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- 03-07-2005, 08:02 PM #1Guest
[email protected] wrote:
> Verizon just sucks.
Don't forget that all the equipment suppliers (Lucent, Nortel,
Motorola, etc.)
have been cutting jobs for the last 4 years. So, the remaining
engineers
are under constant pressure (Local police showing up in the lobby on
Thursday,
job cut day). Ergo, the cell switches aren't as robust as you'd like.
JG
› See More: Tech experts: Is there a real technical problem with CDMA /bluetooth?
- 03-07-2005, 09:19 PM #2QuickGuest
Re: Tech experts: Is there a real technical problem with CDMA /bluetooth?
[email protected] wrote:
>
> Don't forget that all the equipment suppliers (Lucent,
> Nortel, Motorola, etc.) have been cutting jobs for the
> last 4 years. So, the remaining engineers are under
> constant pressure (Local police showing up in the
> lobby on Thursday, job cut day). Ergo, the cell switches
> aren't as robust as you'd like.
"cell switch"? what's a cell switch?
-Quick
- 03-08-2005, 08:21 AM #3geneGuest
Re: Tech experts: Is there a real technical problem with CDMA /bluetooth?
cell switches function as the device which connects the cell tower to
the cellular network
Quick wrote:
> [email protected] wrote:
>
>>Don't forget that all the equipment suppliers (Lucent,
>>Nortel, Motorola, etc.) have been cutting jobs for the
>>last 4 years. So, the remaining engineers are under
>>constant pressure (Local police showing up in the
>>lobby on Thursday, job cut day). Ergo, the cell switches
>>aren't as robust as you'd like.
>
>
> "cell switch"? what's a cell switch?
>
> -Quick
>
>
- 03-08-2005, 11:08 AM #4QuickGuest
Re: Tech experts: Is there a real technical problem with CDMA /bluetooth?
More specific please? I'm going to assume that "tower
to the cellular network" does not mean the radio interface.
So what is this "cellular network"? I kind of think it's T1s
that connect the "tower" to whatever on the land side
of the tower? Is there some sort of "cell switch" used
there? I mean is there something there that is in any
way specific to cellular networks? Or is this the same
stuff that's been used in PSTN network for years and
years.
-Quick
gene wrote:
> cell switches function as the device which connects the
> cell tower to the cellular network
>
> Quick wrote:
>> [email protected] wrote:
>>
>>> Don't forget that all the equipment suppliers (Lucent,
>>> Nortel, Motorola, etc.) have been cutting jobs for the
>>> last 4 years. So, the remaining engineers are under
>>> constant pressure (Local police showing up in the
>>> lobby on Thursday, job cut day). Ergo, the cell switches
>>> aren't as robust as you'd like.
>>
>>
>> "cell switch"? what's a cell switch?
>>
>> -Quick
- 03-08-2005, 03:13 PM #5Isaiah BeardGuest
Re: Tech experts: Is there a real technical problem with CDMA /bluetooth?
>>cell switches function as the device which connects the
>>cell tower to the cellular network
Quick wrote:
> More specific please?
He is referring to the MTSO, the Mobile Telephone Switching Office. The
"switch," as on any circuit-switched telephone network, routes calls to
their appropriate destinations, and in the case of a cellular network,
ties the radio interface to the PSTN (public switched telephone network).
> I'm going to assume that "tower
> to the cellular network" does not mean the radio interface.
> So what is this "cellular network"?
Okay, now you're just being obtuse.
--
E-mail fudged to thwart spammers.
Transpose the c's and a's in my e-mail address to reply.
- 03-08-2005, 03:35 PM #6QuickGuest
Re: Tech experts: Is there a real technical problem with CDMA /bluetooth?
Isaiah Beard wrote:
>>> cell switches function as the device which connects the
> >>cell tower to the cellular network
>
> Quick wrote:
>> More specific please?
>
> He is referring to the MTSO, the Mobile Telephone
> Switching Office. The "switch," as on any
> circuit-switched telephone network, routes calls to their
> appropriate destinations, and in the case of a cellular
> network, ties the radio interface to the PSTN (public
> switched telephone network).
>
> > I'm going to assume that "tower
>> to the cellular network" does not mean the radio
>> interface. So what is this "cellular network"?
>
> Okay, now you're just being obtuse.
So the point is that these "cell switches" are most
likely 5eSS's or dms100's with an extra feature or
two?
It was implied that crummy cell service was due
to crummy equipment (cell switches) being made/
maintained by people effected by the relatively recent
layoffs...
-Quick
- 03-09-2005, 10:26 AM #7Isaiah BeardGuest
Re: Tech experts: Is there a real technical problem with CDMA /bluetooth?
Quick wrote:
> Isaiah Beard wrote:
>>Okay, now you're just being obtuse.
>
>
> So the point is that these "cell switches" are most
> likely 5eSS's or dms100's with an extra feature or
> two?
DMS-10's actually, but the Lucent markets are 5ESS switches.
> It was implied that crummy cell service was due
> to crummy equipment (cell switches) being made/
> maintained by people effected by the relatively recent
> layoffs...
Agreed that this is not a valid argument at all.
--
E-mail fudged to thwart spammers.
Transpose the c's and a's in my e-mail address to reply.
- 03-09-2005, 04:11 PM #8Guest
Re: Tech experts: Is there a real technical problem with CDMA /bluetooth?
Let's just call it the cellular infrastructure, and the layoffs
have been ongoing since 2001:
Motorola: 33% cut
Nortel: over 50% cut
Lucent: over 66% job cuts.
So, anything made by them is bound to be "buggy".
My favorite "feature" was the buzzing sound after about 10-15 minutes
using a Nokia CDMA phone and Lucent infrastructure,
on a Primeco/US Cellular network.
JG
- 03-09-2005, 04:47 PM #9QuickGuest
Re: Tech experts: Is there a real technical problem with CDMA /bluetooth?
[email protected] wrote:
> Let's just call it the cellular infrastructure, and the
> layoffs
> have been ongoing since 2001:
>
> Motorola: 33% cut
> Nortel: over 50% cut
> Lucent: over 66% job cuts.
>
> So, anything made by them is bound to be "buggy".
My point was that the "cell switches" were made long
before that. Even though your claim is not valid to begin
with.
> My favorite "feature" was the buzzing sound after about
> 10-15 minutes using a Nokia CDMA phone and Lucent
> infrastructure, on a Primeco/US Cellular network.
And how did you attribute this to:
The infrastructure?
A Lucent piece of equipment in the infrastructure?
A bug in that piece of equipment (instead of configuration)?
That the equipment was "made" after 2001?
That equipment made after 2001 was any more buggy than
equipment made before?
(i actually responded to this silliness...)
-Quick
- 03-09-2005, 06:25 PM #10Guest
Re: Tech experts: Is there a real technical problem with CDMA /bluetooth?
Quick wrote:
> [email protected] wrote:
> > Let's just call it the cellular infrastructure, and the
> > layoffs
> > have been ongoing since 2001:
> >
> > Motorola: 33% cut
> > Nortel: over 50% cut
> > Lucent: over 66% job cuts.
> >
> > So, anything made by them is bound to be "buggy".
>
> My point was that the "cell switches" were made long
> before that. Even though your claim is not valid to begin
> with.
>
> > My favorite "feature" was the buzzing sound after about
> > 10-15 minutes using a Nokia CDMA phone and Lucent
> > infrastructure, on a Primeco/US Cellular network.
>
> And how did you attribute this to:
> The infrastructure?
> A Lucent piece of equipment in the infrastructure?
> A bug in that piece of equipment (instead of configuration)?
> That the equipment was "made" after 2001?
> That equipment made after 2001 was any more buggy than
> equipment made before?
Since this occured in 2003, it was equipment supported by
people under 2 years of layoff pressures at LUCifer ENTerprises,
configuration issues don't cause strange buzzing
noises on a CDMA cell phone, its the radio base station.
Or maybe the outsourced BABOO or Red Chinese software!
JG
- 03-10-2005, 01:35 PM #11Isaiah BeardGuest
Re: Tech experts: Is there a real technical problem with CDMA /bluetooth?
[email protected] wrote:
>>>My favorite "feature" was the buzzing sound after about
>>>10-15 minutes using a Nokia CDMA phone and Lucent
>>>infrastructure, on a Primeco/US Cellular network.
>>
>>And how did you attribute this to:
>>The infrastructure?
>>A Lucent piece of equipment in the infrastructure?
>>A bug in that piece of equipment (instead of configuration)?
>>That the equipment was "made" after 2001?
>>That equipment made after 2001 was any more buggy than
>>equipment made before?
>
>
> Since this occured in 2003,
Funny. I know for a fact taht Primeco/US Cellular, as well as most of
the other wireless companies currently in existence, have been around
prior to 2003, and thus had quite a bit of their infrastructure in
place. I fact, Sprint probably has the newest infrastructure really, and
that dates back to almost 9 years ago.
Further, the current switch designs (Nortel DMS-10S, Lucent 5ESS) were
designed way before these cuts ever took place.
Lastly, the switches are the SAME equipment that is used in the
cirucit-siwtched landline network. So why are not seeing these supposed
"bugs" on the PSTN as well as on the mobile networks?
> it was equipment supported by
> people under 2 years of layoff pressures at LUCifer ENTerprises,
> configuration issues don't cause strange buzzing
> noises on a CDMA cell phone, its the radio base station.
> Or maybe the outsourced BABOO or Red Chinese software!
Ah, I think I see your motivation now. So when did they terminate you
for cause?
--
E-mail fudged to thwart spammers.
Transpose the c's and a's in my e-mail address to reply.
- 03-11-2005, 04:36 PM #12Guest
Re: Tech experts: Is there a real technical problem with CDMA /bluetooth?
> >>>My favorite "feature" was the buzzing sound after about
> >>>10-15 minutes using a Nokia CDMA phone and Lucent
> >>>infrastructure, on a Primeco/US Cellular network.
> >
> >
> > Since this occured in 2003,
>
> Funny. I know for a fact taht Primeco/US Cellular, as well as most
of
> the other wireless companies currently in existence, have been around
> prior to 2003, and thus had quite a bit of their infrastructure in
> place. I fact, Sprint probably has the newest infrastructure really,
and
> that dates back to almost 9 years ago.
Therefore, you'd expect the "buzzing" problems to be fixed by 2004, yet
alt.cellular.verizon has 32 topics about buzzing, 2001-2004
".sprintpcs has 30 topics about buzzing 2000-2003.
They had years to fix this, yet buzzing was still occuring in 2004.
Here's a message from Larry W4CSC in alt.cellular.verizon, Sun, 22 Aug
2004 00:20:18 GMT:
" live in Charleston, SC, where VZW is on A and Alltel is on B on the
real
cellular bands. During my last 2 months on VZW, about every third
phone
call coming IN to the phone sounded like the codecs didn't have a sync.
Both ends sounded like we were in a swimming pool trying to talk
underwater, that gurgling, motorboating sound. I had to tell my
customers
I would call them back. When I did, the calls were ok. Incoming calls
were 30-50% trashed. I played the return-the-phone-to-our-store-
technicians a couple of times, but the phone, a V60i was just fine. I
boosted the 611 trouble calls to a ticket and a technician a few times
with
no results. It was always my phone that was defective, take it back to
the
store for repairs. Well, my contract was up on Saturday night, the
14th,
so I ported to Alltel at the main Alltel store first thing Monday the
16th.
......
EVERY phone call on Alltel has been crystal clear, stayed connected and
completed normally....just what I was looking for in a cellular phone.
I'm paying $39 for 700 min, unlimited N/W, free LD 24/7 and the package
of
toys. This is the equivalent of "Local Digital Choice" on VZW. The
area
is larger going from below Brunswick, GA to Norfolk, VA and inland to
parts
of TN and western VA.
......
also have noticed the phone will function perfectly, without that
buzzing
in and out of sync while you're in a call, when the signal is less than
stellar. Alltel's equipment seems to have more sensitive receivers
that
the old Cellular One equipment in Charleston Verizon bought out. I can
make and receive calls with only one or two bars of signal (-95 or less
dBm
on the V60i test page). Verizon's equipment started dropping calls
when
the phone was getting -90 dBm on the test page."
Still BUZZING August 2004.
>
> Further, the current switch designs (Nortel DMS-10S, Lucent 5ESS)
were
> designed way before these cuts ever took place.
>
> Lastly, the switches are the SAME equipment that is used in the
> cirucit-siwtched landline network. So why are not seeing these
supposed
> "bugs" on the PSTN as well as on the mobile networks?
There's radio equipment, made by Lucifer, on the front end.
>
> > it was equipment supported by
> > people under 2 years of layoff pressures at LUCifer ENTerprises,
> > configuration issues don't cause strange buzzing
> > noises on a CDMA cell phone, its the radio base station.
> > Or maybe the outsourced BABOO or Red Chinese software!
>
> Ah, I think I see your motivation now. So when did they terminate
you
> for cause?
>
You must have sold your stock shares when they peaked at $80
JG
- 03-11-2005, 04:45 PM #13QuickGuest
Re: Tech experts: Is there a real technical problem with CDMA /bluetooth?
[email protected] wrote:
>
> Here's a message from Larry W4CSC in
> alt.cellular.verizon, Sun, 22 Aug 2004 00:20:18 GMT:
oh... there's proof. Larry knows a lot about the radio
interface. I'm not sure he knows too much about codecs,
TDM, switching, or voice over. I am sure he knows a
whole lot more than you though. "buzzing..." certainly
a switch problem and most certainly a Lucent switch...
right.
-Quick
- 03-11-2005, 10:18 PM #14Richard NessGuest
Re: Tech experts: Is there a real technical problem with CDMA /bluetooth?
Larry huh???
A proven curmudgeon and one who pulled pure crap out of his a** on a regular
basis.
Quoting him DECREASED your credibility exponentially.
<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
>> >>>My favorite "feature" was the buzzing sound after about
>> >>>10-15 minutes using a Nokia CDMA phone and Lucent
>> >>>infrastructure, on a Primeco/US Cellular network.
>> >
>> >
>> > Since this occured in 2003,
>>
>> Funny. I know for a fact taht Primeco/US Cellular, as well as most
> of
>> the other wireless companies currently in existence, have been around
>
>> prior to 2003, and thus had quite a bit of their infrastructure in
>> place. I fact, Sprint probably has the newest infrastructure really,
> and
>> that dates back to almost 9 years ago.
>
> Therefore, you'd expect the "buzzing" problems to be fixed by 2004, yet
>
> alt.cellular.verizon has 32 topics about buzzing, 2001-2004
> ".sprintpcs has 30 topics about buzzing 2000-2003.
> They had years to fix this, yet buzzing was still occuring in 2004.
>
> Here's a message from Larry W4CSC in alt.cellular.verizon, Sun, 22 Aug
> 2004 00:20:18 GMT:
>
> " live in Charleston, SC, where VZW is on A and Alltel is on B on the
> real
> cellular bands. During my last 2 months on VZW, about every third
> phone
> call coming IN to the phone sounded like the codecs didn't have a sync.
>
> Both ends sounded like we were in a swimming pool trying to talk
> underwater, that gurgling, motorboating sound. I had to tell my
> customers
> I would call them back. When I did, the calls were ok. Incoming calls
>
> were 30-50% trashed. I played the return-the-phone-to-our-store-
> technicians a couple of times, but the phone, a V60i was just fine. I
> boosted the 611 trouble calls to a ticket and a technician a few times
> with
> no results. It was always my phone that was defective, take it back to
> the
> store for repairs. Well, my contract was up on Saturday night, the
> 14th,
> so I ported to Alltel at the main Alltel store first thing Monday the
> 16th.
> .....
> EVERY phone call on Alltel has been crystal clear, stayed connected and
>
> completed normally....just what I was looking for in a cellular phone.
> I'm paying $39 for 700 min, unlimited N/W, free LD 24/7 and the package
> of
> toys. This is the equivalent of "Local Digital Choice" on VZW. The
> area
> is larger going from below Brunswick, GA to Norfolk, VA and inland to
> parts
> of TN and western VA.
> .....
> also have noticed the phone will function perfectly, without that
> buzzing
> in and out of sync while you're in a call, when the signal is less than
>
> stellar. Alltel's equipment seems to have more sensitive receivers
> that
> the old Cellular One equipment in Charleston Verizon bought out. I can
>
> make and receive calls with only one or two bars of signal (-95 or less
> dBm
> on the V60i test page). Verizon's equipment started dropping calls
> when
> the phone was getting -90 dBm on the test page."
>
> Still BUZZING August 2004.
>
>>
>> Further, the current switch designs (Nortel DMS-10S, Lucent 5ESS)
> were
>> designed way before these cuts ever took place.
>>
>> Lastly, the switches are the SAME equipment that is used in the
>> cirucit-siwtched landline network. So why are not seeing these
> supposed
>> "bugs" on the PSTN as well as on the mobile networks?
>
> There's radio equipment, made by Lucifer, on the front end.
>
>>
>> > it was equipment supported by
>> > people under 2 years of layoff pressures at LUCifer ENTerprises,
>> > configuration issues don't cause strange buzzing
>> > noises on a CDMA cell phone, its the radio base station.
>> > Or maybe the outsourced BABOO or Red Chinese software!
>>
>> Ah, I think I see your motivation now. So when did they terminate
> you
>> for cause?
>>
>
> You must have sold your stock shares when they peaked at $80
>
> JG
>
- 03-12-2005, 10:23 AM #15Steve SobolGuest
Re: Tech experts: Is there a real technical problem with CDMA /bluetooth?
Quick wrote:
> [email protected] wrote:
>
>>Here's a message from Larry W4CSC in
>>alt.cellular.verizon, Sun, 22 Aug 2004 00:20:18 GMT:
>
>
> oh... there's proof. Larry knows a lot about the radio
> interface. I'm not sure he knows too much about codecs,
> TDM, switching, or voice over. I am sure he knows a
> whole lot more than you though. "buzzing..." certainly
> a switch problem and most certainly a Lucent switch...
> right.
He says he has no problems using Alltel
Of course, Alltel is CDMA too, so theoretically he should have problems there
as well as on VZW.
**SJS (who hasn't had any CDMA buzzing problems dating back to GTE Mobilnet's
CDMA launch in 1995, and has used several CDMA carriers since then)
--
JustThe.net - Apple Valley, CA - http://JustThe.net/ - 888.480.4NET (4638)
Steven J. Sobol, Geek In Charge / [email protected] / PGP: 0xE3AE35ED
"The wisdom of a fool won't set you free"
--New Order, "Bizarre Love Triangle"
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