any cell phone for 911 calls?

i'm interested in having a "disabled"
cell phone for use strictly at home
and only for possibly making a 911 call
(if i ever need to)

last week the sales rep at a US Cellular
store (in the Chicago area) told me
that any disabled cell phone would work

1. is this true? i mean, that i'd
not have to pay any ongoing charges
other than what i'd have to pay to
get a used cell phone?

2. anyway, i bought a one year old US Cellular
VX4400 (by LG) from a friend for $20 (manual
included) and it charged up OK

how do i test it? i mean, calling 911 to
test it doesn't strike me as a good idea?

thank you in advance, bill

---

› See More: any cell phone for 911 calls?

In message <[email protected]> willbill
<[email protected]> wrote:

>i'm interested in having a "disabled"
>cell phone for use strictly at home
>and only for possibly making a 911 call
>(if i ever need to)
>
>last week the sales rep at a US Cellular
>store (in the Chicago area) told me
>that any disabled cell phone would work
>
>1. is this true? i mean, that i'd
> not have to pay any ongoing charges
> other than what i'd have to pay to
> get a used cell phone?

It's true, as long as you have reception....

>2. anyway, i bought a one year old US Cellular
> VX4400 (by LG) from a friend for $20 (manual
> included) and it charged up OK
>
> how do i test it? i mean, calling 911 to
> test it doesn't strike me as a good idea?

Unfortunately you can't really test it without calling 911, and I
wouldn't recommend doing that.

Also be aware that they will not have access to your address, so unlike
calling 911 from a landline you need to be prepared to provide location
information.

--
I read usenet for the articles

"DevilsPGD" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>> In message <[email protected]> willbill
>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>i'm interested in having a "disabled"
>>cell phone for use strictly at home
>>and only for possibly making a 911 call
>>(if i ever need to)
>>
>>last week the sales rep at a US Cellular
>>store (in the Chicago area) told me
>>that any disabled cell phone would work
>>
>>1. is this true? i mean, that i'd
>> not have to pay any ongoing charges
>> other than what i'd have to pay to
>> get a used cell phone?
> It's true, as long as you have reception....
>
>>2. anyway, i bought a one year old US Cellular
>> VX4400 (by LG) from a friend for $20 (manual
>> included) and it charged up OK
>>
>> how do i test it? i mean, calling 911 to
>> test it doesn't strike me as a good idea?
>
> Unfortunately you can't really test it without calling 911, and I
> wouldn't recommend doing that.
>
> Also be aware that they will not have access to your address, so unlike
> calling 911 from a landline you need to be prepared to provide location
> information.
>
> --
> I read usenet for the articles
>
It is true that the OP can make 911 calls from an inactive cell phone.
But the bit about the 911 center not being able to locate the OP is a bit
wrong.
If the phone has aGPS capabilities that are required to by the FCC, then
the location will be sent IF the 911 call center has E911. If not, they
would need
the location of the OP. It is still a smart idea to give the call center
your location any way.

--
Andrew D. Sisson

In message <[email protected]> "Andy S"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>It is true that the OP can make 911 calls from an inactive cell phone.
>But the bit about the 911 center not being able to locate the OP is a bit
>wrong.
>If the phone has aGPS capabilities that are required to by the FCC, then
>the location will be sent IF the 911 call center has E911. If not, they
>would need
>the location of the OP. It is still a smart idea to give the call center
>your location any way.

Even if your phone has GPS capability, there is no guarantee that it
will work indoors.

If it has AGPS then you're looking at a relatively new phone, not just
any phone which was kicking around unused. Even so, if there is simply
no GPS signal at all, it won't help much.

Tower location will get you within a few hundred houses. Knowing which
antenna might even get you within a couple dozen.

How many houses do you think the paramedics will wake up at 4am in the
morning if you're having a heart attack and can't give your address?

Yes it's better then nothing, but it's important to know the
limitations. Personally, I have nothing but cell phones and VoIP phones
in my house.

--
No Sprinkles. For every sprinkle I find, I shall kill you.
-- Stewie

willbill wrote:
> i'm interested in having a "disabled"
> cell phone for use strictly at home
> and only for possibly making a 911 call
> (if i ever need to)
>
> last week the sales rep at a US Cellular
> store (in the Chicago area) told me
> that any disabled cell phone would work
>
> 1. is this true? i mean, that i'd
> not have to pay any ongoing charges
> other than what i'd have to pay to
> get a used cell phone?
>
> 2. anyway, i bought a one year old US Cellular
> VX4400 (by LG) from a friend for $20 (manual
> included) and it charged up OK
>
> how do i test it? i mean, calling 911 to
> test it doesn't strike me as a good idea?

Well in California, 911 calls from mobile phones go to the California
Highway Patrol. On the occasions that I've called 911 from a mobile
phone, the wait for someone to pick up can be very long, I've waited as
long as fifteen minutes for a live person, and given up. So a quick 911
call from a deactivated cell phone just to see if it works, is probably
not a terribly big deal if you hang up before anyone actually picks up.
It's not like calling from your home, where they'll send someone out if
you hang up.

If you really feel strongly about it, wait until you're out driving to
test it, and report an accident or debris on the freeway.

I've yet to find a deactivated phone that won't call 911.

SMS wrote:

> willbill wrote:
>
>> i'm interested in having a "disabled"
>> cell phone for use strictly at home
>> and only for possibly making a 911 call
>> (if i ever need to)
>>
>> last week the sales rep at a US Cellular
>> store (in the Chicago area) told me
>> that any disabled cell phone would work
>>
>> 1. is this true? i mean, that i'd
>> not have to pay any ongoing charges
>> other than what i'd have to pay to
>> get a used cell phone?
>>
>> 2. anyway, i bought a one year old US Cellular
>> VX4400 (by LG) from a friend for $20 (manual
>> included) and it charged up OK
>>
>> how do i test it? i mean, calling 911 to
>> test it doesn't strike me as a good idea?
>
>
> Well in California, 911 calls from mobile phones go to the California
> Highway Patrol. On the occasions that I've called 911 from a mobile
> phone, the wait for someone to pick up can be very long, I've waited as
> long as fifteen minutes for a live person, and given up. So a quick 911
> call from a deactivated cell phone just to see if it works, is probably
> not a terribly big deal if you hang up before anyone actually picks up.


interesting thought.


> It's not like calling from your home, where they'll send someone out if
> you hang up.


my home and/or backyard is where i'd actually use it,
as stated in my original post (above), if i ever need to

>
> If you really feel strongly about it, wait until you're out driving to
> test it, and report an accident or debris on the freeway.


as above, interesting thought.


>
> I've yet to find a deactivated phone that won't call 911.


on target comment; thank you. have you done this
in any state besides California?

fwiw, after doing my post here, i spent close
to 3 hours (!!!) on google trying to find current
info on this subject and struck out

i may not be the greatest searcher, but i am
a computer guy and at least have half a clue

what appears to be clear from that search is
that 911 has been inundated by huge call
volumes from cell phone users this past 5 years.
so no public person/organization wants to advertize
that inactivated cell phones can make **free**
911 calls. and it goes without saying that no cell
phone company wants to advertize it either
(they want *active* monthly/paying customers)

at least, that's my tentative conclusion.
correct me if i'm wrong.

bill

[ all snipped ]

Under FCC mandates, any cellular phone,
whether with a valid account or not,
can be used for 911 calls.

HOWEVER, there are some "GOTCHAS".

The key point is that cellular phones
are, of course, radios. If you're not in
a range of a _compatable_ base station, your
call ain't going through.

And that word 'copmpatable" is important.

Cellular phones operate on different frequencies
and with different protocols. WHile there's a lot
of cross operation, it's far from universal.

In other words, if you've got a phone operating
using the iDen protocol and frequencies,
it'll only succeed if you're in an area
covered by Nextel. There might be a Verizon
tower 1,000 feet from you, but your phone
won't talk to it.




--
_____________________________________________________
Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key
[email protected]
[to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded]

danny burstein wrote:

> [ all snipped ]
>
> Under FCC mandates, any cellular phone,
> whether with a valid account or not,
> can be used for 911 calls.
>
> HOWEVER, there are some "GOTCHAS".
>
> The key point is that cellular phones
> are, of course, radios. If you're not in
> a range of a _compatable_ base station, your
> call ain't going through.
>
> And that word 'copmpatable" is important.
>
> Cellular phones operate on different frequencies
> and with different protocols. WHile there's a lot
> of cross operation, it's far from universal.
>
> In other words, if you've got a phone operating
> using the iDen protocol and frequencies,
> it'll only succeed if you're in an area
> covered by Nextel. There might be a Verizon
> tower 1,000 feet from you, but your phone
> won't talk to it.


point taken

btw, which "network" does US Cellular use?

maybe i should be carrying *two* different
invalid account cell phones?

bill

willbill wrote:

> what appears to be clear from that search is
> that 911 has been inundated by huge call
> volumes from cell phone users this past 5 years.
> so no public person/organization wants to advertize
> that inactivated cell phones can make **free**
> 911 calls. and it goes without saying that no cell
> phone company wants to advertize it either
> (they want *active* monthly/paying customers)
>
> at least, that's my tentative conclusion.
> correct me if i'm wrong.

What I've seen recently is that for many people the novelty of a cell
phone has worn off, and they use it less and less, except for free
off-peak long distance. Then they get upset that they're paying
$40-50/month and look for alternatives. What the cell phone companies
want to avoid is a mass migration to pre-paid, so they try to make
pre-paid unattractive. T-Mobile is the exception, with their $100/1000
minutes/1 year expiration, but T-Mobile coverage is such that you
wouldn't want it as an "emergency" phone if you go out of urban areas.

There are some good prepaid companies out there, such as Beyond
Wireless, and Locus, but most people have never heard of them. And of
course these companies exists only because companies like Verizon,
Cingular, and Sprint are willing to sell access to their networks, and
if too many customers started moving to these other prepaid providers
then either access to the networks would be cut off, or prices would go up.

The most well known prepaid companies, Tracfone, and Virgin, are among
the worst in terms of cost and/or coverage.

SMS <[email protected]> wrote:
>Well in California, 911 calls from mobile phones go to the California
>Highway Patrol. On the occasions that I've called 911 from a mobile
>phone, the wait for someone to pick up can be very long, I've waited as
>long as fifteen minutes for a live person,

Huh. So it wasn't just a fluke... Last 4th-of-July some children started a
brush fire next to my house (they decided that very dry high grass would be a
good place to set off firecrackers.) The flames in the trees and brush
instantly became very high. I called 911 on my cell phone and had to wait
about 3 minutes on hold. Eventually the CHP answered and patched me through
to the proper local agency. The fire department, once it came, was able to
take put it out it quickly, and the house was unharmed, but about four trees
died in the meantime.

15 minutes sounds even worse than 3 minutes...

I'll try to avoid using the cellphone for 911 in the future...

Garry

"willbill" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> what appears to be clear from that search is
> that 911 has been inundated by huge call
> volumes from cell phone users this past 5 years.
> so no public person/organization wants to advertize
> that inactivated cell phones can make **free**
> 911 calls. and it goes without saying that no cell
> phone company wants to advertize it either
> (they want *active* monthly/paying customers)
>
> at least, that's my tentative conclusion.
> correct me if i'm wrong.

I don't think that's true at all, Bill. The info is all over the Web.
I typed

911 "cell phone"

into Yahoo and found answers in the first page of hits. By adding
words like "deactivated" etc. I could have done even better. Many of
the hits were local news stories; maybe using the names of nearby
cities in the search will reveal how the calls are handled in your
area.


One problem with a deactivated cell phone is that generally it can't
receive a call. On my scanner I often hear emergency responders asking
the dispatcher to call the reporting party back. Sometimes it's
because they can't find the address. In the stress of an emergency the
caller transposed digits in the house number. Or maybe the cops roll
up on the location of a reported fight in the street but find all
quiet. So they ask the dispatcher to call back and find out if the
disturbing parties went inside, departed in a vehicle, whatever.

The issue of callback capability is so important that the FCC issued a
news release in 2002:

http://www.fcc.gov/Bureaus/Wireline_.../nrwc0202.html


Maybe a prepaid phone will fit your budget. That way you get a "real"
cell phone able to make and receive calls. On a per-minute basis the
charges are higher than being on a contract. But if the phone is just
for occasional use, the minimum charge to keep the phone alive is more
important. Prepaid can be pretty good in that respect. I use Boost
Mobile -- $20 every 90 days.

--
Paul Hirose <[email protected]>
To reply by email remove INVALID

Garry W wrote:
> SMS <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>Well in California, 911 calls from mobile phones go to the California
>>Highway Patrol. On the occasions that I've called 911 from a mobile
>>phone, the wait for someone to pick up can be very long, I've waited as
>>long as fifteen minutes for a live person,
>
> Huh. So it wasn't just a fluke... Last 4th-of-July some children started a
> brush fire next to my house (they decided that very dry high grass would be a
> good place to set off firecrackers.) The flames in the trees and brush
> instantly became very high. I called 911 on my cell phone and had to wait
> about 3 minutes on hold. Eventually the CHP answered and patched me through
> to the proper local agency. The fire department, once it came, was able to
> take put it out it quickly, and the house was unharmed, but about four trees
> died in the meantime.
>
> 15 minutes sounds even worse than 3 minutes...
>
> I'll try to avoid using the cellphone for 911 in the future...

In California, they are reconfiguring things so cellular 911 calls go
directly to the appropriate 911 center whenever possible, but the
Highway Patrol is still the default if it hasn't been set up in a
particular area. Part of the E911 mandate from the FCC about being able
to locate cellular 911 callers.

In <[email protected]> CharlesH <[email protected]> writes:
[ snip ]

>In California, they are reconfiguring things so cellular 911 calls go
>directly to the appropriate 911 center whenever possible, but the
>Highway Patrol is still the default if it hasn't been set up in a
>particular area. Part of the E911 mandate from the FCC about being able
>to locate cellular 911 callers.i

Keep in mind that the early versions of "modern" cellular
phones (the AMPS system that started in the early 1980s)
was multi-watt, car based, external antenna.. and would
reach towers miles away. Hence it wasn't at all clear to
the base station where the mobile unit was and in
which jurisdiction.

Hence it made sense to route all those calls
to a central regional agency which would get
you "something" that could reroute the call as needed.

--
_____________________________________________________
Knowledge may be power, but communications is the key
[email protected]
[to foil spammers, my address has been double rot-13 encoded]

Evan Platt wrote:
> On Tue, 22 Nov 2005 15:57:37 -0800, SMS <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
>
>>Well in California, 911 calls from mobile phones go to the California
>>Highway Patrol.
>
>
> Not everywhere. In Northern California at least, I have about 3 cities
> near me where if I call 911 from a Verizon Cell, it goes to the city
> police.Sunnyvale is one Palo Alto is another, can't recall the others.

I have called 911 in Sunnyvale and it went to the CHP. Who transferred
me to Sunnyvale, who told me that the CHP is in charge of accidents on
Lawrence Expressway in Sunnyvale. Now I have all the local police
numbers programmed into my cell phone, because it's such a pain to wait
for CHP to pick up.