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  1. #1
    Nomen Nescio
    Guest
    I've seen reports here from Rob and others that claim that Sprint is "watching" data usage and is
    sending letters out to people whom them deem must be using a laptop because of the volume of data
    ... defined loosly as over 10Mb/week.

    My question is: What does Sprint do when that usage is conducted purely on the handset? As many
    of you probably know, the PDA phones can do 20Mb+/week legitimately right on the phone. I use way
    more than 10Mb per week on my Smart Phone, and never connect it to a comoputer via a cable. Since
    Vision is unlimited, and I am using a Sprint-branded Phone/PDA, this is purely 100% legit usage of
    the service.

    When Sprint sends out these letters, do they screen out the people using the Handheld Computer
    phones, or do they just go after everyone over a certain MB threshold? If you claim to them that
    you never connect to a laptop or other computer, are they going to believe you, or cut you off?
    Can they even tell the difference? Do you have to defend yourself and prove yourself innocent when
    you have done nothing but use your handset and the associated service?

    What is the protocol for this "data watchdog-ing" that is going on, and can Sprint tell the
    difference between laptop and handset use?

    How does this whole thing work? 10Mb/week is quite low, and is very easily accomplished via one of
    the high-end Smartphones, without the need for any kind of data cable.




    See More: Rob - Heavy Vision Usage Question




  2. #2
    Thomas T. Veldhouse
    Guest

    Re: Rob - Heavy Vision Usage Question


    "Nomen Nescio" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > I've seen reports here from Rob and others that claim that Sprint is

    "watching" data usage and is
    > sending letters out to people whom them deem must be using a laptop

    because of the volume of data
    > .. defined loosly as over 10Mb/week.
    >
    > My question is: What does Sprint do when that usage is conducted purely

    on the handset? As many
    > of you probably know, the PDA phones can do 20Mb+/week legitimately right

    on the phone. I use way
    > more than 10Mb per week on my Smart Phone, and never connect it to a

    comoputer via a cable. Since
    > Vision is unlimited, and I am using a Sprint-branded Phone/PDA, this is

    purely 100% legit usage of
    > the service.
    >
    > When Sprint sends out these letters, do they screen out the people using

    the Handheld Computer
    > phones, or do they just go after everyone over a certain MB threshold? If

    you claim to them that
    > you never connect to a laptop or other computer, are they going to believe

    you, or cut you off?
    > Can they even tell the difference? Do you have to defend yourself and

    prove yourself innocent when
    > you have done nothing but use your handset and the associated service?
    >
    > What is the protocol for this "data watchdog-ing" that is going on, and

    can Sprint tell the
    > difference between laptop and handset use?
    >
    > How does this whole thing work? 10Mb/week is quite low, and is very

    easily accomplished via one of
    > the high-end Smartphones, without the need for any kind of data cable.
    >


    It is probably very easy to do with a camera phone as well (outgoing data).

    Tom Veldhouse





  3. #3
    Richard Zellmer
    Guest

    Re: Rob - Heavy Vision Usage Question

    I heard that people that got these letters used 1gig or so a month not 10
    megs per week. If you sent 20 pictures to yourself you would probable go
    through a few megs.




    "Thomas T. Veldhouse" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    >
    > "Nomen Nescio" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]
    > > I've seen reports here from Rob and others that claim that Sprint is

    > "watching" data usage and is
    > > sending letters out to people whom them deem must be using a laptop

    > because of the volume of data
    > > .. defined loosly as over 10Mb/week.
    > >
    > > My question is: What does Sprint do when that usage is conducted purely

    > on the handset? As many
    > > of you probably know, the PDA phones can do 20Mb+/week legitimately

    right
    > on the phone. I use way
    > > more than 10Mb per week on my Smart Phone, and never connect it to a

    > comoputer via a cable. Since
    > > Vision is unlimited, and I am using a Sprint-branded Phone/PDA, this is

    > purely 100% legit usage of
    > > the service.
    > >
    > > When Sprint sends out these letters, do they screen out the people using

    > the Handheld Computer
    > > phones, or do they just go after everyone over a certain MB threshold?

    If
    > you claim to them that
    > > you never connect to a laptop or other computer, are they going to

    believe
    > you, or cut you off?
    > > Can they even tell the difference? Do you have to defend yourself and

    > prove yourself innocent when
    > > you have done nothing but use your handset and the associated service?
    > >
    > > What is the protocol for this "data watchdog-ing" that is going on, and

    > can Sprint tell the
    > > difference between laptop and handset use?
    > >
    > > How does this whole thing work? 10Mb/week is quite low, and is very

    > easily accomplished via one of
    > > the high-end Smartphones, without the need for any kind of data cable.
    > >

    >
    > It is probably very easy to do with a camera phone as well (outgoing

    data).
    >
    > Tom Veldhouse
    >
    >






  4. #4
    letsgoflyers81
    Guest

    Re: Rob - Heavy Vision Usage Question


    Unlimited Vision on the handset itself is just that, unlimited. You
    can't go over a limit. However if you go through a lot of data when
    using the phone with a computer, then you can get nailed.

    --
    Posted at SprintUsers.com - Your place for everything Sprint PCS
    Free wireless access @ www.SprintUsers.com/wap




  5. #5
    RexyBlue
    Guest

    Re: Rob - Heavy Vision Usage Question

    Nailed how? What will they do to you?

    On Tue, 16 Sep 2003 19:16:04 -0400, letsgoflyers81
    <[email protected]> wrote:
    >Unlimited Vision on the handset itself is just that, unlimited. You
    >can't go over a limit. However if you go through a lot of data when
    >using the phone with a computer, then you can get nailed.





    ----------------------------
    To email me, remove the zz.



  6. #6
    O/Siris .
    Guest

    Re: Rob - Heavy Vision Usage Question

    Nomen Nescio <[email protected]> wrote in article
    <[email protected]>:
    > I've seen reports here from Rob and others that claim that Sprint is "watching" data usage and is
    > sending letters out to people whom them deem must be using a laptop because of the volume of data
    > ... defined loosly as over 10Mb/week.
    >
    > My question is: What does Sprint do when that usage is conducted purely on the handset? As many
    > of you probably know, the PDA phones can do 20Mb+/week legitimately right on the phone. I use way
    > more than 10Mb per week on my Smart Phone, and never connect it to a comoputer via a cable. Since
    > Vision is unlimited, and I am using a Sprint-branded Phone/PDA, this is purely 100% legit usage of
    > the service.
    >
    > When Sprint sends out these letters, do they screen out the people using the Handheld Computer
    > phones, or do they just go after everyone over a certain MB threshold? If you claim to them that
    > you never connect to a laptop or other computer, are they going to believe you, or cut you off?
    > Can they even tell the difference? Do you have to defend yourself and prove yourself innocent when
    > you have done nothing but use your handset and the associated service?
    >
    > What is the protocol for this "data watchdog-ing" that is going on, and can Sprint tell the
    > difference between laptop and handset use?
    >
    > How does this whole thing work? 10Mb/week is quite low, and is very easily accomplished via one of
    > the high-end Smartphones, without the need for any kind of data cable.
    >


    I haven't seen any "borderline" cases, Nomen. Frankly, and this is just
    speculation, they aren't after every single violator. They are after
    the "let's run Kazaa 24/7", multi-gigabyte obvious users. Every example
    I've seen (only been three of them I've come across) have been over 4
    gigabytes of data in the month, and that was *not* unusual for them.

    So far as I've seen up to now, Nomen, it's not strictly based on
    *amount* of usage. Except in the radically obvious cases.

    --
    -+-
    R
    O/Siris
    I work for Sprint PCS
    I *don't* speak for them

    [posted via phonescoop.com]



  7. #7
    O/Siris .
    Guest

    Re: Rob - Heavy Vision Usage Question

    RexyBlue <[email protected]> wrote in article
    <[email protected]>:
    > Nailed how? What will they do to you?


    Not much. Just cancel your vision package, and start charging you
    1/KB. And you can't ever get the package back.

    That's equivalent to $10/MB. And you're used to multi-hundreds of MB a
    month... well... you can do the math.

    --
    -+-
    R
    O/Siris
    I work for Sprint PCS
    I *don't* speak for them


    [posted via phonescoop.com]



  8. #8
    Kash76
    Guest

    Re: Rob - Heavy Vision Usage Question

    I've got a CF2031 that I use with my iPAQ. This month is heavy for me but I
    am up to 30MB this month. I have the $10 add a phone and $7.50 vision added
    on. They let me do it so I will use it!! I won't abuse it though.


    "Nomen Nescio" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > I've seen reports here from Rob and others that claim that Sprint is

    "watching" data usage and is
    > sending letters out to people whom them deem must be using a laptop

    because of the volume of data
    > .. defined loosly as over 10Mb/week.
    >
    > My question is: What does Sprint do when that usage is conducted purely

    on the handset? As many
    > of you probably know, the PDA phones can do 20Mb+/week legitimately right

    on the phone. I use way
    > more than 10Mb per week on my Smart Phone, and never connect it to a

    comoputer via a cable. Since
    > Vision is unlimited, and I am using a Sprint-branded Phone/PDA, this is

    purely 100% legit usage of
    > the service.
    >
    > When Sprint sends out these letters, do they screen out the people using

    the Handheld Computer
    > phones, or do they just go after everyone over a certain MB threshold? If

    you claim to them that
    > you never connect to a laptop or other computer, are they going to believe

    you, or cut you off?
    > Can they even tell the difference? Do you have to defend yourself and

    prove yourself innocent when
    > you have done nothing but use your handset and the associated service?
    >
    > What is the protocol for this "data watchdog-ing" that is going on, and

    can Sprint tell the
    > difference between laptop and handset use?
    >
    > How does this whole thing work? 10Mb/week is quite low, and is very

    easily accomplished via one of
    > the high-end Smartphones, without the need for any kind of data cable.
    >






  9. #9
    O/Siris
    Guest

    Re: Rob - Heavy Vision Usage Question

    In article <[email protected]>, [email protected]=20
    says...
    > I've got a CF2031 that I use with my iPAQ. This month is heavy for me bu=

    t I
    > am up to 30MB this month. I have the $10 add a phone and $7.50 vision ad=

    ded
    > on. They let me do it so I will use it!! I won't abuse it though.
    >=20


    If we signed you up on a voice plan with that data card, we screwed you. =
    =20
    Not that the plan won't cover your usage, but that it's liable to simply=20
    disappear out from under you.

    Data cards should *never* be assigned to voice plans.

    --=20
    -+-
    R=D8=DF
    O/Siris
    I work for SprintPCS
    I *don't* speak for them.



  10. #10
    Sprintposter
    Guest

    Re: Rob - Heavy Vision Usage Question

    > Data cards should *never* be assigned
    > to voice plans.


    Fine, so what should they do now?; and what should SprintPCS do to correct
    thgis issue. We never hear that part from Rob.



  11. #11
    Kash76
    Guest

    Re: Rob - Heavy Vision Usage Question

    That's fine. I hope to stay "under the radar" by not using the data too
    much


    "O/Siris" <[email protected]ntpcs.cm> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    In article <[email protected]>, [email protected]
    says...
    > I've got a CF2031 that I use with my iPAQ. This month is heavy for me but

    I
    > am up to 30MB this month. I have the $10 add a phone and $7.50 vision

    added
    > on. They let me do it so I will use it!! I won't abuse it though.
    >


    If we signed you up on a voice plan with that data card, we screwed you.
    Not that the plan won't cover your usage, but that it's liable to simply
    disappear out from under you.

    Data cards should *never* be assigned to voice plans.

    --
    -+-
    R
    O/Siris
    I work for SprintPCS
    I *don't* speak for them.





  12. #12
    RexyBlue
    Guest

    Re: Rob - Heavy Vision Usage Question

    Oh, I've already done the math: $150 cancellation fee.

    On Wed, 17 Sep 2003 02:16:41 -0000, [email protected]ntpcs.cm (O/Siris
    ..) wrote:

    >RexyBlue <[email protected]> wrote in article
    ><[email protected]>:
    >> Nailed how? What will they do to you?

    >
    >Not much. Just cancel your vision package, and start charging you
    >1/KB. And you can't ever get the package back.
    >
    >That's equivalent to $10/MB. And you're used to multi-hundreds of MB a
    >month... well... you can do the math.





    ----------------------------
    To email me, remove the zz.



  13. #13
    O/Siris
    Guest

    Re: Rob - Heavy Vision Usage Question

    In article <[email protected]>,=20
    [email protected] says...
    > Oh, I've already done the math: $150 cancellation fee.
    >=20
    >=20


    LOL. Exactly.

    --=20
    -+-
    R=D8=DF
    O/Siris
    I work for SprintPCS
    I *don't* speak for them.



  14. #14
    Dan Tso
    Guest

    Re: Rob - Heavy Vision Usage Question

    In article <[email protected]>, [email protected]ntpcs.cm (O/Siris .) wrote:
    >Nomen Nescio <[email protected]> wrote in article
    ><[email protected]>:
    >> I've seen reports here from Rob and others that claim that Sprint is

    > "watching" data usage and is
    >> sending letters out to people whom them deem must be using a laptop because

    > of the volume of data
    >> ... defined loosly as over 10Mb/week.
    >>
    >> My question is: What does Sprint do when that usage is conducted purely on

    > the handset?


    >I haven't seen any "borderline" cases, Nomen. Frankly, and this is just
    >speculation, they aren't after every single violator. They are after
    >the "let's run Kazaa 24/7", multi-gigabyte obvious users.


    Actually I'm all for Sprint shutting down people who ABUSE the phone-as-modem
    feature onto Vision -- I certain want to have sufficient bandwidth available
    for everyone to use reasonably.

    But it should be based on some reasonable notion of moderate use, like
    20-50mb/mo or something, not on whether it is using the phone as a modem or
    not.

    In fact, I don't understand how Sprint could ultimately know whether the phone
    is being used as a "modem". I've read that Sprint can see the #777 dialing,
    but that seems a bit silly. If I wrote my own Palm app, which would be similar
    to the old Mocha PPP app, which would initiate a connection and then just act
    as a gateway, passing PPP or SLIP packets to the USB/serial port, how could
    Sprint possibly distinguish whether what this custom PPP gateway Palm app is
    doing compared to any other Palm app that accesses the network ?

    How could Sprint know that I didn't write my own Telnet client or Browser or
    whatever vs a network app that passes packets to a serial port ?

    So this "modem" policing seems silly. Should be just be based on bandwidth
    consumption...



  15. #15
    O/Siris
    Guest

    Re: Rob - Heavy Vision Usage Question

    In article <[email protected]>,=20
    [email protected] says...
    > In article <[email protected]>, [email protected]=EEntpcs.c=

    =F4m (O/Siris .) wrote:
    > >Nomen Nescio <[email protected]> wrote in article
    > ><[email protected]>:
    > >> I've seen reports here from Rob and others that claim that Sprint is

    > > "watching" data usage and is
    > >> sending letters out to people whom them deem must be using a laptop be=

    cause
    > > of the volume of data
    > >> ... defined loosly as over 10Mb/week.
    > >>=20
    > >> My question is: What does Sprint do when that usage is conducted pure=

    ly on
    > > the handset?

    >=20
    > >I haven't seen any "borderline" cases, Nomen. Frankly, and this is just
    > >speculation, they aren't after every single violator. They are after
    > >the "let's run Kazaa 24/7", multi-gigabyte obvious users.

    >=20
    > Actually I'm all for Sprint shutting down people who ABUSE the phone-as-m=

    odem=20
    > feature onto Vision -- I certain want to have sufficient bandwidth availa=

    ble=20
    > for everyone to use reasonably.
    >=20
    > But it should be based on some reasonable notion of moderate use, like=20
    > 20-50mb/mo or something, not on whether it is using the phone as a modem =

    or=20
    > not.


    Apparently, the people who look at this are using that notion, to an=20
    extent. Like I said, the only people I've seen acted against are those=20
    who unquestionably went beyond what the service intended to provide. I=20
    agree with you that it should be more defined, and that the blanket=20
    prohibition is wrong. Still, that's the policy, and it needs to be=20
    said.

    >=20
    > In fact, I don't understand how Sprint could ultimately know whether the =

    phone=20
    > is being used as a "modem". I've read that Sprint can see the #777 dialin=

    g,=20
    > but that seems a bit silly. If I wrote my own Palm app, which would be si=

    milar=20
    > to the old Mocha PPP app, which would initiate a connection and then just=

    act=20
    > as a gateway, passing PPP or SLIP packets to the USB/serial port, how cou=

    ld=20
    > Sprint possibly distinguish whether what this custom PPP gateway Palm app=

    is=20
    > doing compared to any other Palm app that accesses the network ?


    From what I understand, the phones, including the PDA's, use different=20
    packets (subtly different format), as well as different amounts of=20
    traffic. Or so I've been told, anyway.

    >=20
    > How could Sprint know that I didn't write my own Telnet client or Browser=

    or=20
    > whatever vs a network app that passes packets to a serial port ?
    >=20
    > So this "modem" policing seems silly. Should be just be based on bandwidt=

    h=20
    > consumption...
    >=20


    Since I don't have access to the tools used to arrive at decisions, I=20
    can only pass on the story I've been given. Then again, if the really=20
    obvious users are the only ones getting Vision service cancelled, then=20
    maybe it's a moot discussion. Until we find out for sure, though, I can=20
    certainly understand both the confusion and the frustration. And even=20
    agree with it.

    --=20
    -+-
    R=D8=DF
    O/Siris
    I work for SprintPCS
    I *don't* speak for them.



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