all cingular towers not available for AT&T blue customer

> I don't want to spend any more money than the next person on telephones,
> but please don't get upset when a provider does not give you first class
> support for an obsolete service. Plus, stop kidding yourself on, Cingular
> could if they wish simply turn your service off and tell you to get a new
> contract. It is like asking Microsoft to continue supporting Windows 3.1,
> because you don't want to spend money on XP.
>

But they have NOT stopped offering that "obsolete service," and they
continue cheerfully accepting customer payments each month. They have an
obligation to those customers.

But Cingular are experts at arm-twisting, and that is why millions of us
have left them, and are not looking back.

---

› See More: all cingular towers not available for AT&T blue customer

"Austinman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
>>
>> But they have NOT stopped offering that "obsolete service," and they
>> continue cheerfully accepting customer payments each month. They have an
>> obligation to those customers.
>>
>> But Cingular are experts at arm-twisting, and that is why millions of us
>> have left them, and are not looking back.
>>
> I am tired of hearing how millions of people are leaving Cingular, because
> they are the evil capitalist pigs who try to screw every penny they can
> out of customers. I am betting I can go onto any forum that discusses a
> large corporations products, or services and I will hear similar stories.
> Companies are not perfect and they are never going to please 100% of the
> people 100% of the time. There are things I find annoying with Cingular,
> such as data plans that make no sense and limited 3G coverage, but when I
> look at Verizon (Bluetooth connectivity, expensive data plans) and Sprint
> (expensive data plans, f*** ugly phones (in my opinion)) they too have
> similar issues.
>
> As to your comment that Cingular has an obligation to AT&T blue customers,
> I agree with you. My point is that if there is a limited resource, such as
> a faulty base station, that can only accept a limited number of calls,
> then the Cingular customer who has a contract and is paying more for the
> service should have a higher priority for the resource. Take this argument
> to its conclusion and I would lose service in preference to someone who
> pays for more minutes. I would not be happy, but I would have to live with
> it and so should AT&T blue customers. If they find this unacceptable then
> either get a new Cingular/GSM contract, or sign up with one of the other
> providers. As for people who are upset that older technologies are no
> longer supported, get over it. They turned the analog systems off in
> Europe years ago. Customers had no choice, but to buy new phones and
> service. It boggles my mind that this is still an issue in one of the most
> technologically advanced nations in the world (No 3G on the iPhone! Makes
> an engineer want to weep). I do understand that GSM coverage is poor in
> some areas of the country, which is why my step son stays with Verizon.
> His phone works on his grandparents farm, mine doesn't.
>
> I do disagree with your thinking that the service is not obsolete.
> Cingular continues to support users of the AT&T blue plans by accepting
> payment and giving them access to the cellular infrastructure.If the user
> discontinues (stops paying) the service for a month and then tries to have
> it reestablished they will not be able to. In my book that is pretty
> obsolete. I have the same problem. I get 500 minutes for a nice price, but
> the plan no longer exists, so I prefer not to change. Does it annoy me
> that I would have to pay more for the same service, yes. On a personal
> note I have just renewed my contract with Cingular. I did look at the
> other service providers and they did not offer anything that made me want
> to switch. Maybe it is a case of 'better the devil you know' :-)
>

You are entitled to side with Cingular. But the fact remains that a lot of
us have flipped 'em the Bird and have taken our business elsewhere,
primarily because of what we perceived to be Cingular's attitude of contempt
for us.

See my other post about a retiree that they tried to screw over fraudulent
call charges--until the press found out about it. They credited his account
in full then. The scorned customer said he has no plans to return to
Cingular.

Now, I realize that every carrier has disgruntled customers, but there seems
to be a culture of contempt at Cingular--one that I never experienced in my
years with AT&T Wireless. AT&T Wireless reps never talked down to me,
whereas Cingular's reps always did.

Anyway I left and I'm happy now--and the irony of it all is that the carrier
that has proven so satisfactory to me--Sprint--has a reputation in the
industry for lousy customer service. Based on my own experience with them,
one would never know it. And my calls go through, they are crystal-clear,
and the rates are cheaper than what I formerly paid for the same 3 lines.
Last year Sprint installed a mini-tower array on an apartment building 2
blocks away from my home, and I always get 5-bars of signal strength.

So, in my case, WHO was it that "raised the bar?" It sure wasn't Cingular!
Go figure . . .

"Austinman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
>
> As to your comment that Cingular has an obligation to AT&T blue customers,
> I agree with you. My point is that if there is a limited resource, such as
> a faulty base station, that can only accept a limited number of calls,
> then the Cingular customer who has a contract and is paying more for the
> service should have a higher priority for the resource.


I think you miss an important point:

ATTWS customers were merged into Cingular. They are not "foreign" or
"roamers." If they were paying less for GSM service, Cingular was
well-aware of that when they purchased those customers.

Your characterizing them as having some kind of second-class status is
inappropriate.

And I don't think that Cingular's refusal to give good service to former
ATTWS customers is in any way connected with the need to ration service.
Cingular continues to advertise to attract new customers.

Cingular has been trying to armtwist ATTWS customers into accepting
higher-cost plans. In my view, their tactics are unethical. If they don't
want to provide the service they should not take the customers' money.

At 29 Jan 2007 19:36:57 +0000 jeremy wrote:


> I think you miss an important point:
>
> ATTWS customers were merged into Cingular. They are not "foreign" or
> "roamers."

In a way, they were- in many markets Cingular and AT&T were competitors-
Cingular, in many cases, "bought" customers who had already elected NOT
to use Cingular, but one of it's competitors!

> If they were paying less for GSM service, Cingular was
> well-aware of that when they purchased those customers.

Cingular's only obligation to AT&T customers was to fulfill AT&T's
contracts with those customers, because they bought those CONTRACTS- they
didn't buy customers. Any customer out of contract was free to leave
Cingular- likewise Cingular was free to cancel their AT&T service rates,
coverage and plans.

> Your characterizing them as having some kind of second-class status is
> inappropriate.

Those out of contracts, sadly, had the same status with Cingular as new
customers or non-customers, if Cingular chose to treat them that way.

> And I don't think that Cingular's refusal to give good service to
> former
> ATTWS customers is in any way connected with the need to ration
> service.


Yes and no- Cingular turned off a lot of TDMA capacity to increase GSM
capacity. Those TDMA customers (both Cingular and AT&T) got the shaft,
but the difference was Cingular's TDMA customers, as a rule, didn' have
the giveaway rate plans grandfathered AT&T customers did, so the
transition to GSM wasn't as painful. To AT&T customers on $15 and $20
plans, $39.99 looked like a screwing.

> Cingular continues to advertise to attract new customers.

Yes, new customers who are offered rate plans starting at $39.99.

>
> Cingular has been trying to armtwist ATTWS customers into accepting
> higher-cost plans. In my view, their tactics are unethical. If they
> don't
> want to provide the service they should not take the customers' money.


True. But Cingular is offering a choice- crappy TDMA service at $15, $20
or whatever AT&T gave them at the going-out-of-business fire sale to keep
them, switch to a more reiable service at current rates, or find another
provider.

Again, I'm not saying it was the best way to handle it, but it was one way.

Would you have preferred a letter saying "Welcome to Cingular. You have
30 days to sign up for new Cingular service and buy a new phone before
your current AT&T service becomes inoperative."? Because, frankly, that
was another way to handle it.

You are forgetting, BTW, a group of AT&T customers who made out like
bandits- those who signed up on the original GSM charter plans- my cousin
in Providence, for example, gets unlimited GSM service from Cingular for
$99/month. Cingular honored his original AT&T GSM charter plan and still
does, as long as he doesn't do anything to change his service (like buy a
subsidized Cingular phone.) He buys unlocked phones if he needs or wants
a new one, and he claims he uses about 4000-5000 daytime minutes a
month for $99. (It's his business phone.)

He benefited from the merger with expanded coverage (both the blue and
orange networks) and isn't treated "second class" because he isn't a
legacy TDMA customer, and his rate plan brings Cingular's ARPU up instead
of down.

In fact, all AT&T GSM customers were able to keep their plans, AFAIK,
unless/until they upgraded to Cingular phones. It's really only the AT&T
TDMA customers with increadibly cheap grandfathered rate plans who got
the shaft, and they don't really number in the "millions."

Do I sympathize? Yes. Would I have done it differently were I Cingular?
Probably. Was Cingular "wrong" from a bean-counting business
perspective? Probably not.

"Todd Allcock" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> Cingular's only obligation to AT&T customers was to fulfill AT&T's
> contracts with those customers, because they bought those CONTRACTS- they
> didn't buy customers. Any customer out of contract was free to leave
> Cingular- likewise Cingular was free to cancel their AT&T service rates,
> coverage and plans.
>

Where do you come up with such stuff?

ATTWS customers always had the right to continue with their contractual
terms after the contract term was fulfilled, under the grandfathering
provision. Cingular was most certainly not allowed to dump them. That much
was promised by both companies prior to the buyout.

We were told that we would not have the rug pulled out from under us--and
Cingular did, in fact, honor the rate plans. But they deliberately reduced
the level of reliability of the service, in an effort to coerce us into
abandoning our existing rate plans and sign up as though we were new
customers.

This merger/buyout had to pass muster before numerous regulatory bodies
before it was finally cleared. Your characterization of it being simply
that Cingular had to honor the existing ATTWS contracts until their terms
expired is woefully inaccurate.

Cingular promised what the regulators wanted, then they did as they pleased.
I think it was ruthless. Fortunately there are other providers to serve us,
but I still think this was a public relations blunder for Cingular. Perhaps
they thought it would all be forgotten. But they keep on taking advantage
of their customers even now, as demonstrated by their unwillingness to
credit that Florida retiree for thousands of dollars in fraudulent calls to
Central America. What jerks!

"Austinman" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> But they keep on taking advantage
>>>of their customers even now, as demonstrated by their unwillingness to
>>>credit that Florida retiree for thousands of dollars in fraudulent calls
>>>to
>>>Central America. What jerks!
>>
>> Total nonsense. Grow up, get a life, and stop trolling here.
>>
>
> Thanks to, Todd and John for responding. It appears to me, Jeremy that the
> story of one retiree and your own experience makes Cingular the worst
> service provider in the world. No one is saying Cingular is perfect, but
> they seem to be meeting the contractual obligations to their customers.
> Mistakes are made by all companies, but I do not believe for one moment
> that someone at Cingular is driving a deliberate policy of ripping
> customers off. The responses you have received here have been, in my
> opinion, balanced. Your interpretation of our comments is, to put it
> mildly, skewed. This makes it difficult to have a balanced and productive
> discussion.
>
> As you are now a Sprint customer I do have to wonder why you keep on
> posting on Cingular/ATTWS newsgroups. In general it appears there are a
> minority of people who have nothing better to do except provoke other
> people (Yes, troll). I took a moment to read the Sprintpcs group and what
> do I find, someone bad mouthing Sprint and telling everyone how happy they
> are to be with Cingular.
>
> Time for dinner :-)
>

It is not just "my story." Published articles have noted that millions of
former ATTWS customers have either complained of arm-twisting or have left.

I intend to continue the campaign to make people aware of Cingular's
tactics. The Internet is empowering in that way.

Enjoy your dinner.

John Navas <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:


>
> Actually a great waste of time. What you're doing has no measurable
> effect other than to make yourself look childish and silly and to
> annoy others.
>



The voice of experience speaks.

"Scott" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> John Navas <[email protected]> wrote in
> news:[email protected]:
>
>
>>
>> Actually a great waste of time. What you're doing has no measurable
>> effect other than to make yourself look childish and silly and to
>> annoy others.
>>
>
>
>
> The voice of experience speaks.


He can killfile me if my posts disturb him. I intend to periodically tell
my story for the benefit of current and potential Cingular customers. I
don't think it is "silly" to expose when companies exploit their customers.
Those that are considering staying with or becoming Cingular customers are
perfectly free to make their own decisions and to ignore my input.

There is nothing off-topic or inflammatory about my describing my experience
with the Almighty Cingular. Navas just gets upset whenever anyone
criticizes his pet cellular service. And, to tell the truth, that doesn't
affect me in the least.

"Kevin K" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:KIRoJuEXw9g9-pn2-rOXWfddl9fwd@localhost...
> It just sounds like, to many people here, that you are still trying to
> convince yourself that you made the correct choice while you wait for
> your contract to run out.

You may make of my posts what you will. I have no need to seek approval or
reassurance over my switching out of Cingular--especially from total
strangers, none of whom I am ever likely to meet. But if that is what you
want to think, be my guest.