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  1. #31
    Rod Speed
    Guest

    Re: Why You Still Can't Hear Me Now


    Mij Adyaw <[email protected]> wrote in
    message news:[email protected]

    > Ok, assume that you are correct and that I have a GSM phone with a pull-out
    > antenna. If I am very far from the nearest GSM cell site I will have a better
    > chance of getting my signal to that remote cell site from a phone that has a
    > pull-out antenna. Do you agree?


    Nope. The GSM system IGNORES handsets that
    are further away from the base than a specified
    distance, even when it can hear them fine.

    Its done like that because the time delay with those more
    distant handsets will see their signal bleed over into the
    adjacent time slot thats being used by another handset.

    Thats often called the GSM digital cliff.

    >> Nope, its an inevitable consequence of the completely different
    >> design approach. GSM uses a high density of bases with a digital
    >> cliff that sees the base ignore handsets that are further away than
    >> a specified distance from the base, even when it can hear them.
    >> In THAT situation internal antennas work fine.
    >>
    >> CDMA is completely different with the technology allowing
    >> communication with more than one base at a time, and that
    >> means that the antenna requirements are quite different.
    >>
    >>> They simply do not want to deal with replacing broken antennas.

    >>
    >> That has absolutely nothing to do with it at all.
    >>
    >>
    >>> "Andrew White" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >>> news:[email protected]
    >>>> "Mij Adyaw" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>>An external pull-out antenna also makes all of the difference in a marginal
    >>>>>signal area. In a marginal signal area, the most common problem is that the
    >>>>>phone cannot get it's signal to the cell site.
    >>>>
    >>>> Those things have gone the way of horse-drawn carriages. I don't think
    >>>> there's a single GSM phone on the market today with an extendable
    >>>> antenna...
    >>>
    >>>

    >>
    >>

    >
    >






    See More: Why You Still Can't Hear Me Now




  2. #32
    Mij Adyaw
    Guest

    Re: Why You Still Can't Hear Me Now

    Basically this means that I must be within a certain distance of a GSM cell
    site and if I am farther away than that predefined distance, the cell site
    will ignore my signal. This essentially means that if I am at the top of a
    mountain and a GSM cell site is 5 miles away line of sight, the cell site
    will ignore my signal even though my signal easily gets to the cell site.

    I am really glad that I decided to go with CDMA since it does not suffer
    from this problem.


    "Rod Speed" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    >
    > Mij Adyaw <[email protected]> wrote in
    > message news:[email protected]
    >
    >> Ok, assume that you are correct and that I have a GSM phone with a
    >> pull-out antenna. If I am very far from the nearest GSM cell site I will
    >> have a better chance of getting my signal to that remote cell site from a
    >> phone that has a pull-out antenna. Do you agree?

    >
    > Nope. The GSM system IGNORES handsets that
    > are further away from the base than a specified
    > distance, even when it can hear them fine.
    >
    > Its done like that because the time delay with those more
    > distant handsets will see their signal bleed over into the
    > adjacent time slot thats being used by another handset.
    >
    > Thats often called the GSM digital cliff.
    >
    >>> Nope, its an inevitable consequence of the completely different
    >>> design approach. GSM uses a high density of bases with a digital
    >>> cliff that sees the base ignore handsets that are further away than
    >>> a specified distance from the base, even when it can hear them.
    >>> In THAT situation internal antennas work fine.
    >>>
    >>> CDMA is completely different with the technology allowing
    >>> communication with more than one base at a time, and that
    >>> means that the antenna requirements are quite different.
    >>>
    >>>> They simply do not want to deal with replacing broken antennas.
    >>>
    >>> That has absolutely nothing to do with it at all.
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>> "Andrew White" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >>>> news:[email protected]
    >>>>> "Mij Adyaw" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >>>>>
    >>>>>>An external pull-out antenna also makes all of the difference in a
    >>>>>>marginal
    >>>>>>signal area. In a marginal signal area, the most common problem is
    >>>>>>that the
    >>>>>>phone cannot get it's signal to the cell site.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Those things have gone the way of horse-drawn carriages. I don't think
    >>>>> there's a single GSM phone on the market today with an extendable
    >>>>> antenna...
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>>

    >>
    >>

    >
    >






  3. #33
    Rod Speed
    Guest

    Re: Why You Still Can't Hear Me Now


    Mij Adyaw <[email protected]> wrote in
    message news:[email protected]

    > Basically this means that I must be within a certain distance of a GSM cell
    > site and if I am farther away than that predefined distance, the cell site
    > will ignore my signal.


    Correct.

    > This essentially means that if I am at the top of a mountain and a GSM cell
    > site is 5 miles away line of sight, the cell site will ignore my signal even
    > though my signal easily gets to the cell site.


    Its normally set at 30KM, less than 19 miles.

    There are extended range GSM bases used in some situations
    where the normal base density isnt practical, but those have
    half the channel capacity, essentially because two time slots
    are used for each handset being communicated with.

    > I am really glad that I decided to go with CDMA since it does not suffer from
    > this problem.


    Its not necessarily a problem, the whole basis for the
    GSM system is a relatively high density of bases, and
    that is needed for a different reason anyway, the
    number of simultaneous calls in progress with each base.

    The cdma system has its own downsides.


    > "Rod Speed" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]
    >>
    >> Mij Adyaw <[email protected]> wrote in
    >> message news:[email protected]
    >>
    >>> Ok, assume that you are correct and that I have a GSM phone with a pull-out
    >>> antenna. If I am very far from the nearest GSM cell site I will have a
    >>> better chance of getting my signal to that remote cell site from a phone
    >>> that has a pull-out antenna. Do you agree?

    >>
    >> Nope. The GSM system IGNORES handsets that
    >> are further away from the base than a specified
    >> distance, even when it can hear them fine.
    >>
    >> Its done like that because the time delay with those more
    >> distant handsets will see their signal bleed over into the
    >> adjacent time slot thats being used by another handset.
    >>
    >> Thats often called the GSM digital cliff.
    >>
    >>>> Nope, its an inevitable consequence of the completely different
    >>>> design approach. GSM uses a high density of bases with a digital
    >>>> cliff that sees the base ignore handsets that are further away than
    >>>> a specified distance from the base, even when it can hear them.
    >>>> In THAT situation internal antennas work fine.
    >>>>
    >>>> CDMA is completely different with the technology allowing
    >>>> communication with more than one base at a time, and that
    >>>> means that the antenna requirements are quite different.
    >>>>
    >>>>> They simply do not want to deal with replacing broken antennas.
    >>>>
    >>>> That has absolutely nothing to do with it at all.
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>> "Andrew White" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >>>>> news:[email protected]
    >>>>>> "Mij Adyaw" <[email protected]> wrote:
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>>An external pull-out antenna also makes all of the difference in a
    >>>>>>>marginal
    >>>>>>>signal area. In a marginal signal area, the most common problem is that
    >>>>>>>the
    >>>>>>>phone cannot get it's signal to the cell site.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Those things have gone the way of horse-drawn carriages. I don't think
    >>>>>> there's a single GSM phone on the market today with an extendable
    >>>>>> antenna...
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>>

    >>
    >>

    >
    >






  4. #34
    Mij Adyaw
    Guest

    Re: Why You Still Can't Hear Me Now

    I am very aware of wavelength versus antenna performance. Pulling the
    antenna up doubles the wavelength of the antenna. Also with the antenna up,
    not as much of the antenna is shielded by the hand and therefore the
    performance should be better because the signal is attenuated less. If you
    do not believe this put your phone into debug mode and read the dbm signal
    strength and then pull the antenna up and read the signal strength again.
    The signal strength with the antenna up will be slightly higher. Now place
    the antenna in the center position half-way up. In this case, the antenna is
    not connected at all and the signal strength will be very poor.

    Making the antenna shorter will both decrease the amount of incoming signal
    the phone receives, and will make the phone's transmitter less efficient.
    But CDMA operates over a very wide range of effective powers, and it can
    usually compensate. That's why the phone will usually work with the antenna
    down. And because it's digital, if it is working it will sound exactly the
    same. This has lead some people to conclude that the antenna is not actually
    doing anything for them, which is not quite correct. While the phone can
    operate with the antenna down, it's easier on the phone if you raise the
    antenna; it has more signal ceiling to work with and will be less likely to
    drop the call. Also, it will use somewhat less transmit power, and your
    battery will last somewhat longer.


    "Joseph" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    > On Thu, 26 May 2005 15:46:31 -0700, "Mij Adyaw" <[email protected]>
    > wrote:
    >
    >>That is one the the reasons wny GSM systems are inferior to CDMA systems.
    >>They simply do not want to deal with replacing broken antennas.

    >
    > If you had bothered to do any research on antenna lengths and why CDMA
    > handsets require pull-out antennas you'd look less like a fool.
    >
    > http://denbeste.nu/cdmafaq/antenna.shtml
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
    >






  5. #35
    Rod Speed
    Guest

    Re: Why You Still Can't Hear Me Now


    Mij Adyaw <[email protected]> wrote in
    message news:[email protected]

    > I am very aware of wavelength versus antenna performance.


    No you're not.

    > Pulling the antenna up doubles the wavelength of the antenna.


    Its MUCH more complicated than that.

    > Also with the antenna up, not as much of the antenna is shielded by the hand
    > and therefore the performance should be better because the signal is
    > attenuated less.


    Its much more complicated than that too.

    > If you do not believe this put your phone into debug mode and read the dbm
    > signal strength and then pull the antenna up and read the signal strength
    > again.


    And that too.

    > The signal strength with the antenna up will be slightly higher. Now place the
    > antenna in the center position half-way up. In this case, the antenna is not
    > connected at all and the signal strength will be very poor.


    And again.

    > Making the antenna shorter will both decrease the amount of incoming signal
    > the phone receives, and will make the phone's transmitter less efficient.


    Wrong again.

    > But CDMA operates over a very wide range of effective powers, and it can
    > usually compensate.


    And again.

    > That's why the phone will usually work with the antenna down. And because it's
    > digital, if it is working it will sound exactly the same. This has lead some
    > people to conclude that the antenna is not actually doing anything for them,
    > which is not quite correct.


    You just said the opposite above.

    > While the phone can operate with the antenna down, it's easier on the phone if
    > you raise the antenna; it has more signal ceiling to work with and will be
    > less likely to drop the call.


    Utterly mangled all over again.

    > Also, it will use somewhat less transmit power, and your battery will last
    > somewhat longer.


    Utterly mangled all over again.

    You clearly dont have a clue about ANY of this stuff.


    > "Joseph" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]
    >> On Thu, 26 May 2005 15:46:31 -0700, "Mij Adyaw" <[email protected]>
    >> wrote:
    >>
    >>>That is one the the reasons wny GSM systems are inferior to CDMA systems.
    >>>They simply do not want to deal with replacing broken antennas.

    >>
    >> If you had bothered to do any research on antenna lengths and why CDMA
    >> handsets require pull-out antennas you'd look less like a fool.
    >>
    >> http://denbeste.nu/cdmafaq/antenna.shtml
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
    >>

    >
    >






  6. #36
    CharlesH
    Guest

    Re: Why You Still Can't Hear Me Now

    Rod Speed wrote:
    > Mij Adyaw <[email protected]> wrote in
    > message news:[email protected]
    > Nope, its an inevitable consequence of the completely different
    > design approach. GSM uses a high density of bases with a digital
    > cliff that sees the base ignore handsets that are further away than
    > a specified distance from the base, even when it can hear them.
    > In THAT situation internal antennas work fine.
    >
    > CDMA is completely different with the technology allowing
    > communication with more than one base at a time, and that
    > means that the antenna requirements are quite different.


    CDMA also supports a hard distance limit apart from signal strength, by
    specifying (at each base station) the maximum number of P/N offset units
    by which the signal from a mobile can differ from that of the base
    station. I've seen lots of reports of people who have a strong CDMA
    signal from a distant base station (say, from a mountain top), but
    cannot establish a connection with it. The phone falls back to analog,
    which is limited only by signal strength, and the call works fine. In
    sparsely populated areas (like the Australian Outback), the P/N
    threshold can be set arbitrarily high, allowing connections from up to
    about 80km (I think) from the base station before the signal is just too
    weak.



  7. #37
    Mij Adyaw
    Guest

    Re: Why You Still Can't Hear Me Now

    Your responses are very interesting since much of my response came from a
    CDMA FAQ website.

    "Rod Speed" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]
    >
    > Mij Adyaw <[email protected]> wrote in
    > message news:[email protected]
    >
    >> I am very aware of wavelength versus antenna performance.

    >
    > No you're not.
    >
    >> Pulling the antenna up doubles the wavelength of the antenna.

    >
    > Its MUCH more complicated than that.
    >
    >> Also with the antenna up, not as much of the antenna is shielded by the
    >> hand and therefore the performance should be better because the signal
    >> is attenuated less.

    >
    > Its much more complicated than that too.
    >
    >> If you do not believe this put your phone into debug mode and read the
    >> dbm signal strength and then pull the antenna up and read the signal
    >> strength again.

    >
    > And that too.
    >
    >> The signal strength with the antenna up will be slightly higher. Now
    >> place the antenna in the center position half-way up. In this case, the
    >> antenna is not connected at all and the signal strength will be very
    >> poor.

    >
    > And again.
    >
    >> Making the antenna shorter will both decrease the amount of incoming
    >> signal the phone receives, and will make the phone's transmitter less
    >> efficient.

    >
    > Wrong again.
    >
    >> But CDMA operates over a very wide range of effective powers, and it can
    >> usually compensate.

    >
    > And again.
    >
    >> That's why the phone will usually work with the antenna down. And because
    >> it's digital, if it is working it will sound exactly the same. This has
    >> lead some people to conclude that the antenna is not actually doing
    >> anything for them, which is not quite correct.

    >
    > You just said the opposite above.
    >
    >> While the phone can operate with the antenna down, it's easier on the
    >> phone if you raise the antenna; it has more signal ceiling to work with
    >> and will be less likely to drop the call.

    >
    > Utterly mangled all over again.
    >
    >> Also, it will use somewhat less transmit power, and your battery will
    >> last somewhat longer.

    >
    > Utterly mangled all over again.
    >
    > You clearly dont have a clue about ANY of this stuff.
    >
    >
    >> "Joseph" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >> news:[email protected]
    >>> On Thu, 26 May 2005 15:46:31 -0700, "Mij Adyaw" <[email protected]>
    >>> wrote:
    >>>
    >>>>That is one the the reasons wny GSM systems are inferior to CDMA
    >>>>systems.
    >>>>They simply do not want to deal with replacing broken antennas.
    >>>
    >>> If you had bothered to do any research on antenna lengths and why CDMA
    >>> handsets require pull-out antennas you'd look less like a fool.
    >>>
    >>> http://denbeste.nu/cdmafaq/antenna.shtml
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
    >>>

    >>
    >>

    >
    >






  8. #38
    George Grapman
    Guest

    Re: Why You Still Can't Hear Me Now

    Mij Adyaw wrote:
    > Your responses are very interesting since much of my response came from a
    > CDMA FAQ website.



    You accept a CDMA web site over Rod?
    In case you are new here let me explain. The child has a mental
    defect that prevents him from ever considering that he could either be
    wrong about anything or not know something.
    There is a thread going on here about the SBC/AT&T merger. The child
    denied AT&T had been a monopoly at the time of the breakup. I suggested
    that one can have a monopoly without having 100 percent of an industry.
    The child suggested a dictionary and I posted three definitions. At
    that point he reverted to his standard procedure whenever he is shown to
    be wrong:

    Whines of "irrelevant" or "bull****'
    An auto response mentioning toilets and fecal matter (along with
    children and dogs his favorite topics).
    Juvenile comments about the jobs others have (for obvious reasons he
    never talks about his work history).

    All three types of replies seem to be subconscious admissions that
    the facts have failed him, i.e a white flag of surrender.



    >
    > "Rod Speed" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]
    >
    >>Mij Adyaw <[email protected]> wrote in
    >>message news:[email protected]
    >>
    >>
    >>>I am very aware of wavelength versus antenna performance.

    >>
    >>No you're not.
    >>
    >>
    >>>Pulling the antenna up doubles the wavelength of the antenna.

    >>
    >>Its MUCH more complicated than that.
    >>
    >>
    >>>Also with the antenna up, not as much of the antenna is shielded by the
    >>>hand and therefore the performance should be better because the signal
    >>>is attenuated less.

    >>
    >>Its much more complicated than that too.
    >>
    >>
    >>>If you do not believe this put your phone into debug mode and read the
    >>>dbm signal strength and then pull the antenna up and read the signal
    >>>strength again.

    >>
    >>And that too.
    >>
    >>
    >>>The signal strength with the antenna up will be slightly higher. Now
    >>>place the antenna in the center position half-way up. In this case, the
    >>>antenna is not connected at all and the signal strength will be very
    >>>poor.

    >>
    >>And again.
    >>
    >>
    >>>Making the antenna shorter will both decrease the amount of incoming
    >>>signal the phone receives, and will make the phone's transmitter less
    >>>efficient.

    >>
    >>Wrong again.
    >>
    >>
    >>>But CDMA operates over a very wide range of effective powers, and it can
    >>>usually compensate.

    >>
    >>And again.
    >>
    >>
    >>>That's why the phone will usually work with the antenna down. And because
    >>>it's digital, if it is working it will sound exactly the same. This has
    >>>lead some people to conclude that the antenna is not actually doing
    >>>anything for them, which is not quite correct.

    >>
    >>You just said the opposite above.
    >>
    >>
    >>>While the phone can operate with the antenna down, it's easier on the
    >>>phone if you raise the antenna; it has more signal ceiling to work with
    >>>and will be less likely to drop the call.

    >>
    >>Utterly mangled all over again.
    >>
    >>
    >>>Also, it will use somewhat less transmit power, and your battery will
    >>>last somewhat longer.

    >>
    >>Utterly mangled all over again.
    >>
    >>You clearly dont have a clue about ANY of this stuff.
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>>"Joseph" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >>>news:[email protected]
    >>>
    >>>>On Thu, 26 May 2005 15:46:31 -0700, "Mij Adyaw" <[email protected]>
    >>>>wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>>That is one the the reasons wny GSM systems are inferior to CDMA
    >>>>>systems.
    >>>>>They simply do not want to deal with replacing broken antennas.
    >>>>
    >>>>If you had bothered to do any research on antenna lengths and why CDMA
    >>>>handsets require pull-out antennas you'd look less like a fool.
    >>>>
    >>>>http://denbeste.nu/cdmafaq/antenna.shtml
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>>

    >>

    >
    >



    --
    To reply via e-mail please delete 1 c from paccbell



  9. #39
    Rod Speed
    Guest

    Re: Why You Still Can't Hear Me Now


    Mij Adyaw <[email protected]> wrote in
    message news[email protected]

    > Your responses are very interesting since much of my response came from a CDMA
    > FAQ website.


    Plenty of pig ignorant web sites around and unless you
    dont say which one, we cant see what it actually says
    and what you have mangled what they actually did say.


    > Rod Speed <[email protected]> wrote
    >> Mij Adyaw <[email protected]> wrote


    >>> I am very aware of wavelength versus antenna performance.

    >>
    >> No you're not.
    >>
    >>> Pulling the antenna up doubles the wavelength of the antenna.

    >>
    >> Its MUCH more complicated than that.
    >>
    >>> Also with the antenna up, not as much of the antenna is shielded by the hand
    >>> and therefore the performance should be better because the signal is
    >>> attenuated less.

    >>
    >> Its much more complicated than that too.
    >>
    >>> If you do not believe this put your phone into debug mode and read the dbm
    >>> signal strength and then pull the antenna up and read the signal strength
    >>> again.

    >>
    >> And that too.
    >>
    >>> The signal strength with the antenna up will be slightly higher. Now place
    >>> the antenna in the center position half-way up. In this case, the antenna is
    >>> not connected at all and the signal strength will be very poor.

    >>
    >> And again.
    >>
    >>> Making the antenna shorter will both decrease the amount of incoming signal
    >>> the phone receives, and will make the phone's transmitter less efficient.

    >>
    >> Wrong again.
    >>
    >>> But CDMA operates over a very wide range of effective powers, and it can
    >>> usually compensate.

    >>
    >> And again.
    >>
    >>> That's why the phone will usually work with the antenna down. And because
    >>> it's digital, if it is working it will sound exactly the same. This has lead
    >>> some people to conclude that the antenna is not actually doing anything for
    >>> them, which is not quite correct.

    >>
    >> You just said the opposite above.
    >>
    >>> While the phone can operate with the antenna down, it's easier on the phone
    >>> if you raise the antenna; it has more signal ceiling to work with and will
    >>> be less likely to drop the call.

    >>
    >> Utterly mangled all over again.
    >>
    >>> Also, it will use somewhat less transmit power, and your battery will last
    >>> somewhat longer.

    >>
    >> Utterly mangled all over again.
    >>
    >> You clearly dont have a clue about ANY of this stuff.
    >>
    >>
    >>> "Joseph" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >>> news:[email protected]
    >>>> On Thu, 26 May 2005 15:46:31 -0700, "Mij Adyaw" <[email protected]>
    >>>> wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>>That is one the the reasons wny GSM systems are inferior to CDMA systems.
    >>>>>They simply do not want to deal with replacing broken antennas.
    >>>>
    >>>> If you had bothered to do any research on antenna lengths and why CDMA
    >>>> handsets require pull-out antennas you'd look less like a fool.
    >>>>
    >>>> http://denbeste.nu/cdmafaq/antenna.shtml
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>>

    >>
    >>

    >
    >






  10. #40
    Rod Speed
    Guest

    Re: Why You Still Can't Hear Me Now

    Some terminal sales ****wit claiming to be
    George Grapman <[email protected]> wrote in message
    news:[email protected]

    <reams of the puerile **** thats always pouring from
    the sales ****wit's arse flushed where it belongs>

    Whoops, nothing left, as always.

    No surprise that the best its ever been able to manage is sales ****wit.





  11. #41
    George Grapman
    Guest

    Re: Why You Still Can't Hear Me Now

    Rod Speed wrote:
    > Mij Adyaw <[email protected]> wrote in
    > message news[email protected]
    >
    >
    >>Your responses are very interesting since much of my response came from a CDMA
    >>FAQ website.


    So what? If he posts it you will whine "irrelevant" and "bull****"


    --
    To reply via e-mail please delete 1 c from paccbell



  12. #42
    George Grapman
    Guest

    Re: Why You Still Can't Hear Me Now

    Rod Speed wrote:
    > Some terminal sales ****wit claiming to be
    > George Grapman <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]
    >
    > <reams of the puerile **** thats always pouring from
    > the sales ****wit's arse flushed where it belongs>
    >
    > Whoops, nothing left, as always.
    >
    > No surprise that the best its ever been able to manage is sales ****wit.
    >
    >

    When last seen the little boy was telling me to get a dictionary to
    learn what a monopoly is. When I posted three definitions showing him to
    be in error he went to the ****wit bot as he could not admit error.
    When does that next welfare check come,little boy?

    --
    To reply via e-mail please delete 1 c from paccbell



  13. #43
    Rod Speed
    Guest

    Re: Why You Still Can't Hear Me Now


    Some terminal sales ****wit claiming to be
    George Grapman <[email protected]>
    desperately attempted to bull**** its
    way out of its predicament in message
    news:[email protected]
    and fooled absolutely no one at all. As always.

    No surprise that the best its ever been able to manage is sales ****wit.





  14. #44
    Rod Speed
    Guest

    Re: Why You Still Can't Hear Me Now

    Some terminal sales ****wit claiming to be
    George Grapman <[email protected]>
    desperately attempted to bull**** its
    way out of its predicament in message
    news:[email protected]
    and fooled absolutely no one at all. As always.

    No surprise that the best its ever been able to manage is sales ****wit.





  15. #45
    George Grapman
    Guest

    Re: Why You Still Can't Hear Me Now

    Rod Speed wrote:
    > Some terminal sales ****wit claiming to be
    > George Grapman <[email protected]>
    > desperately attempted to bull**** its
    > way out of its predicament in message
    > news:[email protected]
    > and fooled absolutely no one at all. As always.
    >
    > No surprise that the best its ever been able to manage is sales ****wit.
    >
    >

    Thanks for the white flag of surrender, again, little boy.
    And your job is...................?

    --
    To reply via e-mail please delete 1 c from paccbell



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