Question Regarding Data-- Is there any included method?

I believe there used to be a circuit switched 14.4K data option for Sprint
users that just used minutes, something like dial #777, web, web. Is there
any data options available from the phone & tethered laptop that do not cost
any money monthly? I don't mind dialing my own ISP.
If the answer is yes for the older 2G handsets, do you know if the current
generation handsets can still be used this way? If I do this, and it works,
will I be charged per kilobyte?

I'm not trolling here. I actually have used this feature for years on
Verizon, and am investigating this issue to see if I can switch to Sprint
without losing a feature I use. With Verizon, all the 2G handsets that
support data can dial #777, qnc, qnc and get a 14.4K data connection that
just uses minutes (no additional monthly charge). In addition, the newer 3G
handsets simply need a modem initialization string to connect at the slower
14.4K speed (AT$QCMDR=2) which continues to be free (it does use minutes--
by "free" I mean that I use my unlimited nights and weekend minutes).

I find Sprint's no roaming option to be an appealing possibility, but may
not be able to consider switching if I'd have to start paying for data which
I have gotten for free the past several years.

Thanks in advance for your help,

-Dan

PS: I don't care about any of the "high speed" data services. My needs are
simple and text-only (SSH). I prefer not to have to pay seperately.
---
Eugene, Oregon -- Pacific Northwest
http://cell.uoregon.edu

---

› See More: Question Regarding Data-- Is there any included method?

"Dan Albrich" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I believe there used to be a circuit switched 14.4K data option for Sprint
> users that just used minutes, something like dial #777, web, web.

That was the former internet access called Wireless Web aka: WW.

> Is there
> any data options available from the phone & tethered laptop that do not
cost
> any money monthly? I don't mind dialing my own ISP.

No, unless you currently have the WW option on your plan now. With the new
plans and new phones, it's Vision, and it will cost you. If you don't want
to subscribe to that, it will cost you between $0.01 to $0.02 per KB.

> If the answer is yes for the older 2G handsets, do you know if the current
> generation handsets can still be used this way? If I do this, and it
works,
> will I be charged per kilobyte?

No, if you can dial out on the new phones to access your ISP, it's going to
cost you $0.39/min. It's not worth doing that.
>
> I'm not trolling here. I actually have used this feature for years on
> Verizon, and am investigating this issue to see if I can switch to Sprint
> without losing a feature I use. With Verizon, all the 2G handsets that
> support data can dial #777, qnc, qnc and get a 14.4K data connection that
> just uses minutes (no additional monthly charge). In addition, the newer
3G
> handsets simply need a modem initialization string to connect at the
slower
> 14.4K speed (AT$QCMDR=2) which continues to be free (it does use minutes--
> by "free" I mean that I use my unlimited nights and weekend minutes).
>
> I find Sprint's no roaming option to be an appealing possibility, but may
> not be able to consider switching if I'd have to start paying for data
which
> I have gotten for free the past several years.

Well, it sounds like you want to do a lot of accessing. You will need to
subscribe to Vision to do it.
>
> Thanks in advance for your help,
>
> -Dan

> > I believe there used to be a circuit switched 14.4K data option for
Sprint
> > users that just used minutes, something like dial #777, web, web.
>
> That was the former internet access called Wireless Web aka: WW.
>
> > Is there
> > any data options available from the phone & tethered laptop that do not
> cost
> > any money monthly? I don't mind dialing my own ISP.
>
> No, unless you currently have the WW option on your plan now. With the new
> plans and new phones, it's Vision, and it will cost you. If you don't want
> to subscribe to that, it will cost you between $0.01 to $0.02 per KB.
>
> > If the answer is yes for the older 2G handsets, do you know if the
current
> > generation handsets can still be used this way? If I do this, and it
> works,
> > will I be charged per kilobyte?
>
> No, if you can dial out on the new phones to access your ISP, it's going
to
> cost you $0.39/min. It's not worth doing that.
> >
> > I'm not trolling here. I actually have used this feature for years on
> > Verizon, and am investigating this issue to see if I can switch to
Sprint
> > without losing a feature I use. With Verizon, all the 2G handsets
that
> > support data can dial #777, qnc, qnc and get a 14.4K data connection
that
> > just uses minutes (no additional monthly charge). In addition, the
newer
> 3G
> > handsets simply need a modem initialization string to connect at the
> slower
> > 14.4K speed (AT$QCMDR=2) which continues to be free (it does use
minutes--
> > by "free" I mean that I use my unlimited nights and weekend minutes).
> >
> > I find Sprint's no roaming option to be an appealing possibility, but
may
> > not be able to consider switching if I'd have to start paying for data
> which
> > I have gotten for free the past several years.
>
> Well, it sounds like you want to do a lot of accessing. You will need to
> subscribe to Vision to do it.
> >
> > Thanks in advance for your help,
> >
> > -Dan

Thank you Bob. I really appreciate the information.

-Dan


>
>

Dan Albrich wrote:

> I believe there used to be a circuit switched 14.4K data option for Sprint
> users that just used minutes, something like dial #777, web, web.

That's actually the current method for dialing using vision, the 1xRTT
higher-speed data service that Sprint has. The old circuit switched
method was #2932 I beleive.

> Is there
> any data options available from the phone & tethered laptop that do not cost
> any money monthly?

Nope. Some people have reportedly gotten away with using the $15 Vision
add-on packs with unlimited data to use as a tethered solution, but if
you go by the letter of the PCS user agreement, that add-on wasn't
intended for this type of connection.

For older 2G handsets, the wireless web option was $5 and used airtime.

> If the answer is yes for the older 2G handsets, do you know if the current
> generation handsets can still be used this way?

Yes, but you will be charged on the order of $.39 per minute that you're
connected. So, using the 2G dialup method for data isn't advisable.


> I'm not trolling here. I actually have used this feature for years on
> Verizon, and am investigating this issue to see if I can switch to Sprint
> without losing a feature I use. With Verizon, all the 2G handsets that
> support data can dial #777, qnc, qnc and get a 14.4K data connection that
> just uses minutes (no additional monthly charge). In addition, the newer 3G
> handsets simply need a modem initialization string to connect at the slower
> 14.4K speed (AT$QCMDR=2) which continues to be free (it does use minutes--
> by "free" I mean that I use my unlimited nights and weekend minutes).

Considering that Verizon has their own monthly plans for just this type
of use, I would guess that similar to Sprint's this is technically not
kosher. Sprint just happens to do a slightly better job of making sure
they get SOME revenue for the data usage.

> I find Sprint's no roaming option to be an appealing possibility, but may
> not be able to consider switching if I'd have to start paying for data which
> I have gotten for free the past several years.

Then I guess you're sticking with Verizon.


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Transpose the c's and a's in my e-mail address to reply.

> I find Sprint's no roaming option to be an appealing possibility, but may
> not be able to consider switching if I'd have to start paying for data which
> I have gotten for free the past several years.

Get a calling plan from T-Mobile and you'll get a free data connection (GPRS)
with it.

--
John Richards

Dan Albrich wrote:

> I believe there used to be a circuit switched 14.4K data option for
> Sprint users that just used minutes, something like dial #777, web,
> web. Is there any data options available from the phone & tethered
> laptop that do not cost any money monthly?

No. $15 a month gets you "Vision", their term for data access. Vision
works the same way (#777), but you'll get data a LOT faster than any
14.4K. Average I've found to be around 80K (I've seen speeds as high as
120K). You don't need an ISP, in fact, if you used one, it would cost
you by the minute.

Officially, Vision is for in-phone use. Sprint doesn't officially
sanction tethered usage -- they're evidently afraid of 24-7 KaZaa
downloaders taking advantage of a $15 all-you-can-eat monthly cost for
faster-than-dialup speeds. Problem is, there's no way at least
currently to distiguish between in-phone and tethered usage, so they
apparently monitor the amount of data downloaded. If you don't do
massive MP3, etc. downloading and such, you'll be all right.

Because they don't officially sanction it, you'll have to get your cable
from places like FutureDial.com.

I wouldn't want to replace my regular ISP with its 3mbps cable
connection, but tethered Vision is very nice to have when you need to
connect your laptop to the Net on the road, in the airport, at the
convention center, etc. etc.

--
da
~~
"OE Quotefix" http://flash.to/oe-quotefix
to fix Outlook Express' broken quoting.

On Thu, 15 Jan 2004 16:15:12 -0500, Isaiah Beard wrote:

> Dan Albrich wrote:
>
>> I believe there used to be a circuit switched 14.4K data option for Sprint
>> users that just used minutes, something like dial #777, web, web.
>
> That's actually the current method for dialing using vision, the 1xRTT
> higher-speed data service that Sprint has. The old circuit switched
> method was #2932 I beleive.
>
>> Is there
>> any data options available from the phone & tethered laptop that do not cost
>> any money monthly?
>
> Nope. Some people have reportedly gotten away with using the $15 Vision
> add-on packs with unlimited data to use as a tethered solution, but if
> you go by the letter of the PCS user agreement, that add-on wasn't
> intended for this type of connection.
>
> For older 2G handsets, the wireless web option was $5 and used airtime.
>
>> If the answer is yes for the older 2G handsets, do you know if the current
>> generation handsets can still be used this way?
>
> Yes, but you will be charged on the order of $.39 per minute that you're
> connected. So, using the 2G dialup method for data isn't advisable.
<SNIP>

Ok there were reports of dialing out on new generation phones when vision
was starting to roll around the corner but I have not see any recently. As
long as you have the Wireless Web option using the 2G dialup method will
only eat your mins up. Sadly tho you will not find a sprint rep who will
put 2G Wireless Web option on a vision phone(which may or may not be
capable with the new units) without twisting their arm. On a side note
sprint has abolished all connection kits(even 2G) for the phones. This fact by
itself shows how open they are to connecting phones to the laptop, and yes
I know you can buy the cables from third parties. I personally use vision
with radioshack futuredial cable without problems to vpn/ssh/ssl-http
proxy/etc.. away from home or in the car and it works great. It is much
better then the 2G equiv dialup setup I had with cingular(Lag was
900-1.5kms Sprint is 400-600ms). When I signed up for vision like you I
was looking for laptop usage and was promised it but sadly sprint has
decided to change their minds so I recommend try calling them up and see
if they can offer you anything remotely close to what you want and if not
just explain how you are going to stay with verizon. Maybe someday sprint
will see tethered laptop users can be good for business without being abusive.

> Considering that Verizon has their own monthly plans for just this type
> of use, I would guess that similar to Sprint's this is technically not
> kosher. Sprint just happens to do a slightly better job of making sure
> they get SOME revenue for the data usage.

1st- Thanks for the helpful information and tips. I appreciate them.

2nd (more as FYI etc.) --> Verizon supported free (just uses minutes) 14.4K
data for years. They called it mobile office for circuit switched data,
complete with web pages describing the service and how to use it, and a
dedicated support group for data. They even gave folks a free email account
(which I still have, and still works). The email was primarily to allow
SMTP authentication, but allowed for POP and webmail access. In June of
2003 Verizon took the circuit switched data information off of their website
(so they've obviously depricated this service in favor of their fee-based
data service "National Access"). Who knows, in the future they may make
14.4K data quit working, stop supporting it, or even start charging for it.
In any event, it has never been something anyone paid for, and was an
officially supported option for years.

This is not akin to folks using vision with tethered laptops because from
the very beginning this type of use was never officially sanctioned, and
even Sprint's website listed a separate price for laptop tethered use. When
I started my Verizon service, and for several years, data use with a laptop
was simply an included service. I continue to use it to this day, and even
have called the data group for help in the past few months and received help
using it (I got a new 3g handset and needed help getting the 14.4K data
working with a future dial cable).

Back when this feature existed on their website, and was officially
supported, I would routinely send folks toward Verizon that had limited data
needs. Now that they have pulled the web pages, I don't feel comfortable
pointing folks at this service (even though it still exists), because it may
be pulled at any time.

I have a Kyocera 6035 palm phone and use the 14.4K data both from my phone
directly, and with my laptop. I doubt they'll take this away from existing
users (who have had it for years) unless some technology issue forces their
hand -- i.e. if EVDO doesn't allow QNC circuit switched data to coexist. At
the same time, I can see them not wanting to help *new* customers get on
this legacy system.
Ah, very long winded FYI...

"Dan Albrich" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> This is not akin to folks using vision with tethered laptops because from
> the very beginning this type of use was never officially sanctioned, and

Actually, Sprint *did* officially sanction tethered usage when Vision first
came out, because Vision data itself was supposed to be measured, and
charged accordingly. My own initial service plan included 2MB of Vision.
Larger quantities were also available, with higher pricing, and were
intended for PDAs and laptops.

During the first couple of months that Vision was available, Sprint assured
customers that it was not yet actually measuring Vision data usage. Rather,
customers were encouraged to find out, experimentally, how much they would
need per month. But less than 3 months after Vision's public launch, Sprint
announced new service plans that included Unlimited Vision. Shortly
thereafter, Sprint "grandfathered" the initial Vision customers (whose plans
specified measured data usage) onto Unlimited Vision also. Presumably,
Sprint had decided that measured Vision was either unworkable or unsellable.

Even after that point, the issue of tethered usage was muddled for many
months. Initially, Sprint reps and supervisors repeatedly told customers
that such usage was definitely permissible, and even wrote notes to that
effect in customers' accounts. Later, reps and supervisors began to say
that heavy use was forbidden, but moderate use was acceptable. Very
recently, most reps and supervisors will not admit any degree of
acceptability to tethered usage, though informal sources indicate that
Sprint enforcement targets heavy users, not moderate or light ones.

John Richards wrote:

>>I find Sprint's no roaming option to be an appealing possibility, but may
>>not be able to consider switching if I'd have to start paying for data which
>>I have gotten for free the past several years.
>
>
> Get a calling plan from T-Mobile and you'll get a free data connection (GPRS)
> with it.

However, it's important to note that this "free" connection is severely
hobbled, limited to only port 80 and 25 traffic. Basically, just e-mail
and web surfing (and not SSL either). If this is fine for you, then go
for it. But for anyone who plans on SSH, SSL, telnet or other methods
that require net access on different ports, T-Mo's free GPRS option
won't work for you.



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Dan Albrich wrote:


> I have a Kyocera 6035 palm phone and use the 14.4K data both from my phone
> directly, and with my laptop. I doubt they'll take this away from existing
> users (who have had it for years) unless some technology issue forces their
> hand -- i.e. if EVDO doesn't allow QNC circuit switched data to coexist.

EVDO should be just fine with allowing circuit-switched data. I think
really the only technological or market force that would cause Verizon
(or Sprint for that matter) to drop circuit switched data is whether a
point will come where it becomes too expensive to maintain. In order
for circuit data to work, Sprint and Verizon have to maintain analog
modem banks to allow your cell phone to "dial out" on circuit switched
data. If/when it is no longer cost effective to keep these modems
running, they'll probably discontinue the service. You'll most likely
get ample notice though; I beleive AT&T gave people almost a year before
they announced they would stop supporting CDPD.

And FYI, maintaing a rack of modems isn't cheap. A year ago where I
work, a proposal was floated around where our IT department planned to
decommission our modem pool (where I work, employees have the option of
getting free dialup ISP access through this modem pool), because they
assumed a lot of people would rather get broadband and work over a VPN.
The IT department faced budget cuts, and they figured if they
decommissioned the modem pool they wouldn't have to lay anyone off.

Unfortunately, the backlash to this plan was SOOO huge that the IT
department was forced to keep the modem racks up and running, and they
had to lay off five people to cover the expense. Some people really
like their free dialup, I guess (FYI; I'm on a cable modem myself).



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