Orange OVP upgrade quotes not all the same?

Jon wrote:
.....
>> phone(s) anyway?
>
> Nothing, but your new SIM will kick in eventually, like it or not.
>
>> Actually I tried it already and it works fine.
>
> It will do for now.
I don't believe any of this. Do you have any evidence to back it up?
How long is "eventually" 1 week, 1 month, 1 year?
I believe they don't even record the number of the sim they send you.
They can't activate a new sim if its not in a phone and you tell them
the imei.
I'll be hanging onto the new sims anyway. So in the event you are
correct, no problem. I'll will report back in a month.

---

› See More: Orange OVP upgrade quotes not all the same?

[email protected] declared for all the world to hear...
> I don't believe any of this.

Your choice.

> Do you have any evidence to back it up?

Yes.

> How long is "eventually" 1 week, 1 month, 1 year?

A fortnight.

> I believe they don't even record the number of the sim they send you.

The upgrades teams do not, however your paired SIM can be accessed from
your IMEI.

> They can't activate a new sim if its not in a phone and you tell them
> the imei.

Yes, they can.

> I'll be hanging onto the new sims anyway. So in the event you are
> correct, no problem. I'll will report back in a month.

Ok.
--
Regards
Jon

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Jon <[email protected]> wrote:

>
>> They can't activate a new sim if its not in a phone and you tell them
>> the imei.
>
> Yes, they can.
>
HOW? They might *initiate* an activation - but the SIM ain't going to
receive it if it's sitting in a drawer minding its own business!

The crucial question is whether they will de-activate the old SIM *before*
getting confirmation that the new SIM has received the activation update
message. With both our phones, the old SIMs stopped working at about the
same time that the new ones were activated - but I'm not sure of the exact
order in which things happened.
--
Cheers,
Tim
______
Please reply to newsgroup. Reply address is invalid.

On Sat, 26 Nov 2005 14:25:52 -0000, "Tiscali Tim" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>The crucial question is whether they will de-activate the old SIM *before*
>getting confirmation that the new SIM has received the activation update

From experience. Some months ago I obtained an upgrade on Orange but
was called to make a trip away for one month at short notice.
Fortunately the phone I took away with me was on another account.

When I returned home, the old SIM card on the upgrade account had been
deactivated but the new SIM card did not work, although it seemed to
log onto the Orange network. I rang Orange to apologise and explain
why I hadn't registered and they 'resent' the SIM updates that made it
all fine again.

This seems to support what Jon is saying.


Wiggy.

WigWag wrote:
....
>
> This seems to support what Jon is saying.
>
>
> Wiggy.
Oh dear, I didn't make a note of which order number goes with which OVP
number and the Orange paperwork
doesn't give you a clue either..

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
OldBill <[email protected]> wrote:

> WigWag wrote:
> ...
>>
>> This seems to support what Jon is saying.
>>
>>
>> Wiggy.
> Oh dear, I didn't make a note of which order number goes with which
> OVP number and the Orange paperwork
> doesn't give you a clue either..

The delivery notes which we got with the phones have got the phone number
listed under 'Item' - where it says '07970xxxxxx 24 HRS DEL' on ours, at any
rate.

It's not too obvious that it *is* a phone number!

--
Cheers,
Tim
______
Please reply to newsgroup. Reply address is invalid.

WigWag wrote:
....
>
> This seems to support what Jon is saying.
>
>
> Wiggy.
Oh dear, I didn't make a note of which order number goes with which OVP
number and the Orange paperwork doesn't give you a clue either..

...err, yes it does but I mixed up the sims. I called 'em and it doesn't
matter. I tell 'em which number I want on which sim. They didn't want
the imei of a phone. Obviously I'll only register 3 of my 4 new sims.

[email protected] declared for all the world to hear...
> >> They can't activate a new sim if its not in a phone and you tell them
> >> the imei.

> > Yes, they can.

> HOW?

A particular system the name of which begins with "S" (but the full name
of it I am not sure) keeps track of SIMs and paired IMEIs.

> They might *initiate* an activation - but the SIM ain't going to
> receive it if it's sitting in a drawer minding its own business!

The old SIM is disconnected and the new SIM becomes active, weather or
not it's actually in the phone.

> The crucial question is whether they will de-activate the old SIM *before*
> getting confirmation that the new SIM has received the activation update
> message.

They will.

> With both our phones, the old SIMs stopped working at about the
> same time that the new ones were activated - but I'm not sure of the exact
> order in which things happened.

The changeover is almost simultaneous if all is well with the network.
--
Regards
Jon

[email protected] declared for all the world to hear...
> Oh dear, I didn't make a note of which order number goes with which OVP
> number and the Orange paperwork doesn't give you a clue either..

Doesn't matter - Orange know which goes with which.

> ..err, yes it does but I mixed up the sims. I called 'em and it doesn't
> matter. I tell 'em which number I want on which sim. They didn't want
> the imei of a phone. Obviously I'll only register 3 of my 4 new sims.

And when the 4th one activates itself your massive upgrade fee will
surely hit your account.
--
Regards
Jon

In an earlier contribution to this discussion,
Jon <[email protected]> wrote:

>
>> They might *initiate* an activation - but the SIM ain't going to
>> receive it if it's sitting in a drawer minding its own business!
>
> The old SIM is disconnected and the new SIM becomes active, whether or
> not it's actually in the phone.
>
That doesn't stack up with something in a post yesterday. The poster was out
of the country for a while, fitted the new SIM on return - and it didn't
work until Orange had been asked to re-send the update. AIUI, in order to
become active, the information stored on the SIM has to be updated. How can
that happen if it's not in a phone?!
--
Cheers,
Tim
______
Please reply to newsgroup. Reply address is invalid.

[email protected] declared for all the world to hear...
> > The old SIM is disconnected and the new SIM becomes active, whether or
> > not it's actually in the phone.

> That doesn't stack up with something in a post yesterday. The poster was out
> of the country for a while, fitted the new SIM on return - and it didn't
> work until Orange had been asked to re-send the update.

SIM updates like any other text message will expire after 7 days. The
poster you refer to would have been able to make and receive calls but
not been able to do things like send text messages or speed-dial
voicemail etc.

> AIUI, in order to
> become active, the information stored on the SIM has to be updated.

That's not quite true. The SIM updates enable functionality which is off
by default, e.g. GPRS, speed-dial 1 for voicemail, your own number etc.
--
Regards
Jon

On Sun, 27 Nov 2005 09:57:35 -0000, "Tiscali Tim" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>The poster was out
>of the country for a while, fitted the new SIM on return - and it didn't
>work until Orange had been asked to re-send the update.

That will be because the SMS sent expired after a week, so wasn't
retried any more.

>AIUI, in order to
>become active, the information stored on the SIM has to be updated.

I am not convinced that this is the case. GSM systems that don't have
the ability to update sims at all still seem to work OK.

I think it's some foible of the Orange management platform which
demands a sim update every time a change is made, and refuses to
proceed unless that SMS is reported as delivered.

>How can
>that happen if it's not in a phone?!

It can't.

--

Iain
the out-of-date hairydog guide to mobile phones
http://www.hairydog.co.uk/cell1.html
Browse now while stocks last!

Jon wrote:
> [email protected] declared for all the world to hear...
> > > The old SIM is disconnected and the new SIM becomes active, whether or
> > > not it's actually in the phone.
>
> > That doesn't stack up with something in a post yesterday. The poster was out
> > of the country for a while, fitted the new SIM on return - and it didn't
> > work until Orange had been asked to re-send the update.
>
> SIM updates like any other text message will expire after 7 days. The
> poster you refer to would have been able to make and receive calls but
> not been able to do things like send text messages or speed-dial
> voicemail etc.
>
> > AIUI, in order to
> > become active, the information stored on the SIM has to be updated.
>
> That's not quite true. The SIM updates enable functionality which is off
> by default, e.g. GPRS, speed-dial 1 for voicemail, your own number etc.

Yes Orange Customer services tried to convince me that a SIM update
would allow the Time & Cost menu on my k300i to reappear. I got two SIM
updates and it didn't obviously. I tried to tell them that Orange has
customised it wrongly but he's getting back to me on that!!!

P
> --
> Regards
> Jon

On Sun, 27 Nov 2005 11:12:54 -0000, Jon <[email protected]>
wrote:

>SIM updates like any other text message will expire after 7 days. The
>poster you refer to would have been able to make and receive calls but
>not been able to do things like send text messages or speed-dial
>voicemail etc.

I was that poster! Yes, the phone appeared to be connected to the
network, although I didn't try to make a call because as usual my life
was hectic and spinning by at a rate of knotts. I tried a text message
which failed and I could not access the answer phone. I must admit
that I didn't try to manually enter either the message centre or
voicemail numbers.

As I mentioned, a quick phone call and a SIM update brought things up
to what I considered 'normal'.

HTH.

Wiggy.

[email protected] declared for all the world to hear...
> Yes Orange Customer services tried to convince me that a SIM update
> would allow the Time & Cost menu on my k300i to reappear. I got two SIM
> updates and it didn't obviously. I tried to tell them that Orange has
> customised it wrongly but he's getting back to me on that!!!

The cost feature will never work, Orange do not support it.

Come to think of it I don't think any UK networks do.
--
Regards
Jon