Sprint says laptop cable is 'stealing'.

I have had Verizon wireless for two years and my contract expired so I
thought I'd take a look at Sprint. I went to the Sprint store in Webster, TX
to look at what they had. I talked to a pretty young lady named Christine
Garza who also gave me her business card.

We discussed plans and looked at phones. I asked her about a cable to
connect the phone to my laptop to use the phone as a wireless modem. I often
check my email now by connecting my Verizon phone to my laptop and calling
my ISP. Christine told me that the phone can access the Internet without my
laptop but I told her I preferred to use it. She then told me that it is
Sprint's view that using a cable to connect a laptop to the Internet was
'stealing'. I asked her by what leap of logic they figured that. I would be
essentially using a wireless phone to call MY ISP. She told me that was
their policy.

1. Either she is seriously misinformed and THAT tells me that if I have a
question I won't be able to get an intelligent answer OR:

2. If Sprint feels that if I use their model phone, I MUST use THEIR
Internet service, or it is STEALING, then I don't think I need to deal with
them.

I told her I'd get back to her.

Is there someone who works for Sprint who might read this and clear this up?

Thanks

---

› See More: Sprint says laptop cable is 'stealing'.

"James R. Brown" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I have had Verizon wireless for two years and my contract expired so I
> thought I'd take a look at Sprint. I went to the Sprint store in Webster,
TX
> to look at what they had. I talked to a pretty young lady named Christine
> Garza who also gave me her business card.
>
> We discussed plans and looked at phones. I asked her about a cable to
> connect the phone to my laptop to use the phone as a wireless modem. I
often
> check my email now by connecting my Verizon phone to my laptop and calling
> my ISP. Christine told me that the phone can access the Internet without
my
> laptop but I told her I preferred to use it. She then told me that it is
> Sprint's view that using a cable to connect a laptop to the Internet was
> 'stealing'. I asked her by what leap of logic they figured that. I would
be
> essentially using a wireless phone to call MY ISP. She told me that was
> their policy.
>
> 1. Either she is seriously misinformed and THAT tells me that if I have a
> question I won't be able to get an intelligent answer OR:
>
> 2. If Sprint feels that if I use their model phone, I MUST use THEIR
> Internet service, or it is STEALING, then I don't think I need to deal
with
> them.
>
> I told her I'd get back to her.
>
> Is there someone who works for Sprint who might read this and clear this
up?
>
> Thanks

I don't work for SPCS, but can offer a bit of advise. First off, that's the
first time I've ever heard of an SPCS call tethering to a laptop as
stealing. Methinks that she didn't want to fully explain their policy, and
just simplified the explanation.

SPCS does mention in their T & C, that tethering your phone to your laptop
is not authorized. They don't want the user to replace their current ISP for
what is offered through Vision, and taking all the bandwidth. Vision is not
priced to act like another ISP @ $20/mo.

In saying that, there are a number of users here who do tether our phones to
our laptops, yours truly included. We use it on a very limited basis,
checking email, sending email and some small surfing on the web. IOW, we
don't use that much bandwidth and are keeping under SPCS's radar.

You didn't mention which phone model you were interested in. Some models
have been reported to have the capability disabled.

If you wanted to use Vision as a full ISP, you can, by using one of their
pcmcia cards, and signing up to one of their data plans.

Bob

"Bob Smith" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> "James R. Brown" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> I have had Verizon wireless for two years and my contract expired so I
>> thought I'd take a look at Sprint. I went to the Sprint store in Webster,
> TX
>> to look at what they had. I talked to a pretty young lady named Christine
>> Garza who also gave me her business card.
>>
>> We discussed plans and looked at phones. I asked her about a cable to
>> connect the phone to my laptop to use the phone as a wireless modem. I
> often
>> check my email now by connecting my Verizon phone to my laptop and
>> calling
>> my ISP. Christine told me that the phone can access the Internet without
> my
>> laptop but I told her I preferred to use it. She then told me that it is
>> Sprint's view that using a cable to connect a laptop to the Internet was
>> 'stealing'. I asked her by what leap of logic they figured that. I would
> be
>> essentially using a wireless phone to call MY ISP. She told me that was
>> their policy.
>>
>> 1. Either she is seriously misinformed and THAT tells me that if I have a
>> question I won't be able to get an intelligent answer OR:
>>
>> 2. If Sprint feels that if I use their model phone, I MUST use THEIR
>> Internet service, or it is STEALING, then I don't think I need to deal
> with
>> them.
>>
>> I told her I'd get back to her.
>>
>> Is there someone who works for Sprint who might read this and clear this
> up?
>>
>> Thanks
>
> I don't work for SPCS, but can offer a bit of advise. First off, that's
> the
> first time I've ever heard of an SPCS call tethering to a laptop as
> stealing. Methinks that she didn't want to fully explain their policy, and
> just simplified the explanation.
>
> SPCS does mention in their T & C, that tethering your phone to your laptop
> is not authorized. They don't want the user to replace their current ISP
> for
> what is offered through Vision, and taking all the bandwidth. Vision is
> not
> priced to act like another ISP @ $20/mo.
>
> In saying that, there are a number of users here who do tether our phones
> to
> our laptops, yours truly included. We use it on a very limited basis,
> checking email, sending email and some small surfing on the web. IOW, we
> don't use that much bandwidth and are keeping under SPCS's radar.
>
> You didn't mention which phone model you were interested in. Some models
> have been reported to have the capability disabled.
>
> If you wanted to use Vision as a full ISP, you can, by using one of their
> pcmcia cards, and signing up to one of their data plans.
>
> Bob
>
>
Thanks for your help.

I am sure Sprint is as good as anyone else so I do not mean to denigrate
them in this criticism: That said, I guess I'll renew my contract with
Verizon. I have never heard any complaint from them about me calling my ISP,
in fact, THEY sold me the cable for the phone to do it. Also, I get free
connection to their Express Network for "minutes only used". I usually use
their network to check my email, but I have to call my ISP to be able to
SEND email.

Since Sprint is trying to steer their customers to some add-on service with
add-on fees then I guess I don't need to go there.

Thanks

James R. Brown wrote:

> I am sure Sprint is as good as anyone else so I do not mean to denigrate
> them in this criticism: That said, I guess I'll renew my contract with
> Verizon. I have never heard any complaint from them about me calling my ISP,
> in fact, THEY sold me the cable for the phone to do it. Also, I get free
> connection to their Express Network for "minutes only used". I usually use
> their network to check my email, but I have to call my ISP to be able to
> SEND email.
>
> Since Sprint is trying to steer their customers to some add-on service with
> add-on fees then I guess I don't need to go there.

James, Verizon is too, they have the same restrictions; they may not enforce
them as heavily.

I think "stealing" is an incredibly stupid way to characterize your desired
usage. The issue is that excessive usage *can* cost a carrier big-time if a
ton of people do it. Internet service providers and other connectivity
providers pay *per byte* for traffic. At the level you're talking about,
with big companies and ISPs and network backbones, there is generally no
such thing as flat-rate access (most likely due to the large amounts of data
involved).

So Sprint won't let you pull large amounts of data, and they won't let you
use a laptop at all unless you get a data card. I was under the impression
that Verizon has the same restrictions, but perhaps you could share your
experience with their policies. I haven't been a Verizon Wireless customer
since June of last year.

--
Steve Sobol, Professional Geek 888-480-4638 PGP: 0xE3AE35ED
Company website: http://JustThe.net/
Personal blog, resume, portfolio: http://SteveSobol.com/
E: [email protected] Snail: 22674 Motnocab Road, Apple Valley, CA 92307

James R. Brown wrote:
> I have had Verizon wireless for two years and my contract expired so I
> thought I'd take a look at Sprint. I went to the Sprint store in Webster, TX
> to look at what they had. I talked to a pretty young lady named Christine
> Garza who also gave me her business card.
>
> We discussed plans and looked at phones. I asked her about a cable to
> connect the phone to my laptop to use the phone as a wireless modem. I often
> check my email now by connecting my Verizon phone to my laptop and calling
> my ISP. Christine told me that the phone can access the Internet without my
> laptop but I told her I preferred to use it. She then told me that it is
> Sprint's view that using a cable to connect a laptop to the Internet was
> 'stealing'. I asked her by what leap of logic they figured that. I would be
> essentially using a wireless phone to call MY ISP. She told me that was
> their policy.
>
> 1. Either she is seriously misinformed and THAT tells me that if I have a
> question I won't be able to get an intelligent answer OR:

Actually, in this case, she was misinformed. You CAN use the phone to
dial up an outisde ISP. However:

1. It will use the old circuit switched data network, at 14.4kbps, and

2. You'll get charged $.39 a minute for the privilege.

You can also hook the cable up to your laptop and use Vision (#777,
username and password are both "web"), and thus get internet at higher
data speeds (typically about 50-70kbps, but this will hopefully ve
faster on an EVDO equipped phone). However, Sprint's TOS does state
that "tethering" - hooking up a phone to a laptop to use it as an
internet connection - is not permitted with the standard $10-$15 Vision
plans.

There's a lapto-specific data plan, but it's $80 a month for unlimited
access, and you have to have a business account.

> 2. If Sprint feels that if I use their model phone, I MUST use THEIR
> Internet service, or it is STEALING, then I don't think I need to deal with
> them.

No, Sprint feels that if you use THEIR internet service for your laptop
without paying the $80/month, then it's stealing.0



--
E-mail fudged to thwart spammers.
Transpose the c's and a's in my e-mail address to reply.

"Steve Sobol" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> James, Verizon is too, they have the same restrictions; they may not
> enforce them as heavily.
>
> I think "stealing" is an incredibly stupid way to characterize your
> desired usage. The issue is that excessive usage *can* cost a carrier
> big-time if a ton of people do it. Internet service providers and other
> connectivity providers pay *per byte* for traffic. At the level you're
> talking about, with big companies and ISPs and network backbones, there is
> generally no such thing as flat-rate access (most likely due to the large
> amounts of data involved).
>
> So Sprint won't let you pull large amounts of data, and they won't let you
> use a laptop at all unless you get a data card. I was under the impression
> that Verizon has the same restrictions, but perhaps you could share your
> experience with their policies. I haven't been a Verizon Wireless customer
> since June of last year.
>
> --
> Steve Sobol, Professional Geek 888-480-4638 PGP: 0xE3AE35ED
> Company website: http://JustThe.net/
> Personal blog, resume, portfolio: http://SteveSobol.com/
> E: [email protected] Snail: 22674 Motnocab Road, Apple Valley, CA 92307

Steve,

Part of my current plan, (which just expired, but is still valid ) is the
use of Verizon's Express Network via my cellphone/laptop for "minutes only
used" which means only the minutes used as in any call. On nights and
weekends it is free like any call.

Now, Verizon started this a couple of years ago. I only found out about it
on Verizon's usenet group. Unfortunately, the reps at the sales places will
only give you dumb looks when you mention it. I had to do my order by phone
and get Express Network added on with some difficulty. However, I was
successful as I have been using it for a couple of years and it is very
useful for checking your email on the road.

I am going to renew my contract and include the Express Network (MOU). If I
am for whatever reason unsuccessful, I will let you know. I might do it this
afternoon and I'll get back to you.

James R. Brown wrote:

> Part of my current plan, (which just expired, but is still valid ) is the
> use of Verizon's Express Network via my cellphone/laptop for "minutes only
> used" which means only the minutes used as in any call. On nights and
> weekends it is free like any call.
>
> Now, Verizon started this a couple of years ago. I only found out about it
> on Verizon's usenet group. Unfortunately, the reps at the sales places will
> only give you dumb looks when you mention it. I had to do my order by phone
> and get Express Network added on with some difficulty. However, I was
> successful as I have been using it for a couple of years and it is very
> useful for checking your email on the road.

Been there, done that, used to use NationalAccess/ExpressNetwork in this way
when I was a VZW customer. You do realize that if you make a lot of data
calls, it ends up costing you money when you pay 25c/minute to 40c/minute
for airtime overages, right?


--
Steve Sobol, Professional Geek 888-480-4638 PGP: 0xE3AE35ED
Company website: http://JustThe.net/
Personal blog, resume, portfolio: http://SteveSobol.com/
E: [email protected] Snail: 22674 Motnocab Road, Apple Valley, CA 92307

"James R. Brown" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
<snipped>


> Thanks for your help.
>
> I am sure Sprint is as good as anyone else so I do not mean to denigrate
> them in this criticism: That said, I guess I'll renew my contract with
> Verizon. I have never heard any complaint from them about me calling my
ISP,
> in fact, THEY sold me the cable for the phone to do it. Also, I get free
> connection to their Express Network for "minutes only used". I usually use
> their network to check my email, but I have to call my ISP to be able to
> SEND email.
>
> Since Sprint is trying to steer their customers to some add-on service
with
> add-on fees then I guess I don't need to go there.

Ahh, I misread your original statement, where you wanted to connect to your
local ISP. SPCS had that on their old 2G phones. It was called Wireless Web
and as you mentioned above, used minutes off the plan.

You wouldn't be able to do that with SPCS now, unless you bought a two year
old SPCS phone, as all current phones through SPCS now are 3 G phones.

Bob

James R. Brown wrote:
> I am sure Sprint is as good as anyone else so I do not mean to denigrate
> them in this criticism: That said, I guess I'll renew my contract with
> Verizon. I have never heard any complaint from them about me calling my ISP,
> in fact, THEY sold me the cable for the phone to do it. Also, I get free
> connection to their Express Network for "minutes only used". I usually use
> their network to check my email, but I have to call my ISP to be able to
> SEND email.
>
> Since Sprint is trying to steer their customers to some add-on service with
> add-on fees then I guess I don't need to go there.

I think you are over-reacting. The fact is that many of us do tether our
Sprint phone to a laptop, and as long as the usage is nominal, Sprint
does nothing to prevent it.
Connecting to your own ISP is not advised since it uses a much slower
speed (9.6kbps) versus the 110kbps I get with Sprint's Vision.
You don't need your ISP to send mail, you can do so with Sprint's
SMTP server.

--
John Richards

"Steve Sobol" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> James R. Brown wrote:
>
>> Part of my current plan, (which just expired, but is still valid ) is the
>> use of Verizon's Express Network via my cellphone/laptop for "minutes
>> only used" which means only the minutes used as in any call. On nights
>> and weekends it is free like any call.
>>
>> Now, Verizon started this a couple of years ago. I only found out about
>> it on Verizon's usenet group. Unfortunately, the reps at the sales places
>> will only give you dumb looks when you mention it. I had to do my order
>> by phone and get Express Network added on with some difficulty. However,
>> I was successful as I have been using it for a couple of years and it is
>> very useful for checking your email on the road.
>
> Been there, done that, used to use NationalAccess/ExpressNetwork in this
> way when I was a VZW customer. You do realize that if you make a lot of
> data calls, it ends up costing you money when you pay 25c/minute to
> 40c/minute for airtime overages, right?
>
>
> --
> Steve Sobol, Professional Geek 888-480-4638 PGP: 0xE3AE35ED
> Company website: http://JustThe.net/
> Personal blog, resume, portfolio: http://SteveSobol.com/
> E: [email protected] Snail: 22674 Motnocab Road, Apple Valley, CA 92307

I only use it to check my email on the road. The point here I believe is
that Verizon has no objection to you using a 'tethered laptop' to access the
Internet whereas I have been informed that with Sprint this is
'unauthorized'. Verizon will cheerfully sell you their Mobile Office Kit for
most of the cellphones they sell. With this kit you do not HAVE to use
Verizon's Express Network (their Internet). The kit comes with a USB
connector cable for the phone as well as a device driver so your laptop can
recognize the wireless modem capability of the phone. It also comes with
software that allows you to convert a regular dialup connection to your ISP
into a Wireless connection. This essentially allows you to connect to your
ISP for nothing more than the minutes you are online. The connection to a
dialup ISP is only 14.4 (their Express Network is much faster.) but I find
this adequate just to check or send email. Type your email off-line,
connect, then send and you are on line for only a minute or so. You can do
this without signing up for Verizon's regular wireless service (Express
Network.) This was all I wanted to do with Sprint and that was what the
young lady said according to Sprint was 'stealing'.

James R. Brown wrote:
> "Steve Sobol" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>
>>James R. Brown wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Part of my current plan, (which just expired, but is still valid ) is the
>>>use of Verizon's Express Network via my cellphone/laptop for "minutes
>>>only used" which means only the minutes used as in any call. On nights
>>>and weekends it is free like any call.
>>>
>>>Now, Verizon started this a couple of years ago. I only found out about
>>>it on Verizon's usenet group. Unfortunately, the reps at the sales places
>>>will only give you dumb looks when you mention it. I had to do my order
>>>by phone and get Express Network added on with some difficulty. However,
>>>I was successful as I have been using it for a couple of years and it is
>>>very useful for checking your email on the road.
>>
>>Been there, done that, used to use NationalAccess/ExpressNetwork in this
>>way when I was a VZW customer. You do realize that if you make a lot of
>>data calls, it ends up costing you money when you pay 25c/minute to
>>40c/minute for airtime overages, right?
>>
>>
>>--
>>Steve Sobol, Professional Geek 888-480-4638 PGP: 0xE3AE35ED
>>Company website: http://JustThe.net/
>>Personal blog, resume, portfolio: http://SteveSobol.com/
>>E: [email protected] Snail: 22674 Motnocab Road, Apple Valley, CA 92307
>
>
> I only use it to check my email on the road. The point here I believe is
> that Verizon has no objection to you using a 'tethered laptop'

Well, I checked

http://myturl.com/001JY (links to VZW's publically available Customer
Agreement)

for my zip code, 92307, and it doesn't say anything either way. I could have
sworn VZW had a similar restriction, but it wouldn't be the first time I was
wrong about something.

> Internet whereas I have been informed that with Sprint this is
> 'unauthorized'. Verizon will cheerfully sell you their Mobile Office Kit for
> most of the cellphones they sell. With this kit you do not HAVE to use
> Verizon's Express Network (their Internet). The kit comes with a USB
> connector cable for the phone as well as a device driver so your laptop can
> recognize the wireless modem capability of the phone.

I remember them stocking several in the stores when all they had was
Quick2Net at 14.4K. I don't remember seeing them since then, but I wasn't
looking.

> Network.) This was all I wanted to do with Sprint and that was what the
> young lady said according to Sprint was 'stealing'.

There are other options, but they involve checking from the phone using a
PCS Vision application, IIRC. Don't know if you want to type long emails
with a phone keypad.

--
Steve Sobol, Professional Geek 888-480-4638 PGP: 0xE3AE35ED
Company website: http://JustThe.net/
Personal blog, resume, portfolio: http://SteveSobol.com/
E: [email protected] Snail: 22674 Motnocab Road, Apple Valley, CA 92307

On Wed, 27 Jul 2005 17:42:50 GMT, "Bob Smith"
>If you wanted to use Vision as a full ISP, you can, by using one of their
>pcmcia cards, and signing up to one of their data plans.

I don't think you need to buy the PCMCIA card anymore. A few months
ago, I got the following response from Sprint customer service:

<quote ON>
Yes, you can now use your vision device as a modem. You will be glad
to hear that since December 20, 2004, we have started offering
following data plans, so that our customers can use their vision phone
as a modem:
$40.00 MRC- 20 MB
$60.00 MRC- 40 MB
$55.00 MRC - 50 MB
$80.00 MRC- 300 MB
The above mentioned plans are free for first three months, so that our
customers can enjoy the facility. That means you can purchase a vision
device and can use it as a modem by adding the data plan of your
choice. After activating your vision device, you can write to us to
add the data plans.
<quote OFF>

I haven't tried to add one of these plans, so I don't know if it
actually works. I could not find this add-on mentioned on the
website, but that doesn't mean much. Unfortunately, as of late, it
seems that Sprint is asking their phone vendors to disable the modem
feature...

Joe Huber
[email protected]

On Wed, 27 Jul 2005 15:35:28 -0400, Isaiah Beard
<[email protected]> wrote:

<snip>

I ran into this same problem with Sprint.

I've seen vendors at computer shows using credit card authorization
boxes that dialin via cellphone to their bank for processing. A
simple application of using a cell phone as a modem if I've ever seen
it.

I wanted to do something similar with my Sprint Nokia phone and my
laptop when I'm on-call and have to check on some servers. Since some
of the locations I go to don't have land-line service available, (ie:
visiting family who only use cell phones.)

This should have been a simple dialup connection using the cell as a
modem...

NOPE... Sprint disabled that functionality for my phone, even though
the Nokia model my phone is based on has that capability from the
factory.

Needless to say I was quite angry with Sprint as those Nokia data
cables don't come cheap and the amount of data I would be sending
would be trivial (2-3 minute connection at most.)
And that's only once a month!

Is it too much to ask for a little flexibility?
Bruno

Bruno
<email spoofed; just remove the spam in the address>

Bruno wrote:

> I wanted to do something similar with my Sprint Nokia phone and my
> laptop when I'm on-call and have to check on some servers. Since some
> of the locations I go to don't have land-line service available, (ie:
> visiting family who only use cell phones.)

It used to be that you could only do this with analog cell phones
(apparently, the boxes themselves did some kind of encryption). Don't know
if it's still true.

> NOPE... Sprint disabled that functionality for my phone, even though
> the Nokia model my phone is based on has that capability from the
> factory.
>
> Needless to say I was quite angry with Sprint as those Nokia data
> cables don't come cheap and the amount of data I would be sending
> would be trivial (2-3 minute connection at most.)
> And that's only once a month!
>
> Is it too much to ask for a little flexibility?

Did you check that the capability was enabled in the Sprint phone before you
bought it, instead of assuming it was?

--
Steve Sobol, Professional Geek 888-480-4638 PGP: 0xE3AE35ED
Company website: http://JustThe.net/
Personal blog, resume, portfolio: http://SteveSobol.com/
E: [email protected] Snail: 22674 Motnocab Road, Apple Valley, CA 92307

On Wed, 27 Jul 2005 21:14:28 -0700, Steve Sobol <[email protected]>
wrote:

>Bruno wrote:
>> I wanted to do something similar with my Sprint Nokia phone and my
>> laptop when I'm on-call and have to check on some servers. Since some
>> of the locations I go to don't have land-line service available, (ie:
>> visiting family who only use cell phones.)
>
>It used to be that you could only do this with analog cell phones
>(apparently, the boxes themselves did some kind of encryption). Don't know
>if it's still true.
Not sure about this either. I mean what happens when you dial a
land-line? The endpoint is analog (unless you use Vonage/VOIP) but
what's the difference between that and an analog modem?

>> NOPE... Sprint disabled that functionality for my phone, even though
>> the Nokia model my phone is based on has that capability from the
>> factory.
>>
>> Needless to say I was quite angry with Sprint as those Nokia data
>> cables don't come cheap and the amount of data I would be sending
>> would be trivial (2-3 minute connection at most.)
>> And that's only once a month!
>>
>> Is it too much to ask for a little flexibility?
>
>Did you check that the capability was enabled in the Sprint phone before you
>bought it, instead of assuming it was?

This was after I had the phone for a while. SPRINT would give out no
information about it when I was researching trying to use the phone as
a modem. I went with NOKIA's information and only learned after
trying to connect that it wasn't supported with SPRINT's model because
of their firmware/customizations.

I'm not excusing that I should have done more research, I'm
complaining that it's simple functionality that should be enabled by
default. I don't buy products to have functionality disabled, I want
capability in the things I buy.
What purpose does it serve to turn this functionality off? I mean I'm
using airtime on their network that I paid for every month. Who gives
a hoot if it's VOICE on a digital connection or (slow) DATA over said
line. I'm still using the same bandwidth, the same airtime. Don't it
seem like it's just a ploy to force me, the customer, to buy a more
expensive service that I just won't use? Frankly, I think that's
unethical. It does nothing but antagonize the customer.

BTW: I read you're posts about you're WireFly experience and we
decided to go with them for our new phones. They should arrive
tomorrow. WireFly rocks! Thanks for sharing you're experience.

B


Bruno
<email spoofed; just remove the spam in the address>