spectrum for the Flarion deployment in N.C. He would not say "Who" was
renting Nextel the spectrum, however a little
research tells the whole story............


Nextel Leases Spectrum From -COMSCAPE TELECOM OF RALEIGH-DURHAM For
Flarion Network

License-

ULS License- PCS Broadband License - KNLG699 - COMSCAPE TELECOMMUNICATIONS
OF
RALEIGH-DURHAM LICENSE, INC.
BTA368 - Raleigh-Durham, NC
Channel Block
F
Submarket
0
Associated
Frequencies

1890.00000-1895.00000 MHZ
1970.00000-1975.00000 MHZ


http://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/UlsS...p?licKey=10068


Who is ComScape ???

As of 2003-
ComScape Telecommunications, Inc./Kiwi PCS is headquartered in West Palm
Beach, Florida and is constructing a
CDMA2000 1X wireless system in North Carolina with expansion into Ohio,
West Virginia and Kentucky. They now offer
their Kiwi Free service in Wilmington, North Carolina. ComScape is
privately-held and has virtually no debt. They are a
facilities-based, fully integrated, telecommunications services company
with switching centers in Raleigh, North Carolina and
Charleston, West Virginia. In addition, they have a call center in West
Palm Beach, Florida.


Bhogin M. Modi ComScape Telecommunications, Inc.
ComScape Telecommunications, Inc. – Kiwi PCS Kiwi PCS
Telephone: 561-540-4771; E-mail: [email protected]
1926 10th Avenue North, Suite 305
West Palm Beach, Florida 33461


===============================================================================

Nextel / Flarion Equipment-

Flarion Base Stations

1971.25 -1973.75 MHZ

1972.55-1976.2 MHZ


*************************************************

Flarion PC Card

1890.75 -1894.25 MHZ

Flarion Fixed Subscriber Unit (Home PC)

1890.75 -1894.25 MHZ


https://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/prod/oet/c...estTimeout=500

Timmy the mystery is DONE!
--
"NEXTEL-1 IT'S NOT JUST NEXTEL"
Note The New address
Subscribe to Nextel-1: http://www.groups.yahoo.com/subscribe/NEXTEL-1

"NEXTEL2 FOR iDEN SOFTWARE DEVELOPERS"
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"WIRELESS FORUM HOMELAND SECURITY GROUP"
The Complete Resource for Wireless Homeland Security.
Subscribe to WFHSG: http://www.groups.yahoo.com/subscribe/WFHSG

**************************************************************************************************

Andrew Shepherd wrote:

> Try as I may, I cannot uncover a definitive answer as to which
> spectrum Nextel is utilizing for its trial deployment of FLASH-OFDM in
> the Research Triangle metro. Three possibilities seem to emerge: SMR
> 800, MMDS, or PCS.
>
> Additionally, the Flarion documentation is somewhat vague as to
> whether FLASH-OFDM deployment requires 1.25 MHz paired FDD
> (frequency-division duplex) for a total spectrum outlay of 2.5 MHz or
> 625 KHz paired FDD for a total of 1.25 MHz. Flarion ambiguously
> states 1.25 MHz FDD, though I would suspect the former, that 1.25 MHz
> "green field" spectrum is required for each of the forward &
> reverse-links.
>
> As its name would suggest - Orthogonal Frequency-Division Multiplexing
> - it is a frequency-division interface, but the precise tonal spacing
> required for frequency-orthogonality eliminates as a possibility the
> interleaved portions of Nextel's SMR 800 MHz spectrum - the same
> spectrum intertwined w/ public safety channels that Nextel wishes to
> return to the FCC in exchange for a nationwide 10 MHz PCS license.
> However, assuming that disregard of the established 25 KHz
> channelization would be permitted under SMR regulations, the
> contiguous 5 MHz paired of the SMR 800 A-C licenses or the 3.75 MHz
> paired of the D-FF licenses - all of which are typically held by
> Nextel - could be utilized for FLASH-OFDM deployment, albeit at the
> great expense of iDEN capacity, which makes SMR spectrum utilization
> unlikely.
>
> http://wireless.fcc.gov/auctions/dat...800smrband.pdf
>
> As Craig has astutely pointed out, Nextel has acquired a sizeable
> holding of MMDS (Multichannel Multipoint Distribution System)
> spectrum, largely through the bankruptcy purchase of WorldCom's MMDS
> assets. The MMDS spectrum in the 2.6 GHz band was not originally
> designed for two-way transmission. It is not paired FDD. But two-way
> data communication has been approved by the FCC. And the 6 MHz
> channelization (designed for 6 MHz NTSC analog TV channels) is large
> enough that FLASH-OFDM FDD operation could possibly be contained w/in
> a channel or certainly w/in separate channels w/in the MMDS band.
>
> http://wireless.fcc.gov/auctions/dat...ns/mdsband.pdf
>
> Finally, others have reported that Nextel is leasing PCS spectrum for
> the FLASH-OFDM trial in Raleigh-Durham-Chapel Hill. The PCS A & PCS B
> licenses in MTA006 are AT&TWS & Cingular, respectively, neither of
> which would be likely to lease any of their spectrum to competitor
> Nextel. The same could be said of Sprint PCS, the PCS D licensee in
> BTA368. That leaves the BTA368 PCS C, PCS E, & PCS F licensees:
> Urban Comm - North Carolina, ALLTEL, & Comscape Telecommunications of
> Raleigh-Durham, respectively.
>
> http://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/UlsS...sp?licKey=9049
> http://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/UlsS...sp?licKey=9723
> http://wireless2.fcc.gov/UlsApp/UlsS...p?licKey=10068
>
> ALLTEL as well is certainly a competitor to Nextel, but ALLTEL
> controls the Cellular B-side license in the Raleigh-Durham CMA, hence
> its PCS spectrum in that market could be expendable. The more likely
> contender, though, would be either of the two entrepreneurial
> companies, about which little information seems to be available.
>
> Andrew
> --
> Andrew Shepherd
> [email protected]
> [email protected]
> http://www.ku.edu/home/cinema/

--
"NEXTEL-1 IT'S NOT JUST NEXTEL"
Note The New address
Subscribe to Nextel-1: http://www.groups.yahoo.com/subscribe/NEXTEL-1

"NEXTEL2 FOR iDEN SOFTWARE DEVELOPERS"
Subscribe to Nextel2: http://www.groups.yahoo.com/subscribe/NEXTEL2

"WIRELESS FORUM HOMELAND SECURITY GROUP"
The Complete Resource for Wireless Homeland Security.
Subscribe to WFHSG: http://www.groups.yahoo.com/subscribe/WFHSG