CDMA vs 3g in OZ

Graeme said....

> I recently upgraded my CDMA phone to another CDMA phone. Based on the
> initial announcement by Telstra, it'll be around for a few years. If
> rollout of 3G 850 doesn't go to plan, it will be longer. Either way, at
> this point in time, I figured I'll still get reasonable use from this
> handset.

I'm in a similar position. The local Telstra dealer has told me that
they should be getting phones in around Sept, Oct. So, I'm hanging off
til then to see what's on offer. If it's nothing spectacular I'll keep
the Nokia 2280 til CDMA's finally phased out where I live. I'll then see
what's available to me and whether I really need another phone.

---

› See More: CDMA vs 3g in OZ

On 27 Jul 2006 23:23:39 +0200 Emjaye may have written:
> I'm in a similar position. The local Telstra dealer has told me that
> they should be getting phones in around Sept, Oct. So, I'm hanging off
> til then to see what's on offer. If it's nothing spectacular I'll keep
> the Nokia 2280 til CDMA's finally phased out where I live. I'll then
> see what's available to me and whether I really need another phone.

For a "cheapie", the 2280 has awesome reception... I recently upgraded
to a 6225 because I wanted to use the IR for data, but only after
sitting the two units next to each other for a while with NetMonitor
running to ensure the 6225 was no worse than a few dBm below the 2280!

From what I've read, some of the other cheapie Nokia CDMA phones are
woeful in the reception department.

PD

--
Paul Day
Web: http://www.enigma.id.au/

Emjaye wrote:
> Graeme said....
>
>> I recently upgraded my CDMA phone to another CDMA phone. Based on the
>> initial announcement by Telstra, it'll be around for a few years. If
>> rollout of 3G 850 doesn't go to plan, it will be longer. Either way, at
>> this point in time, I figured I'll still get reasonable use from this
>> handset.
>
> I'm in a similar position. The local Telstra dealer has told me that
> they should be getting phones in around Sept, Oct. So, I'm hanging off
> til then to see what's on offer. If it's nothing spectacular I'll keep
> the Nokia 2280 til CDMA's finally phased out where I live. I'll then see
> what's available to me and whether I really need another phone.
>

If I bought one before 2008ish, I want to know whether these new
handsets also default back to GSM when there's no 3G coverage.
Otherwise, depending on where you go, you could find yourself with
little or no coverage during the roll-out phase.

Graeme Willox wrote:
> Emjaye wrote:
>> Graeme said....
>>> I recently upgraded my CDMA phone to another CDMA phone. Based on
>>> the initial announcement by Telstra, it'll be around for a few
>>> years. If rollout of 3G 850 doesn't go to plan, it will be longer.
>>> Either way, at
>>> this point in time, I figured I'll still get reasonable use from this
>>> handset.
>>
>> I'm in a similar position. The local Telstra dealer has told me that
>> they should be getting phones in around Sept, Oct. So, I'm hanging off
>> til then to see what's on offer. If it's nothing spectacular I'll keep
>> the Nokia 2280 til CDMA's finally phased out where I live. I'll then see
>> what's available to me and whether I really need another phone.
>>
>
> If I bought one before 2008ish, I want to know whether these new
> handsets also default back to GSM when there's no 3G coverage.
> Otherwise, depending on where you go, you could find yourself with
> little or no coverage during the roll-out phase.
As far as I know, all 3G UMTS handsets support GSM as well.

Jonathan Wilson wrote:
> Graeme Willox wrote:
>> Emjaye wrote:
>>> Graeme said....
>>>> I recently upgraded my CDMA phone to another CDMA phone. Based on
>>>> the initial announcement by Telstra, it'll be around for a few
>>>> years. If rollout of 3G 850 doesn't go to plan, it will be longer.
>>>> Either way, at
>>>> this point in time, I figured I'll still get reasonable use from
>>>> this handset.
>>>
>>> I'm in a similar position. The local Telstra dealer has told me that
>>> they should be getting phones in around Sept, Oct. So, I'm hanging off
>>> til then to see what's on offer. If it's nothing spectacular I'll keep
>>> the Nokia 2280 til CDMA's finally phased out where I live. I'll then see
>>> what's available to me and whether I really need another phone.
>>>
>>
>> If I bought one before 2008ish, I want to know whether these new
>> handsets also default back to GSM when there's no 3G coverage.
>> Otherwise, depending on where you go, you could find yourself with
>> little or no coverage during the roll-out phase.
> As far as I know, all 3G UMTS handsets support GSM as well.

I believe that so far, they do, but to the best of my knowledge, none of
the 3G 850 handsets actually exist yet.

> I believe that so far, they do, but to the best of my knowledge, none of
> the 3G 850 handsets actually exist yet.

WCDMA phones that operate at 850MHz do definitely exist- I have a
Samsung ZX20 in my hand as we speak and it operates WCDMA at 850 and
1900 MHz (as well as quad band gsm - 850, 900, 1800 and 1900). It is
also HSDPA and to be honest- it's a pretty good phone. It may not be
commerical available outside north america- but it does exist.

It's important to note that it doesn't operate WCDMA at 2100. I think
it is safe to say that Telstra will only be launching with handsets
that work at 850 and 2100 (for WCDMA) as 900 and 1800 (for GSM). These
handsets are coming (qualcomm has a chip available that works on these
two frequencies) and companies like HTC have announced handsets that
will work at these freq as well (TyTN is one such phone).

Fred

[email protected] wrote:
>> I believe that so far, they do, but to the best of my knowledge, none of
>> the 3G 850 handsets actually exist yet.
>
> WCDMA phones that operate at 850MHz do definitely exist- I have a
> Samsung ZX20 in my hand as we speak and it operates WCDMA at 850 and
> 1900 MHz (as well as quad band gsm - 850, 900, 1800 and 1900). It is
> also HSDPA and to be honest- it's a pretty good phone. It may not be
> commerical available outside north america- but it does exist.

Ok. I was unaware of that.

>
> It's important to note that it doesn't operate WCDMA at 2100. I think
> it is safe to say that Telstra will only be launching with handsets
> that work at 850 and 2100 (for WCDMA) as 900 and 1800 (for GSM).

I wonder whether they'll use 850 mhz in areas where they already have
2100 mhz established.

Graeme Willox wrote:

> I wonder whether they'll use 850 mhz in areas where they
> already have 2100 mhz established.

I expect they'll at least place a few 850 MHz cells on elevated
spots to plug some holes in 2100 MHz coverage.

John

Graeme said....

> I wonder whether they'll use 850 mhz in areas where they already have
> 2100 mhz established.

This is oh so confusing.

So, will we have two separate and distinct 3G services? When CDMA closes
down, I get one of these 850 meg jobs. Meanwhile, my daughter who's on
"3" with her 3G phone will not be able to access her 3G network (it
roams to Telstra GSM when out of the city area where she has coverage)
when she visits us? Conversely when we travel to the big smoke, well
Narre Warren Sth, an hour away, will be still have this new 3G coverage,
particularly when we go into Melbourne and the 'burbs itself?

Why couldn't they simply build ONE network with ONE standard in
operation? What's wrong with swapping the GSM service for this new one.
Get rid of CDMA and GSM and just go with the one service?

And no, I don't know much about mobile phones. I'm neither as fascinated
nor as absorbed in them as some of you are. I simply want to be able to
make and receive calls whereever I go, be it in rural Vic/NSW or in and
around metro areas.

Emjaye wrote:
> Graeme said....
>
>> I wonder whether they'll use 850 mhz in areas where they already have
>> 2100 mhz established.
>
> This is oh so confusing.
>
> So, will we have two separate and distinct 3G services?

Sort of. Hutchison sold half of their 3G network to Telstra, and they
both currently provide 3G services on the same network.

> When CDMA closes
> down, I get one of these 850 meg jobs. Meanwhile, my daughter who's on
> "3" with her 3G phone will not be able to access her 3G network (it
> roams to Telstra GSM when out of the city area where she has coverage)
> when she visits us? Conversely when we travel to the big smoke, well
> Narre Warren Sth, an hour away, will be still have this new 3G coverage,
> particularly when we go into Melbourne and the 'burbs itself?

Telstra are now building their 850 mhz network. I've been told by
people in this newsgroup that Telstra won't be wholesaling this network,
so from that perspective, we'll have two separate networks.

They currently wholesale their CDMA network. I'm not predicting it, but
it wouldn't surprise me if they decided to provide wholesale access to
3G 850 mhz to some of the other providers at some stage in the future.
>
> Why couldn't they simply build ONE network with ONE standard in
> operation? What's wrong with swapping the GSM service for this new one.
> Get rid of CDMA and GSM and just go with the one service?

That would make sense. The only saving grace is that 3G handsets also
support GSM, which is generally useful for people who go overseas or
domestically to areas where there is no 3G.
>
> And no, I don't know much about mobile phones. I'm neither as fascinated
> nor as absorbed in them as some of you are. I simply want to be able to
> make and receive calls whereever I go, be it in rural Vic/NSW or in and
> around metro areas.
>

I think that if you were to add the ability to send and receive SMS
messages, you'd probably have the needs of over 90% of mobile phone
users. That's pretty much all I want mine to do.

"Emjaye" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Graeme said....
>
> > I wonder whether they'll use 850 mhz in areas where they already have
> > 2100 mhz established.
>
> This is oh so confusing.
>
> So, will we have two separate and distinct 3G services? When CDMA closes

No. 3G is 3G

> down, I get one of these 850 meg jobs. Meanwhile, my daughter who's on
> "3" with her 3G phone will not be able to access her 3G network (it
> roams to Telstra GSM when out of the city area where she has coverage)
> when she visits us? Conversely when we travel to the big smoke, well

Thats right, she will roam to GSM

> Why couldn't they simply build ONE network with ONE standard in
> operation? What's wrong with swapping the GSM service for this new one.
> Get rid of CDMA and GSM and just go with the one service?

You just dont understand, do you?


>
> And no, I don't know much about mobile phones. I'm neither as fascinated
> nor as absorbed in them as some of you are. I simply want to be able to
> make and receive calls whereever I go, be it in rural Vic/NSW or in and
> around metro areas.

Which you can do now, and will continue to be able to do
>

Michael wrote:
> "Emjaye" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> Graeme said....
>>
>>> I wonder whether they'll use 850 mhz in areas where they already have
>>> 2100 mhz established.
>> This is oh so confusing.
>>
>> So, will we have two separate and distinct 3G services? When CDMA closes
>
> No. 3G is 3G

Wrong. Telstra DOES currently operate 2 VERY different 3G services. One
is EV-DO with the cdma2000 standard, and the other is the 3GSM
(UMTS/W-CDMA) service.
With the upcoming changes Telstra will finally have just a single 3G and
2G service.

>> down, I get one of these 850 meg jobs. Meanwhile, my daughter who's on
>> "3" with her 3G phone will not be able to access her 3G network (it
>> roams to Telstra GSM when out of the city area where she has coverage)
>> when she visits us? Conversely when we travel to the big smoke, well
>
> Thats right, she will roam to GSM
>
>> Why couldn't they simply build ONE network with ONE standard in
>> operation? What's wrong with swapping the GSM service for this new one.
>> Get rid of CDMA and GSM and just go with the one service?
>
> You just dont understand, do you?
>
>
>> And no, I don't know much about mobile phones. I'm neither as fascinated
>> nor as absorbed in them as some of you are. I simply want to be able to
>> make and receive calls whereever I go, be it in rural Vic/NSW or in and
>> around metro areas.
>
> Which you can do now, and will continue to be able to do
>
>

Emjaye wrote:

> So, will we have two separate and distinct 3G services? When
> CDMA closes down, I get one of these 850 meg jobs.

Just to clear up one possible source of confusion, the new 850
MHz phones will need to be dual-band, and cover 2100 MHZ as
well. Almost all GSM handsets sold here in the last 7 years or
so have been multi-band, seemlessly switching between 900 MHz
and 1800 MHz as required during a call.

> Meanwhile, my daughter who's on "3" with her 3G phone will
> not be able to access her 3G network (it roams to Telstra GSM
> when out of the city area where she has coverage) when she
> visits us? Conversely when we travel to the big smoke, well
> Narre Warren Sth, an hour away, will be still have this new 3G
> coverage, particularly when we go into Melbourne and the
> 'burbs itself?
>
> Why couldn't they simply build ONE network with ONE standard
> in operation? What's wrong with swapping the GSM service for
> this new one. Get rid of CDMA and GSM and just go with the one
> service?

That's what's being proposed for the longer term, although (just
like now) the different networks will bar access to users of
SIMs on other networks unless roaming agreements are in place.

John

John Henderson wrote:
> Emjaye wrote:
>
>> So, will we have two separate and distinct 3G services? When
>> CDMA closes down, I get one of these 850 meg jobs.
>
> Just to clear up one possible source of confusion, the new 850
> MHz phones will need to be dual-band, and cover 2100 MHZ as
> well. Almost all GSM handsets sold here in the last 7 years or

Eh? They won't NEED to be dual band, in fact 850/2100 dual band 3GSM
handsets will be very hard if not impossible to source due to the small
market. You'll only need to have an 850 capable phone since the 850 band
will have coverage everywhere that the current CDMA network has which is
pretty much everywhere.
What we'll see is common availability and use of currently available
dual 850/1900 and yet to be produced tri band 850/1900/2100 handsets
(although tri band data cards are now fully available).

> so have been multi-band, seemlessly switching between 900 MHz
> and 1800 MHz as required during a call.
>
>> Meanwhile, my daughter who's on "3" with her 3G phone will
>> not be able to access her 3G network (it roams to Telstra GSM
>> when out of the city area where she has coverage) when she
>> visits us? Conversely when we travel to the big smoke, well
>> Narre Warren Sth, an hour away, will be still have this new 3G
>> coverage, particularly when we go into Melbourne and the
>> 'burbs itself?
>>
>> Why couldn't they simply build ONE network with ONE standard
>> in operation? What's wrong with swapping the GSM service for
>> this new one. Get rid of CDMA and GSM and just go with the one
>> service?
>
> That's what's being proposed for the longer term, although (just
> like now) the different networks will bar access to users of
> SIMs on other networks unless roaming agreements are in place.
>
> John

Kubalister wrote:

> Eh? They won't NEED to be dual band, in fact 850/2100 dual
> band 3GSM handsets will be very hard if not impossible to
> source due to the small market. You'll only need to have an
> 850 capable phone since the 850 band will have coverage
> everywhere that the current CDMA network has which is pretty
> much everywhere. What we'll see is common availability and use
> of currently available dual 850/1900 and yet to be produced
> tri band 850/1900/2100 handsets (although tri band data cards
> are now fully available).

Agreed, tri-band makes more sense, and I avoided reference to
1900 MHz UMTS (as used in the USA) to simplify things.

But I certainly wasn't aware of the intention to roll out a
complete 850 MHz network. Are shopping mall and railway tunnel
microcells included?

John