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  1. #1
    Notan
    Guest
    Fresh from the latest Sprint brochure, dated 11/05:

    <quote>

    Phone-As-Modem Data Pricing

    Perfect for people who use their Sprint PCS phone as a modem.

    40MB - $25/mo. (capped at $70)

    - Includes Sprint PCS Vision Ultimate Pack

    - Unlimited usage for the first month (after one month, use
    the MB in your plan)

    - Additional data usage $0.001 per KB

    - One-year subscriber agreement required.

    - Requires a voice plan

    Unless Phone-As-Modem Data Pricing is selected, customers
    using a Sprint PCS phone as a modem will be charged $0.02
    per kilobyte for data usage.

    <unquote>

    Notan



    See More: Phone As A Modem - UPDATE




  2. #2
    Donkey Agony
    Guest

    Re: Phone As A Modem - UPDATE

    Notan wrote:
    > Fresh from the latest Sprint brochure, dated 11/05:
    >
    > Phone-As-Modem Data Pricing
    >
    > Perfect for people who use their Sprint PCS phone as a modem.
    >
    > 40MB - $25/mo. (capped at $70)
    >
    > - Includes Sprint PCS Vision Ultimate Pack
    >
    > - Unlimited usage for the first month (after one month, use
    > the MB in your plan)
    >
    > - Additional data usage $0.001 per KB
    >
    > - One-year subscriber agreement required.
    >
    > - Requires a voice plan
    >
    > Unless Phone-As-Modem Data Pricing is selected, customers
    > using a Sprint PCS phone as a modem will be charged $0.02
    > per kilobyte for data usage.


    Interesting.

    Is this both regular Vision and Power Vision?

    Also, so unless you have a "Phone-as-Modem" plan (which, I suppose,
    means you have "regular" Vision/Power Vision), you're going to be
    charged at 2 cents per KB. Otherwise, it's .01 cent per KB. And in
    either case, it's capped at $70, so if you're bittorrenting
    multi-gigabyte Linux ISOs or MP3s or whatever -- whichever plan you're
    on, you're going to cap out at $70 max. Right?

    Thank you, Notan, for keeping tabs on this.

    --
    da
    ~~





  3. #3
    Notan
    Guest

    Re: Phone As A Modem - UPDATE

    Donkey Agony wrote:
    >
    > Notan wrote:
    > > Fresh from the latest Sprint brochure, dated 11/05:
    > >
    > > Phone-As-Modem Data Pricing
    > >
    > > Perfect for people who use their Sprint PCS phone as a modem.
    > >
    > > 40MB - $25/mo. (capped at $70)
    > >
    > > - Includes Sprint PCS Vision Ultimate Pack
    > >
    > > - Unlimited usage for the first month (after one month, use
    > > the MB in your plan)
    > >
    > > - Additional data usage $0.001 per KB
    > >
    > > - One-year subscriber agreement required.
    > >
    > > - Requires a voice plan
    > >
    > > Unless Phone-As-Modem Data Pricing is selected, customers
    > > using a Sprint PCS phone as a modem will be charged $0.02
    > > per kilobyte for data usage.

    >
    > Interesting.
    >
    > Is this both regular Vision and Power Vision?
    >
    > Also, so unless you have a "Phone-as-Modem" plan (which, I suppose,
    > means you have "regular" Vision/Power Vision), you're going to be
    > charged at 2 cents per KB. Otherwise, it's .01 cent per KB. And in
    > either case, it's capped at $70, so if you're bittorrenting
    > multi-gigabyte Linux ISOs or MP3s or whatever -- whichever plan you're
    > on, you're going to cap out at $70 max. Right?
    >
    > Thank you, Notan, for keeping tabs on this.


    Glad to help!

    According to the brochure, the Sprint PCS Vision Ultimate Pack is $20/mo.
    It includes everything that Vision has to offer... Phone Web, Picture Mail,
    and unlimited Video and Audio options.

    If you've already got the Ultimate Pack, the 40MB Data plan will only cost
    an additional $5/mo, assuming you don't go over 40MB. Not bad!

    I'm interpreting the $70 cap as only applying to the 40MB Data plan. In other
    words, if you don't subscribe, and pay $0.02 per KB, there is no cap.

    Notan



  4. #4
    George G
    Guest

    Re: Phone As A Modem - UPDATE

    This service has been available since October, I did post about it in the
    below thread about phone as modem. And yes,of course sillies, if you do not
    have the plan there will be no limit to charges.





  5. #5
    O/Siris
    Guest

    Re: Phone As A Modem - UPDATE

    In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] says...
    > Fresh from the latest Sprint brochure, dated 11/05:
    >
    > <quote>
    >
    > Phone-As-Modem Data Pricing
    >
    > Perfect for people who use their Sprint PCS phone as a modem.
    >
    > 40MB - $25/mo. (capped at $70)
    >
    > - Includes Sprint PCS Vision Ultimate Pack
    >
    > - Unlimited usage for the first month (after one month, use
    > the MB in your plan)
    >
    > - Additional data usage $0.001 per KB
    >
    > - One-year subscriber agreement required.
    >
    > - Requires a voice plan
    >
    > Unless Phone-As-Modem Data Pricing is selected, customers
    > using a Sprint PCS phone as a modem will be charged $0.02
    > per kilobyte for data usage.
    >
    > <unquote>
    >
    > Notan
    >


    Interesting indeed. And also the same verbiage that's been in plan
    brochures (corporate ones, at least) since July.

    --
    RØß
    O/Siris
    -+-
    A thing moderately good
    is not so good as it ought to be.
    Moderation in temper is always a virtue,
    but moderation in principle is always a vice.
    +Thomas Paine, "The Rights of Man", 1792+



  6. #6
    Notan
    Guest

    Re: Phone As A Modem - UPDATE

    O/Siris wrote:
    >
    > In article <[email protected]>, [email protected] says...
    > > Fresh from the latest Sprint brochure, dated 11/05:
    > >
    > > <quote>
    > >
    > > Phone-As-Modem Data Pricing
    > >
    > > Perfect for people who use their Sprint PCS phone as a modem.
    > >
    > > 40MB - $25/mo. (capped at $70)
    > >
    > > - Includes Sprint PCS Vision Ultimate Pack
    > >
    > > - Unlimited usage for the first month (after one month, use
    > > the MB in your plan)
    > >
    > > - Additional data usage $0.001 per KB
    > >
    > > - One-year subscriber agreement required.
    > >
    > > - Requires a voice plan
    > >
    > > Unless Phone-As-Modem Data Pricing is selected, customers
    > > using a Sprint PCS phone as a modem will be charged $0.02
    > > per kilobyte for data usage.
    > >
    > > <unquote>
    > >
    > > Notan
    > >

    >
    > Interesting indeed. And also the same verbiage that's been in plan
    > brochures (corporate ones, at least) since July.


    While I'd love to see something along the lines of, if you use (unsubscribed)
    data minutes they'll come out of your peak minutes bank, this is certainly
    the next best thing. At least, now, there's no threat of Sprint discontinuing
    service for (ab)use. The customer will just be billed, accordingly. At the
    same time, I think it would behoove Sprint to inform *all* customers of this
    change.

    Notan



  7. #7
    Joel Kolstad
    Guest

    Re: Phone As A Modem - UPDATE

    "Notan" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > If you've already got the Ultimate Pack, the 40MB Data plan will only cost
    > an additional $5/mo, assuming you don't go over 40MB. Not bad!


    It does look that way, and I'm definitely willing to pay $60/year to be
    'officially' allowed use of the phone as a modem with a ...relatively...
    reasonable data cap.

    Anyone know when Sprint will start charging for casual use? (I'm one of those
    people who will, while traveling, tether my phone to check e-mail or whatever,
    but will then go months at a time without tethering at all.) It seems as
    though they would have to send out contract addendums or somesuch before they
    could start charging for this.





  8. #8
    Donkey Agony
    Guest

    Re: Phone As A Modem - UPDATE

    Joel Kolstad wrote:
    > Anyone know when Sprint will start charging for casual use? (I'm one
    > of those people who will, while traveling, tether my phone to check
    > e-mail or whatever, but will then go months at a time without
    > tethering at all.)


    I do *exactly* the same thing as you.

    > It seems as though they would have to send out
    > contract addendums or somesuch before they could start charging for
    > this.


    It would be nice if they could accomodate us reasonably with definite
    statements and plans wrt both plain-jane Vision and Power Vision. If
    it's reasonable, we take it. If not, we move elsewhere or make do
    without tethered Vision. These days, I mostly have access while
    traveling to WiFi or ethernet anyway. And I have a dial-up backup in
    case of emergency.

    I recently went to visit a friend. He doesn't currently have broadband
    access, but he offered me his phone lines. When I hooked up my Sanyo to
    my laptop and started emailing and web surfing, his draw dropped in
    stunned amazement.

    It's cool, but I could easily live without it. It *is* nice to have on
    those rare occasions I'm on the road.

    But if it's like their "we'll charge $2.50 a song, and our users will
    pay up even though iTunes charges 99 cents", then forget it.
    Convenience is one thing, rip-offs are another.

    Anyway, I'm not worried -- even if they do charge through the wazoo for
    tethered Vision/Power Vision, someboy will undercut them. We may be
    stuck with ridiculousness (if we stick with Sprint) for a year or two,
    but there are just too many factors (WiFi hotspots, WiMax upcoming, and
    in general broadband ubiquity) that tell us to keep our powder dry.

    Yeah, Sprint mandated disabling #777 on the newer Sanyo phones. Yawn.
    They're shooting themselves in the foot.

    It's going to be an interesting ride the next three years. We'll see
    where it goes.


    --
    da
    ~~





  9. #9
    stevie
    Guest

    Re: Phone As A Modem - UPDATE

    ditto.

    I only use my phone when I'm at my fishing trailer (unfortunately not too
    often). I probably haven't used it over 1-2 hours over a year's time.

    I don't want to pay very much for this very casual use.
    "Donkey Agony" <[email protected][127.0.0.1]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    Joel Kolstad wrote:
    > Anyone know when Sprint will start charging for casual use? (I'm one
    > of those people who will, while traveling, tether my phone to check
    > e-mail or whatever, but will then go months at a time without
    > tethering at all.)


    I do *exactly* the same thing as you.

    > It seems as though they would have to send out
    > contract addendums or somesuch before they could start charging for
    > this.


    It would be nice if they could accomodate us reasonably with definite
    statements and plans wrt both plain-jane Vision and Power Vision. If
    it's reasonable, we take it. If not, we move elsewhere or make do
    without tethered Vision. These days, I mostly have access while
    traveling to WiFi or ethernet anyway. And I have a dial-up backup in
    case of emergency.

    I recently went to visit a friend. He doesn't currently have broadband
    access, but he offered me his phone lines. When I hooked up my Sanyo to
    my laptop and started emailing and web surfing, his draw dropped in
    stunned amazement.

    It's cool, but I could easily live without it. It *is* nice to have on
    those rare occasions I'm on the road.

    But if it's like their "we'll charge $2.50 a song, and our users will
    pay up even though iTunes charges 99 cents", then forget it.
    Convenience is one thing, rip-offs are another.

    Anyway, I'm not worried -- even if they do charge through the wazoo for
    tethered Vision/Power Vision, someboy will undercut them. We may be
    stuck with ridiculousness (if we stick with Sprint) for a year or two,
    but there are just too many factors (WiFi hotspots, WiMax upcoming, and
    in general broadband ubiquity) that tell us to keep our powder dry.

    Yeah, Sprint mandated disabling #777 on the newer Sanyo phones. Yawn.
    They're shooting themselves in the foot.

    It's going to be an interesting ride the next three years. We'll see
    where it goes.


    --
    da
    ~~






  10. #10
    Joseph Huber
    Guest

    Re: Phone As A Modem - UPDATE

    On Fri, 18 Nov 2005 00:46:48 -0500, "Donkey Agony" wrote:
    >It would be nice if they could accomodate us reasonably with definite
    >statements and plans wrt both plain-jane Vision and Power Vision. If
    >it's reasonable, we take it. If not, we move elsewhere or make do
    >without tethered Vision. These days, I mostly have access while
    >traveling to WiFi or ethernet anyway. And I have a dial-up backup in
    >case of emergency.


    I've been griping about this very thing here in the newsgroup for
    quite some time. At this point, it seems that none of the other
    wireless carriers are offering anything better. There apparently is
    no incentive to accomodate casual users, even thought there seem to be
    a number of us out there. I've been purposely looking for hotels with
    Internet access. These are very easy to find with reasonable rates.
    WiFi in the airports is still a little pricey.

    >But if it's like their "we'll charge $2.50 a song, and our users will
    >pay up even though iTunes charges 99 cents", then forget it.
    >Convenience is one thing, rip-offs are another.


    I find for the most part Sprint's entire line of ringers, games,
    tunes, etc. to be priced in the rip-off range. But apparently,
    people are buying at these prices. There must be lots of disposable
    income out there. On the data side, many companies pay for the data
    plans, but mine won't.

    >Anyway, I'm not worried -- even if they do charge through the wazoo for
    >tethered Vision/Power Vision, someboy will undercut them. We may be
    >stuck with ridiculousness (if we stick with Sprint) for a year or two,
    >but there are just too many factors (WiFi hotspots, WiMax upcoming, and
    >in general broadband ubiquity) that tell us to keep our powder dry.


    I've been thinking the same thing for about a year now, but we
    continue to be stuck with ridiculousness and schizophrenia on Sprint's
    part regarding laptop tethering. On one hand, Sprint offers data
    plans for laptop tethering, while on the other hand Sprint tells
    Sanyo to disable the modem function in Sanyo phones. The marketing
    side of Sprint just boggles the mind. It's a shame that Sprint's
    technology is being sabotaged by the marketing and CS sides of the
    business. I'm quite a bit more pessimistic than you. I don't see
    Sprint doing anything to help causual data users.

    Apparently Power Vision is now available in my area. I got an invite
    to visit the Sprint store which is about a mile away and buy Power
    Vision. The offer is for $20/month for the Power Vision Plus Pack and
    a $150 rebate on a Samsung A940 + 2 year agreement. Looks like this
    is only for new customers though...

    Joe Huber
    [email protected]



  11. #11
    Bob Smith
    Guest

    Re: Phone As A Modem - UPDATE


    "Joseph Huber" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > On Fri, 18 Nov 2005 00:46:48 -0500, "Donkey Agony" wrote:
    >>It would be nice if they could accomodate us reasonably with definite
    >>statements and plans wrt both plain-jane Vision and Power Vision. If
    >>it's reasonable, we take it. If not, we move elsewhere or make do
    >>without tethered Vision. These days, I mostly have access while
    >>traveling to WiFi or ethernet anyway. And I have a dial-up backup in
    >>case of emergency.

    >
    > I've been griping about this very thing here in the newsgroup for
    > quite some time.


    Righttttttttt.. Like complaining in a newsgroup is going to make a
    difference to a large corporation. Since SPCS first introduced Vision, they
    haven't officially supported teathered use. It's been said that they would
    recently here, in this newsgroup.

    > At this point, it seems that none of the other
    > wireless carriers are offering anything better. There apparently is
    > no incentive to accomodate casual users, even thought there seem to be
    > a number of us out there.


    Say what? Have you been hit with any additional $0.01/Kb changes on your
    bill on that casual use yet? It appears that they have accommodated quite a
    few of us casual users, who don't try to replace our regular ISP service
    with Vision and tethered phones.

    > I've been purposely looking for hotels with
    > Internet access. These are very easy to find with reasonable rates.
    > WiFi in the airports is still a little pricey.


    >>But if it's like their "we'll charge $2.50 a song, and our users will
    >>pay up even though iTunes charges 99 cents", then forget it.
    >>Convenience is one thing, rip-offs are another.

    >
    > I find for the most part Sprint's entire line of ringers, games,
    > tunes, etc. to be priced in the rip-off range. But apparently,
    > people are buying at these prices. There must be lots of disposable
    > income out there. On the data side, many companies pay for the data
    > plans, but mine won't.


    So ***** at your company ... As for the cost of ringers, songs and games,
    SPCS has made deals with those artists and do something that these fly by
    night websites don't have to do .... to pay royalties to the originating
    artist, program designer etc. No one is making you buy those products. Hell,
    I think the price on import sports cars are a rip off.. Quite a few folks
    out there don't think so, as they have spent the bucks to get them. It's all
    in the eye of the beholder and the fat wallets.

    >>Anyway, I'm not worried -- even if they do charge through the wazoo for
    >>tethered Vision/Power Vision, someboy will undercut them. We may be
    >>stuck with ridiculousness (if we stick with Sprint) for a year or two,
    >>but there are just too many factors (WiFi hotspots, WiMax upcoming, and
    >>in general broadband ubiquity) that tell us to keep our powder dry.


    Keep your powder dry? What's that suppose to mean? That you will not
    subscribe and pay for tethered use in the future? As for other wireless
    products currently available out there, they are not even accessable through
    tethered USB cable use. It is available through a pcmcia card.

    > I've been thinking the same thing for about a year now, but we
    > continue to be stuck with ridiculousness and schizophrenia on Sprint's
    > part regarding laptop tethering.


    Joe, you are starting to sound schizoprentic right now with your rants. As
    mentioned above, SPCS has never officially supported tethered use in the
    past and supposedly will in the upcoming months. In the time inbetween,
    again ... I ask, have you been charged additional fees for your casual
    usage?

    > On one hand, Sprint offers data
    > plans for laptop tethering, while on the other hand Sprint tells
    > Sanyo to disable the modem function in Sanyo phones. The marketing
    > side of Sprint just boggles the mind. It's a shame that Sprint's
    > technology is being sabotaged by the marketing and CS sides of the
    > business. I'm quite a bit more pessimistic than you. I don't see
    > Sprint doing anything to help causual data users.


    So, you want it free (included in the $20 Vision option monthly fee), once
    SPCS refines their billing process to start charging for casual tethered
    usage? Is that what you are saying?

    > Apparently Power Vision is now available in my area. I got an invite
    > to visit the Sprint store which is about a mile away and buy Power
    > Vision. The offer is for $20/month for the Power Vision Plus Pack and
    > a $150 rebate on a Samsung A940 + 2 year agreement. Looks like this
    > is only for new customers though...


    That option isn't available going through their rebate program?

    Bob





  12. #12
    Joseph Huber
    Guest

    Re: Phone As A Modem - UPDATE

    On Sat, 19 Nov 2005 13:36:59 GMT, "Bob Smith" wrote:
    >Righttttttttt.. Like complaining in a newsgroup is going to make a
    >difference to a large corporation.


    If it makes you feel any better, I've complained in a polite manner
    directly to Sprint as well.

    >Since SPCS first introduced Vision, they haven't officially supported teathered use.


    I believe that you are wrong on this point. When Vision first came
    out, wasn't tethering allowed by the early versions of the Vision
    terms and conditions? In any case, Sprint actively sold laptop
    connection kits for some Vision phones for a time.

    >Say what? Have you been hit with any additional $0.01/Kb changes on your
    >bill on that casual use yet? It appears that they have accommodated quite a
    >few of us casual users.


    Not so far. However, I would like to be accomodated, for a reasonable
    price, in a way that does not potentially put me in the position of
    having my account terminated at the whim of Sprint.

    >So ***** at your company.


    Although it is tempting to do so, discretion is the better part of
    valor when it comes to one's primary source of income. I have asked
    politely though...

    > As for the cost of ringers, songs and games,
    >SPCS has made deals with those artists and do something that these fly by
    >night websites don't have to do .... to pay royalties to the originating
    >artist, program designer etc. No one is making you buy those products.


    I don't buy them. If they were priced more reasonably, I would.

    >So, you want it free (included in the $20 Vision option monthly fee), once
    >SPCS refines their billing process to start charging for casual tethered
    >usage? Is that what you are saying?


    I think *casual* tethering (i.e. web browsing, checking email, VPN)
    should be included with any Vision/Power Vision plan that costs
    $15/month or higher. Data is data. Why should it matter whether it
    is being consumed/generated by the phone or by my computer?

    The little Power Vision flyer I received is touting live full motion
    TV with high quality sound, tunes, using the phone's camera to shoot
    video with sound and sharing it via Power Vision, web surfing, email,
    and instant messaging. Casual tethering isn't going to hog the kind
    of bandwidth that the above things will, so why should we have to pay
    extra for casual tethering?

    >> Apparently Power Vision is now available in my area. I got an invite
    >> to visit the Sprint store which is about a mile away and buy Power
    >> Vision. The offer is for $20/month for the Power Vision Plus Pack and
    >> a $150 rebate on a Samsung A940 + 2 year agreement. Looks like this
    >> is only for new customers though...


    >That option isn't available going through their rebate program?


    I don't know. The little flyer says that new line activation is
    required. I haven't really looked into PowerVision, since none of the
    present EVDO phones support analog. Since I need analog when I travel
    to the boonies, and Sprint/CDMA has no provision for conveniently
    switching phones, I really can't switch to EVDO at the moment.

    I forgot to mention that the $20/month EVDO plan includes unlimited
    web access, unlimited picture and video mail, Sprint TV Basic, and
    Sirius Hits. Remove the TV, or Sirius (or both for that matter) and
    add unlimited casual tethering, and that would be a nice plan.

    Joe Huber
    [email protected]



  13. #13
    Tinman
    Guest

    Re: Phone As A Modem - UPDATE

    Bob Smith wrote:
    > "Joseph Huber" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >> I've been griping about this very thing here in the newsgroup for
    >> quite some time.

    >
    > Righttttttttt.. Like complaining in a newsgroup is going to make a
    > difference to a large corporation.


    So what? If there's a backlash due to cracking down on extremely casual
    tethered usage, and enough people migrate to another carrier, Sprint
    will know (they certainly ask why you are canceling). I don't see a
    crackdown coming however (see below), or at least I hope not.


    > Since SPCS first introduced
    > Vision, they haven't officially supported teathered use.


    Wrooooooong. I bought an official brandy-new connection kit for my Sanyo
    4900 when Vision was launched. Not only was it supported, I was told to
    go ahead and use it as much as possible, as there would be no metering
    for the first month or two (the original Vision plan gave something like
    2 MB per month).

    It wasn't till several months later, perhaps when/if SPCS realized that
    they couldn't properly meter Vision usage or tell the difference between
    handset data and tethered data (or both) that they changed their tune
    and recalled all of the connection kits.


    > It's been
    > said that they would recently here, in this newsgroup.
    >


    Bob, that would be the topic of this updated thread.


    >> At this point, it seems that none of the other
    >> wireless carriers are offering anything better. There apparently is
    >> no incentive to accomodate casual users, even thought there seem to
    >> be a number of us out there.

    >
    > Say what? Have you been hit with any additional $0.01/Kb changes on
    > your bill on that casual use yet? It appears that they have
    > accommodated quite a few of us casual users, who don't try to replace
    > our regular ISP service with Vision and tethered phones.
    >


    The discussion is about what might come in the future, not what has
    happened in the past; nor what is currently happening now.

    It's possible SPCS will indeed crack down on tethered usage once the new
    plans are in full swing. The issue is, is the additional per-month
    charge for a tethered option going to be worth it, if you only use it
    every few months or so?

    There might also be a concern about what will happen if and when you do
    tether, and you don't have the tethered option. Right now it seems you
    will be charged $0.01 per kB (at least that's what one part of the
    Website states now). One must compare this potential charge--assuming
    you are allowed to do this and are not forced onto a tethered plan--to
    the additional monthly cost of the tethered option.

    I'm also not sure Notan's brochure is correct, or at least is consistent
    with the Website. Sprint's Website has been updated to include the Phone
    as Modem plan. But it seems to indicate that once you go with that
    plan--indeed it literally states you must have that plan if you have a
    connection kit or "device" capable of being used as a modem--that you no
    longer have unlimited Vision. One might take that to mean on the handset
    too:
    http://www.sprintpcs.com/common/popu...etAsModem.html

    Also, Notan quoted the brochure as stating the Phone as Modem Pack
    includes the Vision Ultimate Pack. But the Vision Ultimate Pack and
    Phone as Modem Pack are both priced at $25. I'm guessing there's a
    difference. To me, and I might be wrong, this means that you can utilize
    Vision Ultimate Pack features with a Phone as Modem Pack. But your
    data--tethered or not--is capped at 40 MB (above that is by the KB).

    So my take is that Sprint are *not* really updating their system to
    track tethered Vs. phone data. Instead they are just treating data as
    data, as they always have (and they have been able to meter it for some
    time now). But now they (might? will?) insist on a Phone as Modem Pack
    if your phone is modem capable (either by buying a connection kit, or
    the phone has built-in Bluetooth). For all I know the new connection
    kits may be the only way to tether, say, with the newer Sanyo phones
    (assuming that is even possible).

    Will they force people who already have Bluetooth phones onto the Phone
    as Modem Pack plan? Will they kill-off the grandfathered Vision plans
    that some of us have if we happen to own a Bluetooth phone? Time will
    tell.

    But these are valid concerns, and worthy of discussion. It would appear
    that times are indeed a-changin'.


    >>
    >> I find for the most part Sprint's entire line of ringers, games,
    >> tunes, etc. to be priced in the rip-off range. But apparently,
    >> people are buying at these prices. There must be lots of disposable
    >> income out there. On the data side, many companies pay for the data
    >> plans, but mine won't.

    >
    > So ***** at your company ... As for the cost of ringers, songs and
    > games, SPCS has made deals with those artists and do something that
    > these fly by night websites don't have to do .... to pay royalties to
    > the originating artist, program designer etc.


    It's well known that ringers are a high-profit item. Just how much in
    royalties do you think the copyright owner (who may or may not be the
    "artist") gets for a 15-second midi rendition that sells for $2.50?
    (Meanwhile entire songs are sold online for a buck each.)


    > No one is making you
    > buy those products.


    Of course not. But IMO ringer downloads et al are still in the honeymoon
    period. We won't know till the dust settles, and people actually stop
    and think about what they are "buying" that we can get a good handle on
    the market. Further, with family plans practically the norm, and with
    many kids having the ability to download content using their parents'
    accounts, we don't know if there will be a crackdown in that area. This
    just happened to my BIL: he hadn't been paying attention to the $5-$8
    fluctuation on his monthly bills. When he realized it was for ringers
    his kids had been downloading, it was game-over for ringer purchases in
    that family.


    >
    >>> Anyway, I'm not worried -- even if they do charge through the wazoo
    >>> for tethered Vision/Power Vision, someboy will undercut them. We
    >>> may be stuck with ridiculousness (if we stick with Sprint) for a
    >>> year or
    >>> two, but there are just too many factors (WiFi hotspots, WiMax
    >>> upcoming,
    >>> and in general broadband ubiquity) that tell us to keep our powder
    >>> dry.

    >
    > Keep your powder dry? What's that suppose to mean? That you will not
    > subscribe and pay for tethered use in the future?


    Jeez, it's just a common expression that used to be used by soldiers and
    hunters--mainly applying to black powder. Today it just means to be
    prepared for anything that might happen. Considering we don't know what
    Sprint will actually do, the statement was appropriate.


    >
    >> I've been thinking the same thing for about a year now, but we
    >> continue to be stuck with ridiculousness and schizophrenia on
    >> Sprint's part regarding laptop tethering.

    >
    > Joe, you are starting to sound schizoprentic right now with your
    > rants. As mentioned above, SPCS has never officially supported
    > tethered use in the past


    And you are wrong about that.


    > and supposedly will in the upcoming months.


    Hence this thread.


    > In the time inbetween, again ... I ask, have you been charged
    > additional fees for your casual usage?
    >


    Why aren't you comprehending that the discussion is about the future and
    not the past?


    >> On one hand, Sprint offers data
    >> plans for laptop tethering, while on the other hand Sprint tells
    >> Sanyo to disable the modem function in Sanyo phones. The marketing
    >> side of Sprint just boggles the mind. It's a shame that Sprint's
    >> technology is being sabotaged by the marketing and CS sides of the
    >> business. I'm quite a bit more pessimistic than you. I don't see
    >> Sprint doing anything to help causual data users.

    >
    > So, you want it free (included in the $20 Vision option monthly fee),
    > once SPCS refines their billing process to start charging for casual
    > tethered usage? Is that what you are saying?
    >


    That's nothing like what I read into what he was saying. How is the
    casual tethered user even going to use it with recent Sanyo phones, if
    tethering ability doesn't even exist in the phone? You don't find it odd
    that Sprint has demanded Sanyo disable tethering ability, while at the
    same time formulating plans to do just that?

    While there has been no indication that the crippling can be "undone," I
    suppose those new connection kits might be designed for that (for some
    reason, I can't imagine Sprint thinking that logically).

    In addition, if Sprint is not going to overlay Power Vision (EV-DO)
    *everywhere* Vision exists--as has been reported here--I believe it will
    come back and bite them. Indeed if I find out, once the roll-out is
    complete, that there are gaping holes in EV-DO coverage Vs. 1xRTT I
    myself might be look for a carrier that offers (true) high-speed data in
    more locations than Sprint.

    As usual, YMMV.


    --
    Mike





  14. #14
    Bob Smith
    Guest

    Re: Phone As A Modem - UPDATE


    "Joseph Huber" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > On Sat, 19 Nov 2005 13:36:59 GMT, "Bob Smith" wrote:
    >>Righttttttttt.. Like complaining in a newsgroup is going to make a
    >>difference to a large corporation.

    >
    > If it makes you feel any better, I've complained in a polite manner
    > directly to Sprint as well.
    >
    >>Since SPCS first introduced Vision, they haven't officially supported
    >>teathered use.

    >
    > I believe that you are wrong on this point. When Vision first came
    > out, wasn't tethering allowed by the early versions of the Vision
    > terms and conditions? In any case, Sprint actively sold laptop
    > connection kits for some Vision phones for a time.


    They did sell USB cables for awhile (maybe a couple of months), until they
    realized they had opened a pandora's box, to where users might cancel their
    regular ISP service, and use Vision as their full time provider and taking a
    lot of bandwidth away from the voice side of the business. They then came in
    with the new legalese, to where they said they would not support teathered
    usage, and change $0.01 /kb incoming and outgoing on data. So far (knocking
    on wood here), I haven't been hit for any of those additional charges, but
    then ... I don't access the web via teathered use much any more, and when I
    did, it was for a period of 15 to 20 minutes at a time max.

    >
    >>Say what? Have you been hit with any additional $0.01/Kb changes on your
    >>bill on that casual use yet? It appears that they have accommodated quite
    >>a
    >>few of us casual users.

    >
    > Not so far. However, I would like to be accomodated, for a reasonable
    > price, in a way that does not potentially put me in the position of
    > having my account terminated at the whim of Sprint.
    >

    So what do you determine is a reasonable prise for casual usage? Amount of
    data up and downloaded ... time on line on a daily basis?

    >>So ***** at your company.

    >
    > Although it is tempting to do so, discretion is the better part of
    > valor when it comes to one's primary source of income. I have asked
    > politely though...


    Ask again, if you feel the need is there, outside of those other sources
    you've mentioned at the airports & hotels, for doing business on the road.
    On a business plan, it's only $60/mo. now, and SPCS's site is showing a free
    PCMCIA card as well. Details are @ http://tinyurl.com/7btmw

    >
    >> As for the cost of ringers, songs and games,
    >>SPCS has made deals with those artists and do something that these fly by
    >>night websites don't have to do .... to pay royalties to the originating
    >>artist, program designer etc. No one is making you buy those products.

    >
    > I don't buy them. If they were priced more reasonably, I would.
    >
    >>So, you want it free (included in the $20 Vision option monthly fee), once
    >>SPCS refines their billing process to start charging for casual tethered
    >>usage? Is that what you are saying?

    >
    > I think *casual* tethering (i.e. web browsing, checking email, VPN)
    > should be included with any Vision/Power Vision plan that costs
    > $15/month or higher. Data is data. Why should it matter whether it
    > is being consumed/generated by the phone or by my computer?
    >
    > The little Power Vision flyer I received is touting live full motion
    > TV with high quality sound, tunes, using the phone's camera to shoot
    > video with sound and sharing it via Power Vision, web surfing, email,
    > and instant messaging. Casual tethering isn't going to hog the kind
    > of bandwidth that the above things will, so why should we have to pay
    > extra for casual tethering?


    I received that same flyer with my most recent bill. The services offered in
    that brochure are for phone usage. I did not see word one for tethered
    usage. Again, how do you define casual usage, before additional data charges
    are applied? A certain amount of minutes on line during the data, a certain
    amount of data up and downloaded?

    >
    >>> Apparently Power Vision is now available in my area. I got an invite
    >>> to visit the Sprint store which is about a mile away and buy Power
    >>> Vision. The offer is for $20/month for the Power Vision Plus Pack and
    >>> a $150 rebate on a Samsung A940 + 2 year agreement. Looks like this
    >>> is only for new customers though...

    >
    >>That option isn't available going through their rebate program?

    >
    > I don't know. The little flyer says that new line activation is
    > required. I haven't really looked into PowerVision, since none of the
    > present EVDO phones support analog. Since I need analog when I travel
    > to the boonies, and Sprint/CDMA has no provision for conveniently
    > switching phones, I really can't switch to EVDO at the moment.
    >
    > I forgot to mention that the $20/month EVDO plan includes unlimited
    > web access, unlimited picture and video mail, Sprint TV Basic, and
    > Sirius Hits. Remove the TV, or Sirius (or both for that matter) and
    > add unlimited casual tethering, and that would be a nice plan.
    >
    > Joe Huber
    > [email protected]


    Joe, you and I know that the those users who tether up now, will not only
    use the services quoted in your above paragraph, but will tether up as well
    with the new service.

    Bob





  15. #15
    Bob Smith
    Guest

    Re: Phone As A Modem - UPDATE


    "Tinman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > Bob Smith wrote:
    >> "Joseph Huber" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >>> I've been griping about this very thing here in the newsgroup for
    >>> quite some time.

    >>
    >> Righttttttttt.. Like complaining in a newsgroup is going to make a
    >> difference to a large corporation.

    >
    > So what? If there's a backlash due to cracking down on extremely casual
    > tethered usage, and enough people migrate to another carrier, Sprint will
    > know (they certainly ask why you are canceling). I don't see a crackdown
    > coming however (see below), or at least I hope not.


    There hasn't been a big backlash by SPCS for casual usage, as we and others
    haven't been hit for any additional fees, as of yet (again ... knocking on
    wood here). .

    >
    >> Since SPCS first introduced
    >> Vision, they haven't officially supported teathered use.

    >
    > Wrooooooong. I bought an official brandy-new connection kit for my Sanyo
    > 4900 when Vision was launched. Not only was it supported, I was told to go
    > ahead and use it as much as possible, as there would be no metering for
    > the first month or two (the original Vision plan gave something like 2 MB
    > per month).


    I stand corrected, that they did, when they introduced the 4900, as that was
    the very first phone released that was Vision capable. The prior phones
    issued were only WW capable, and SPCS did support WW, as time on line was
    charged off of the user's anytime minutes.

    The Sanyo 5300 came out 2 or 3 months after the 4900, and I bought it a week
    or two after it was available and at that time, no cables were available and
    SPCS store staff said that tethered use was doable, but that SPCS would not
    support it, and CS would not provide any advice on that usage.

    > It wasn't till several months later, perhaps when/if SPCS realized that
    > they couldn't properly meter Vision usage or tell the difference between
    > handset data and tethered data (or both) that they changed their tune and
    > recalled all of the connection kits.


    My point exactly. They stopped supporting tethered Vision usage, and added
    the new legalese to the TOS.
    >
    >
    >> It's been
    >> said that they would recently here, in this newsgroup.
    >>

    >
    > Bob, that would be the topic of this updated thread.
    >
    >
    >>> At this point, it seems that none of the other
    >>> wireless carriers are offering anything better. There apparently is
    >>> no incentive to accomodate casual users, even thought there seem to
    >>> be a number of us out there.

    >>
    >> Say what? Have you been hit with any additional $0.01/Kb changes on
    >> your bill on that casual use yet? It appears that they have
    >> accommodated quite a few of us casual users, who don't try to replace
    >> our regular ISP service with Vision and tethered phones.
    >>

    >
    > The discussion is about what might come in the future, not what has
    > happened in the past; nor what is currently happening now.


    Actually, it's both. Do you see Power Vision listed in the subject line? I
    don't ... Joe brought up his prior experiences of regular tethered Vision
    casual usage.

    >
    > It's possible SPCS will indeed crack down on tethered usage once the new
    > plans are in full swing. The issue is, is the additional per-month charge
    > for a tethered option going to be worth it, if you only use it every few
    > months or so?
    >
    > There might also be a concern about what will happen if and when you do
    > tether, and you don't have the tethered option. Right now it seems you
    > will be charged $0.01 per kB (at least that's what one part of the Website
    > states now). One must compare this potential charge--assuming you are
    > allowed to do this and are not forced onto a tethered plan--to the
    > additional monthly cost of the tethered option.
    >
    > I'm also not sure Notan's brochure is correct, or at least is consistent
    > with the Website. Sprint's Website has been updated to include the Phone
    > as Modem plan. But it seems to indicate that once you go with that
    > plan--indeed it literally states you must have that plan if you have a
    > connection kit or "device" capable of being used as a modem--that you no
    > longer have unlimited Vision. One might take that to mean on the handset
    > too:
    > http://www.sprintpcs.com/common/popu...etAsModem.html


    I hadn't seen that web page previously. It's a bit confusing, per the text
    listed below.

    (1) "Sprint Power VisionSM is available only while on the Nationwide Sprint
    PCS Network."

    (2) Sprint PCS Vision Packs and Sprint Power VisionSM Packs are not
    available with Sprint PCS Connection CardsT, Sprint PCS Connection KitsT or
    other devices that can be used as a modem"

    (3) Customers with a Sprint PCS VisionSM phone or a Sprint Power VisionSM
    phone will be charged $0.01 per kilobyte for Sprint PCS VisionSM or Sprint
    Power VisionSM usage unless a Sprint PCS VisionSM Pack or Sprint Power
    VisionSM Pack is selected."

    The second paragraph makes no sense as Vision packs are not available when
    using a connection card or connection kits (i.e.: USB cables) to be used as
    a modem.

    The third paragraph then says that users with capable phones will be charged
    $0.01/kb, unless they do have a Vision pack on their account. As it sounds
    now with the bottom paragraph, it sounds like casual usage is authorized.

    >
    > Also, Notan quoted the brochure as stating the Phone as Modem Pack
    > includes the Vision Ultimate Pack. But the Vision Ultimate Pack and Phone
    > as Modem Pack are both priced at $25. I'm guessing there's a difference.
    > To me, and I might be wrong, this means that you can utilize Vision
    > Ultimate Pack features with a Phone as Modem Pack. But your data--tethered
    > or not--is capped at 40 MB (above that is by the KB).
    >
    > So my take is that Sprint are *not* really updating their system to track
    > tethered Vs. phone data. Instead they are just treating data as data, as
    > they always have (and they have been able to meter it for some time now).
    > But now they (might? will?) insist on a Phone as Modem Pack if your phone
    > is modem capable (either by buying a connection kit, or the phone has
    > built-in Bluetooth). For all I know the new connection kits may be the
    > only way to tether, say, with the newer Sanyo phones (assuming that is
    > even possible).
    >
    > Will they force people who already have Bluetooth phones onto the Phone as
    > Modem Pack plan? Will they kill-off the grandfathered Vision plans that
    > some of us have if we happen to own a Bluetooth phone? Time will tell.


    Well, there is only one or two "bluetooth" phones that can be configured to
    be used to connect to the laptop to get on line. The rest of the "bluetooth"
    phones are only capable of using a handsfree wireless headset.
    >
    > But these are valid concerns, and worthy of discussion. It would appear
    > that times are indeed a-changin'.
    >
    >
    >>>
    >>> I find for the most part Sprint's entire line of ringers, games,
    >>> tunes, etc. to be priced in the rip-off range. But apparently,
    >>> people are buying at these prices. There must be lots of disposable
    >>> income out there. On the data side, many companies pay for the data
    >>> plans, but mine won't.

    >>
    >> So ***** at your company ... As for the cost of ringers, songs and
    >> games, SPCS has made deals with those artists and do something that
    >> these fly by night websites don't have to do .... to pay royalties to
    >> the originating artist, program designer etc.

    >
    > It's well known that ringers are a high-profit item. Just how much in
    > royalties do you think the copyright owner (who may or may not be the
    > "artist") gets for a 15-second midi rendition that sells for $2.50?
    > (Meanwhile entire songs are sold online for a buck each.)


    I have no clue, as I'm not involved in those negotiations ... .
    >
    >> No one is making you
    >> buy those products.

    >
    > Of course not. But IMO ringer downloads et al are still in the honeymoon
    > period. We won't know till the dust settles, and people actually stop and
    > think about what they are "buying" that we can get a good handle on the
    > market. Further, with family plans practically the norm, and with many
    > kids having the ability to download content using their parents' accounts,
    > we don't know if there will be a crackdown in that area. This just
    > happened to my BIL: he hadn't been paying attention to the $5-$8
    > fluctuation on his monthly bills. When he realized it was for ringers his
    > kids had been downloading, it was game-over for ringer purchases in that
    > family.
    >

    I have, what with my 20 yr. old daugher and when I get my monthly bill ...
    As we have the full Vision ($15/mo on primary & $5 for other phones on the
    account), we get the $5 monthly credit. She still exceeds that monthly
    credit every other month or so on apps and rings.

    >
    >>
    >>>> Anyway, I'm not worried -- even if they do charge through the wazoo
    >>>> for tethered Vision/Power Vision, someboy will undercut them. We
    >>>> may be stuck with ridiculousness (if we stick with Sprint) for a year
    >>>> or
    >>>> two, but there are just too many factors (WiFi hotspots, WiMax
    >>>> upcoming,
    >>>> and in general broadband ubiquity) that tell us to keep our powder dry.

    >>
    >> Keep your powder dry? What's that suppose to mean? That you will not
    >> subscribe and pay for tethered use in the future?

    >
    > Jeez, it's just a common expression that used to be used by soldiers and
    > hunters--mainly applying to black powder. Today it just means to be
    > prepared for anything that might happen. Considering we don't know what
    > Sprint will actually do, the statement was appropriate.



    Hey, I watch the History Channel too, and I'm the "so-called expert" on
    history questions that come up on the NTN system at my local watering hole
    .... lol. I know what it meant ... I just didn't think that particular phrase
    was all that applicable to what he was trying to say. "Wait & See", "Sitting
    on the sidelines" might have been more appropriate ...
    >
    >>
    >>> I've been thinking the same thing for about a year now, but we
    >>> continue to be stuck with ridiculousness and schizophrenia on
    >>> Sprint's part regarding laptop tethering.

    >>
    >> Joe, you are starting to sound schizoprentic right now with your
    >> rants. As mentioned above, SPCS has never officially supported
    >> tethered use in the past

    >
    > And you are wrong about that.
    >
    >
    >> and supposedly will in the upcoming months.

    >
    > Hence this thread.
    >
    >
    >> In the time inbetween, again ... I ask, have you been charged
    >> additional fees for your casual usage?
    >>

    >
    > Why aren't you comprehending that the discussion is about the future and
    > not the past?


    Again, I point out to you that Joe was talking about the past in this
    thread.

    >
    >
    >>> On one hand, Sprint offers data
    >>> plans for laptop tethering, while on the other hand Sprint tells
    >>> Sanyo to disable the modem function in Sanyo phones. The marketing
    >>> side of Sprint just boggles the mind. It's a shame that Sprint's
    >>> technology is being sabotaged by the marketing and CS sides of the
    >>> business. I'm quite a bit more pessimistic than you. I don't see
    >>> Sprint doing anything to help causual data users.

    >>
    >> So, you want it free (included in the $20 Vision option monthly fee),
    >> once SPCS refines their billing process to start charging for casual
    >> tethered usage? Is that what you are saying?
    >>

    >
    > That's nothing like what I read into what he was saying. How is the casual
    > tethered user even going to use it with recent Sanyo phones, if tethering
    > ability doesn't even exist in the phone? You don't find it odd that Sprint
    > has demanded Sanyo disable tethering ability, while at the same time
    > formulating plans to do just that?
    >
    > While there has been no indication that the crippling can be "undone," I
    > suppose those new connection kits might be designed for that (for some
    > reason, I can't imagine Sprint thinking that logically).
    >
    > In addition, if Sprint is not going to overlay Power Vision (EV-DO)
    > *everywhere* Vision exists--as has been reported here--I believe it will
    > come back and bite them. Indeed if I find out, once the roll-out is
    > complete, that there are gaping holes in EV-DO coverage Vs. 1xRTT I myself
    > might be look for a carrier that offers (true) high-speed data in more
    > locations than Sprint.
    >
    > As usual, YMMV.


    Oh, you can expect holes in coverage, as there are now with voice and vision
    usage in certain areas within current coverage areas. Deep inside bldgs,
    high in tall skyscrapers, and in fringe coverage areas. Mind you though,
    those instances don't seem to showing up as much, as we've had far less of
    those complaints in this newsgroup from prior years at least for voice
    calls. I don't believe I've seen too many complaints on data connections,
    but then again, how many users here have data connection options (i.e.:
    connection cards) on their plans.

    Bob





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