Swithched to Verizon PTT

"Larry W4CSC" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> "Jimmie James" <[email protected]> wrote in
news:eNKte.5577$R6.5255@trndny04:
>
> > CAN YOU HEAR ME NOW!!! 2 Thumbs Up for Verizon!!!
> >
> >
>
> One more question....please.
>
> Why would anyone, on any company, use a PTT walkie talkie, even if it
> worked perfect, holding a perfectly-great-working FULL DUPLEX telephone in
> their hands with a built-in speakerphone?? Is this some kind of retro
> novelty or trend-setting statement?
>
> I've been using PTT on ham and 2-way radios since 1957. I was 11, by the
> way. I don't see why anyone would want to use it...
>

Try this- you need to contact an associate to get numbers for a presentation
and you are not at your desk. You contact your associate (who is also not at
his desk) and he says he'll get them for you as soon as he returns. Once at
his desk, he contacts you to get specifics and contacts you an hour later
with the numbers.

In the cellular world, you have each burned a minimum of 4 minutes of call
time to accomplish this simple task. Multiply this by a fair number of
these calls a month and you have effectively burned through most of your
plan minutes. Last I knew, Nextel billed PTT in 6 second increments, which
means that the 4 minutes of cellular could be as little as 1 minute of PTT
time or less. Much more cost effective.

Now, take the same situation, except that your associate is at his desk and
you need the numbers absolutely ASAP. He takes the time to find the numbers
while you wait.

In the cellular world, you are again spending minutes, only this time most
of them are spent on an unproductive hold. With PTT, your phone is only
tied up and billed when you are actually using it.

Finally, take the scenario a step further and you have to report the numbers
to a group of company executives (remember, you are not at your desk). In
the cellular world, you can make a number of individual calls to convey the
information. With PTT, you can make a single announcement.

Despite your own lack of understanding of the efficiencies, it is actually a
very effective tool in the business world. The fact that the technology is
not cutting edge has no bearing on its usefullness.

---

› See More: Swithched to Verizon PTT

For the same reason, Police, Firemen, Drivers, industrial workers,
security guards do.

Ask your self why they don't call each other up on speaker phones.

Very well said but from the financial side of things, Verizon attempts
to compete by having free in network calls. Nextel has unlimited
direct connect. So the competitive business makes the prices go down.

I think the problem with Verizon PTT is people don't understand the
need for PTT. People that think Verizon PTT is adequte are people that
don't really need PTT. In my business, I can get things done much much
faster with Nextel PTT than any other type of service.

-- snip --
Don't knock it till you try
it!!!!!
-- snip ---

I did try it so I will knock it. 15 seconds connect time just does not
cut it for people who need a true PTT.
The verizon ptt is not meant for serious customers who need a true PTT.
Verizon knows this too and thats why you don't see commercials and
marketing campaigns that show off the PTT.

<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Very well said but from the financial side of things, Verizon attempts
> to compete by having free in network calls. Nextel has unlimited
> direct connect. So the competitive business makes the prices go down.

All good points. I threw in the financial stuff to make part of the point.
The real message was the amount of time being spent on the phone.

>
> I think the problem with Verizon PTT is people don't understand the
> need for PTT. People that think Verizon PTT is adequte are people that
> don't really need PTT. In my business, I can get things done much much
> faster with Nextel PTT than any other type of service.
>

Agreed. The last thing I need is to hang on the phone for something that
takes a few seconds to do with PTT. The ability to contact a group with the
push of a button is also a nice feature. Anything less than instant
connection is not acceptable.

[email protected] wrote:
> -- snip --
> Don't knock it till you try
> it!!!!!
> -- snip ---
>
> I did try it so I will knock it. 15 seconds connect time
> just does not cut it for people who need a true PTT.
> The verizon ptt is not meant for serious customers who
> need a true PTT. Verizon knows this too and thats why
> you don't see commercials and marketing campaigns that
> show off the PTT.

Now that you mention it, I'd forgotten about VZW PTT
after the first go round on this group. I can't remember
seeing a single ad.

-Quick

[email protected] wrote in
news:[email protected]:

> I did try it so I will knock it. 15 seconds connect time just does
> not cut it for people who need a true PTT. The verizon ptt is not
> meant for serious customers who need a true PTT.
> Verizon knows this too and thats why you don't see commercials and
> marketing campaigns that show off the PTT.

Wha!?!?!?!?

I am completely confused. Taking into account all the different ways
that one uses PTT, what kind of business do you have to be in where 15
seconds are a life or death matter?

Need sales numbers from an associate for a presentation? Need to let
your secretary know you will be tied up in a meeting all afternoon? Need
to call your wife to bring you new pants cause youcrapped the ones you
are wearing? Need to talk to the boss about a problem with the
blueprints? Need to tell your lunch buddy to order you a triple w/
cheese with double everything on it and a large artery clogging batch of
deep fat fried obesity inducing charred to a crisp and salted to the
hilt tasteless potato strips? Need to call all your past sexual partners
and let them know you got the clap?

How on God's green earth does that 15 seconds matter?

I feel that those who are sucking wind about the connect time are
whining about a problem that doesn't exist. This is valuing the tires
of the car more than the engine. No engine no go. No tires, slow
going, but you will get somewhere.

I have been reading this thread laughing. I have used both services,
and I can tell you this much. Screw PTT. Pick up the dang phone and
talk for a change.

It is amazing how this technology has devolved into making a cellular
device into a CB Radio and then whining about quality, range and connect
time.

Does anyone in this stupid fight realize that the device you hold in
your hand takes your voice, digitally encrypts it and transmits it to a
tower that you cant see, then receives incoming data, decrypts it into
an analog wave and pumps it through a tiny speaker? Stinking incredible
if you ask me!

Do whatever you want, but understand that you are using an incredible
technology. The fact that either of the PTT technologies even work
without any visible wiring is a miracle in and of itself.

BigBob

Big Bob wrote:

> I am completely confused. Taking into account all the different ways
> that one uses PTT, what kind of business do you have to be in where 15
> seconds are a life or death matter?

Nextel markets to municipalities and other political organizations that run
emergency services (for example, fire/police departments). In such cases,
you'd better believe 15 seconds can be the difference between life and death.

Now, I'm pretty sure Verizon is aiming more at business customers, and in
99.9% of the cases where businesses are involved you're probably right.
However, I think 15 seconds is an awfully long time to wait to make a PTT
connection. Unacceptably long, FWIW, in which case my choice would be
Nextel, or maybe Sprint. I don't know how Sprint is, but they're supposed to
be much better than Verizon. My brother just switched to Sprint and got a
ReadyLink phone, but AFAIK he doesn't know anyone else with one, so he can't
test their PTT...

> Do whatever you want, but understand that you are using an incredible
> technology. The fact that either of the PTT technologies even work
> without any visible wiring is a miracle in and of itself.

I agree. :>

--
JustThe.net - Steve Sobol / [email protected] / PGP: 0xE3AE35ED
Coming to you from Southern California's High Desert, where the
temperatures are as high as the gas prices! / 888.480.4NET (4638)

"Life's like an hourglass glued to the table" --Anna Nalick, "Breathe"

--- snip ---
Taking into account all the different ways
that one uses PTT, what kind of business do you have to be in where 15
seconds are a life or death matter?
Need sales numbers from an associate for a presentation? Need to let
your secretary know you will be tied up in a meeting all afternoon?
.... etc
--- snip ---

One of my points is PTT is not for everyone. People that utilize PTT
like that there is practically no delay.

It's simply a feature that people like. Imagine that you had a TV that
took 15 deconds to change a channel the first time you click the
remote. Some people could live with it, some people can't. Just
like some people insist on high speed Internet access and others don't.
There are instances where people want to communicate in near real time.

If you don't need PTT, then get a Verizon phone. I have one for
personal use. If you want a responsive PTT, get Nextel.

An important issue of this discussion is that Verizon's PTT is not as
good as Nextel's. Whether PTT is a useful thing or not is up to the
user.

When chosing a provider, one should consider everything including
*coverage in the area where you use it
*price plans
*PTT quality
*cell phone
*connection reliablility
*phone features and durability
.... and the list goes on.

My advice is for the user to be educated. I don't like when people
believe Nextel's PTT is as good as Verizon's. It is not. Try before
you buy!

However, knowing the spectrum that Nextel uses for their service is within
the the 800 MHz public Safety Band, and the ever expanding list of official
complaints to the FCC by Public Safety pertaining to interferene caused by
Nextel.........

I don't see this cause of RF interference to Public Safety to be a good
thing; especially if it keeps public Safety officers from doing thieir job
efficiently; or is the cause of loss of life.........

The 15 seconds (and more) delay is offten caused by lost Public Safety comms
that were effectively jammed by adjacent Nextel exchanges - And you are so
correct is stating it is a life and death matter.

---------------- Much S N I P P A G E ----------------------
> Big Bob wrote:
>
> > Nextel markets to municipalities and other political organizations that
> > run
> emergency services (for example, fire/police departments). In such cases,
> you'd better believe 15 seconds can be the difference between life and
> death.
>

There is no question of whether VZ has the speed of connect that Nextel
does.

As long as the build-out is adequate for good 800MHz radio coms, Nextel has
provided intelligible results in some areas.

If there is a need for PTT (or Cellular) services where intelligible results
all the time, the VZ build-out is consistently more dense than Nextel.

I want my weapon to fire every time; even if I have to take the time to cock
it before use. Just shooting blindly into the air (in order to get the
first shot [Nextel] ) isn't my idea of self-preservation.

In a large city, where both communicationg parties are consistently under
tha signal umbrella, Nextel does an acceptable job over 50% of the time.
However, in real-life situations, the "horseshoes and hangrenades" rule does
not apply apply.

And then there is the Nextel vs Southern Linc issue that we have to suffer
through in the Deep South. There is nothing worse than having 5 bars of
signal and getting a No Service message on the display because of the
screwing that Southern Linc got from Nextel in past business dealings.
There tends to be even wider non-usage areas for Nextel Customers in areas
where Southern Linc is using the ssame Spectrum on their Iden phones
service.

<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> --- snip ---
> Taking into account all the different ways
> that one uses PTT, what kind of business do you have to be in where 15
> seconds are a life or death matter?
> Need sales numbers from an associate for a presentation? Need to let
> your secretary know you will be tied up in a meeting all afternoon?
> ... etc
> --- snip ---
>
> One of my points is PTT is not for everyone. People that utilize PTT
> like that there is practically no delay.
>
> It's simply a feature that people like. Imagine that you had a TV that
> took 15 deconds to change a channel the first time you click the
> remote. Some people could live with it, some people can't. Just
> like some people insist on high speed Internet access and others don't.
> There are instances where people want to communicate in near real time.
>
> If you don't need PTT, then get a Verizon phone. I have one for
> personal use. If you want a responsive PTT, get Nextel.
>
> An important issue of this discussion is that Verizon's PTT is not as
> good as Nextel's. Whether PTT is a useful thing or not is up to the
> user.
>
> When chosing a provider, one should consider everything including
> *coverage in the area where you use it
> *price plans
> *PTT quality
> *cell phone
> *connection reliablility
> *phone features and durability
> ... and the list goes on.
>
> My advice is for the user to be educated. I don't like when people
> believe Nextel's PTT is as good as Verizon's. It is not. Try before
> you buy!
>

This is why Nextel is going through re-banding and is giving up their 800
MHz spectrum.
<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> However, knowing the spectrum that Nextel uses for their service is within
> the the 800 MHz public Safety Band, and the ever expanding list of
official
> complaints to the FCC by Public Safety pertaining to interferene caused by
> Nextel.........
>
> I don't see this cause of RF interference to Public Safety to be a good
> thing; especially if it keeps public Safety officers from doing thieir job
> efficiently; or is the cause of loss of life.........
>
> The 15 seconds (and more) delay is offten caused by lost Public Safety
comms
> that were effectively jammed by adjacent Nextel exchanges - And you are so
> correct is stating it is a life and death matter.
>
> ---------------- Much S N I P P A G E ----------------------
> > Big Bob wrote:
> >
> > > Nextel markets to municipalities and other political organizations
that
> > > run
> > emergency services (for example, fire/police departments). In such
cases,
> > you'd better believe 15 seconds can be the difference between life and
> > death.
> >
>
>

Steve Sobol wrote:
> Big Bob wrote:
>
>> I am completely confused. Taking into account all the different ways
>> that one uses PTT, what kind of business do you have to be in where 15
>> seconds are a life or death matter?
>
>
> Nextel markets to municipalities and other political organizations that
> run emergency services (for example, fire/police departments). In such
> cases, you'd better believe 15 seconds can be the difference between
> life and death.


I guess those municipalities don't ask many questions. Nextel forgets
little stuff like emergency generators at many of their sites.

We were recently working at a location that happened to have a Nextel
site in the rear of the property. There was a local power failure. The
building we were in had emergency generators so we were able to keep
working. A few hours after the power went off the Nextel guy showed up
to check out why the site was down. He had the door propped open so we
wandered over. He said it took so long for him to get there because
there were only two people who covered a very large area. There was no
generator and he said that he could go get a trailer mounted unit but it
wasn't a company requirement. The site only had a couple cheepo lead
acid batteries that were sloppily connected. He said they would keep the
site up for 15 minutes. We asked him if this was a typical setup and he
said it was.

>
> Now, I'm pretty sure Verizon is aiming more at business customers, and
> in 99.9% of the cases where businesses are involved you're probably
> right. However, I think 15 seconds is an awfully long time to wait to
> make a PTT connection. Unacceptably long, FWIW, in which case my choice
> would be Nextel, or maybe Sprint. I don't know how Sprint is, but
> they're supposed to be much better than Verizon. My brother just
> switched to Sprint and got a ReadyLink phone, but AFAIK he doesn't know
> anyone else with one, so he can't test their PTT...
>
>> Do whatever you want, but understand that you are using an incredible
>> technology. The fact that either of the PTT technologies even work
>> without any visible wiring is a miracle in and of itself.
>
>
> I agree. :>
>

On 21 Jun 2005 20:26:31 -0700, [email protected] wrote:

> For the same reason, Police, Firemen, Drivers, industrial workers,
> security guards do.
>
> Ask your self why they don't call each other up on speaker phones.

Actually many police officers do carry cell phones now since they often need
to call citizens or businesses, and want to avoid the scanner freaks who
monitor the police radios for "hot" happenings.

Not every PD has the new digital radio systems.

[email protected] wrote:
> However, knowing the spectrum that Nextel uses for their service is within
> the the 800 MHz public Safety Band, and the ever expanding list of official
> complaints to the FCC by Public Safety pertaining to interferene caused by
> Nextel.........

But they're switching frequencies because of that, no?


--
JustThe.net - Steve Sobol / [email protected] / PGP: 0xE3AE35ED
Coming to you from Southern California's High Desert, where the
temperatures are as high as the gas prices! / 888.480.4NET (4638)

"Life's like an hourglass glued to the table" --Anna Nalick, "Breathe"