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  1. #16
    Ivor Jones
    Guest

    Re: Nokia 7610 imei Change Software

    Johan Wevers wrote:
    > Ivor Jones wrote:
    >
    >> But it may not be your own property - there is little reason to
    >> change the IMEI unless the phone was stolen.

    >
    > Of course there is. For example, I suspect the police to tap some of
    > my phone numbers. I don't know how smart they are, but suppose they
    > record the IMEI. Changing sim isn't enough then to stop them
    > recording my buisiness calls, and buying a new phone each time is
    > expensive. Fortunately, in a model like the 3310, I can change the
    > IMEI myself.


    One wonders what you are doing that you think the police may be interested
    in your phone conversations..! No I don't wonder at all really, because
    you're just a troll and I'm wasting my time.

    <Plonk>

    Ivor





    See More: Nokia 7610 imei Change Software




  2. #17
    Ivor Jones
    Guest

    Re: Nokia 7610 imei Change Software

    Johan Wevers wrote:
    > Ivor Jones wrote:
    >
    >> Are you really so stupid as to advise people how to break the
    >> law..?

    >
    > That depends what law. I don't see any reason why UK laws would
    > apply to me since I don't live there. And I can't see from the OP's
    > email address where he lives.


    The OP is in the UK. And the database of barred IMEI numbers is EU-wide so
    I would assume the Netherlands has a similar law in place.

    Ivor





  3. #18
    Johan Wevers
    Guest

    Re: Nokia 7610 imei Change Software

    Ivor Jones wrote:

    > One wonders what you are doing that you think the police may be interested
    > in your phone conversations..!


    I hope you don't assume I'm going to write that down in a public
    newsgroup... :-)

    But anyway, even if they are not, with the current trend towards a
    police state with the excuse of combatting terrorism makes it a good
    idea to make it as difficult as possible for the government to monitor
    and store all calls.

    --
    ir. J.C.A. Wevers // Physics and science fiction site:
    [email protected] // http://www.xs4all.nl/~johanw/index.html
    PGP/GPG public keys at http://www.xs4all.nl/~johanw/pgpkeys.html



  4. #19
    Johan Wevers
    Guest

    Re: Nokia 7610 imei Change Software

    Richard Colton wrote:

    > According to the posting IP, he's using NTL in the UK,


    Ah, I didn't know that provider. So it's my lack of knowladge.

    >There are very few legitimate reasons to change the IMEI


    Preventing being eavesdropped on is another.

    > a phone, and given that the OP is in the UK with the stringent penalties
    > that apply to the offence, is it really worth it?


    Given the ease on which it can be done on DCT3 handsets, I would see
    no risk in doing it on a phone I own myself (i.e., not doing it for
    customers on a large scale). It seems to be rather complicated on a
    DCT4 handset, requiring soldering, but DCT3 is perfect for this purpose.

    --
    ir. J.C.A. Wevers // Physics and science fiction site:
    [email protected] // http://www.xs4all.nl/~johanw/index.html
    PGP/GPG public keys at http://www.xs4all.nl/~johanw/pgpkeys.html



  5. #20
    Johan Wevers
    Guest

    Re: Nokia 7610 imei Change Software

    Ivor Jones wrote:

    > The OP is in the UK. And the database of barred IMEI numbers is EU-wide so
    > I would assume the Netherlands has a similar law in place.


    Not here. In The Netherlands no barring list is enabled. The minister of
    justice is talking about requiring such a list to be implemented by the
    providers, and was also talking about making it illegal to change IMEI,
    but this is only talking yet. No law has even been proposed yet, so it's
    not illegal here.

    Anyway, a ridiculous law. You should be permitted to do with your own
    property what you want, including to change a number. Which doesn't make
    stealing phones legal of course, changed IMEI or not.

    --
    ir. J.C.A. Wevers // Physics and science fiction site:
    [email protected] // http://www.xs4all.nl/~johanw/index.html
    PGP/GPG public keys at http://www.xs4all.nl/~johanw/pgpkeys.html



  6. #21
    Richard Colton
    Guest

    Re: Nokia 7610 imei Change Software


    "Johan Wevers" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > Ivor Jones wrote:
    >
    >> The OP is in the UK. And the database of barred IMEI numbers is EU-wide
    >> so
    >> I would assume the Netherlands has a similar law in place.

    >
    > Not here. In The Netherlands no barring list is enabled. The minister of
    > justice is talking about requiring such a list to be implemented by the
    > providers, and was also talking about making it illegal to change IMEI,
    > but this is only talking yet. No law has even been proposed yet, so it's
    > not illegal here.
    >
    > Anyway, a ridiculous law. You should be permitted to do with your own
    > property what you want, including to change a number. Which doesn't make
    > stealing phones legal of course, changed IMEI or not.


    You could use the analogy of the chassis or engine numbers of a car. There
    are no good legal reasons to want to change them. The problem I have with
    the law in the UK is not the intent to stop IMEI changing (that's laudable),
    but the penalties for actually doing it, or providing equipment or software
    to do the job knowing it will be used for that purpose are ridiculously out
    of scale to the offence. It's a carzy situation, when you can spend more
    time in prison for altering the IMEI than if you'd gone out and stolen a
    phone in the first place. The problem with this law is that it's treating
    the symptom and not the cause.

    --
    >>> Unlock Your Phone's Potential <<<
    >>> www.uselessinfo.org.uk <<<
    >>> www.thephonelocker.co.uk <<<
    >>> www.gsm-solutions.co.uk <<<






  7. #22
    Marshall Lai
    Guest

    Re: Nokia 7610 imei Change Software

    IF the police is doing it LEGALLY, wouldn't that be classified as OSTRUCTION
    OF JUSTICE?
    "Johan Wevers" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > Ivor Jones wrote:
    >
    >> But it may not be your own property - there is little reason to change
    >> the
    >> IMEI unless the phone was stolen.

    >
    > Of course there is. For example, I suspect the police to tap some of
    > my phone numbers. I don't know how smart they are, but suppose they
    > record the IMEI. Changing sim isn't enough then to stop them recording
    > my buisiness calls, and buying a new phone each time is expensive.
    > Fortunately, in a model like the 3310, I can change the IMEI myself.
    >
    > --
    > ir. J.C.A. Wevers // Physics and science fiction site:
    > [email protected] // http://www.xs4all.nl/~johanw/index.html
    > PGP/GPG public keys at http://www.xs4all.nl/~johanw/pgpkeys.html






  8. #23
    Marshall Lai
    Guest

    Re: Nokia 7610 imei Change Software

    OBSTRUCTION.....
    "Marshall Lai" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > IF the police is doing it LEGALLY, wouldn't that be classified as
    > OSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE?
    > "Johan Wevers" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]
    >> Ivor Jones wrote:
    >>
    >>> But it may not be your own property - there is little reason to change
    >>> the
    >>> IMEI unless the phone was stolen.

    >>
    >> Of course there is. For example, I suspect the police to tap some of
    >> my phone numbers. I don't know how smart they are, but suppose they
    >> record the IMEI. Changing sim isn't enough then to stop them recording
    >> my buisiness calls, and buying a new phone each time is expensive.
    >> Fortunately, in a model like the 3310, I can change the IMEI myself.
    >>
    >> --
    >> ir. J.C.A. Wevers // Physics and science fiction site:
    >> [email protected] // http://www.xs4all.nl/~johanw/index.html
    >> PGP/GPG public keys at http://www.xs4all.nl/~johanw/pgpkeys.html

    >
    >






  9. #24
    Sy/\\/apZ
    Guest

    Re: Nokia 7610 imei Change Software

    > Are you really so stupid as to advise people how to break the law..? They
    > call that being an accessory.


    ** DO NOT FEED THE TROLL **





  10. #25
    Sy/\\/apZ
    Guest

    Re: Nokia 7610 imei Change Software

    > Are you really so stupid as to advise people how to break the law..? They
    > call that being an accessory.


    ** DO NOT FEED THE TROLL **





  11. #26
    John Jordan
    Guest

    Re: Nokia 7610 imei Change Software


    >
    > Anyway, a ridiculous law. You should be permitted to do with your own
    > property what you want, including to change a number. Which doesn't make
    > stealing phones legal of course, changed IMEI or not.
    >

    Yes, but the mobile network is not your property - and you are expecting to
    be able to use it.





  12. #27
    John Jordan
    Guest

    Re: Nokia 7610 imei Change Software


    >
    > Anyway, a ridiculous law. You should be permitted to do with your own
    > property what you want, including to change a number. Which doesn't make
    > stealing phones legal of course, changed IMEI or not.
    >

    Yes, but the mobile network is not your property - and you are expecting to
    be able to use it.





  13. #28
    Johan Wevers
    Guest

    Re: Nokia 7610 imei Change Software

    Marshall Lai wrote:

    > IF the police is doing it LEGALLY, wouldn't that be classified as
    > OSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE?


    If that were so, it would also be obstruction of justice to have your
    curtains closed if a police officer walks through the street. Although
    I know people who actually think so.

    But when you're attacking the police because you don't agree with some
    of their actions, like action groups here against the massive use of
    speed camera's, you'd better count on them listening to your phone.

    --
    ir. J.C.A. Wevers // Physics and science fiction site:
    [email protected] // http://www.xs4all.nl/~johanw/index.html
    PGP/GPG public keys at http://www.xs4all.nl/~johanw/pgpkeys.html



  14. #29
    Johan Wevers
    Guest

    Re: Nokia 7610 imei Change Software

    Richard Colton wrote:

    > You could use the analogy of the chassis or engine numbers of a car.


    Not really. Cars are taxed and chassis numbers are used for that.
    Phones are not taxed.

    > There are no good legal reasons to want to change them.


    Trying to preventing to be tapped by the police is legal.

    > but the penalties for actually doing it,


    Did they claim it was necessary against terrorism? That's the
    standard excuse here if the gouvernment wants to increase state
    control over the population.

    > or providing equipment or software to do the job knowing it will be
    > used for that purpose are ridiculously out of scale to the offence.


    But using that proves you're technically skilled - at least more
    skilled than most MP's. And that makes you dangerous in their eyes.

    --
    ir. J.C.A. Wevers // Physics and science fiction site:
    [email protected] // http://www.xs4all.nl/~johanw/index.html
    PGP/GPG public keys at http://www.xs4all.nl/~johanw/pgpkeys.html



  15. #30
    Johan Wevers
    Guest

    Re: Nokia 7610 imei Change Software

    John Jordan wrote:

    >> Anyway, a ridiculous law. You should be permitted to do with your own
    >> property what you want, including to change a number. Which doesn't make
    >> stealing phones legal of course, changed IMEI or not.


    > Yes, but the mobile network is not your property - and you are expecting to
    > be able to use it.


    I don't change anything on the network itself. I know that in some Asian
    countries you can you your SIM only in ONE phone, but here I'm free to put
    my SIM in another phone if I like.

    --
    ir. J.C.A. Wevers // Physics and science fiction site:
    [email protected] // http://www.xs4all.nl/~johanw/index.html
    PGP/GPG public keys at http://www.xs4all.nl/~johanw/pgpkeys.html



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