Nokia N91, why?

I recently got the N91 on a vodafone contract and was wondering if
anyone else suffered the same problems as me:

- Photo gallery takes several minutes to open, even when it's empty?!

- Phone takes upto a minute to switch on

- Phone freezes, seems to be random, whether its answeing calls or
opening a menu it will just crash and then the only way to reset it is
by removing the battery.

- Battery life, incredible! How did they get away with those battery
life figures when I can only get a day's use out of mine and thats on
standby with full network coverage.

- Wireless LAN, can only be used to surf the net? I could not find a
way to transfer any files so its useless IMO.


Needless to say I returned the phone and got a sony ericsson, never
again will I buy a Nokia after this phone.

---

› See More: Nokia N91, why?

On 9 Aug 2006 04:38:03 -0700, "Rob" <[email protected]> wrote:

>I recently got the N91 on a vodafone contract and was wondering if
>anyone else suffered the same problems as me:
>
>- Photo gallery takes several minutes to open, even when it's empty?!
>
>- Phone takes upto a minute to switch on
>
>- Phone freezes, seems to be random, whether its answeing calls or
>opening a menu it will just crash and then the only way to reset it is
>by removing the battery.
>
>- Battery life, incredible! How did they get away with those battery
>life figures when I can only get a day's use out of mine and thats on
>standby with full network coverage.
>
>- Wireless LAN, can only be used to surf the net? I could not find a
>way to transfer any files so its useless IMO.
>
>
>Needless to say I returned the phone and got a sony ericsson, never
>again will I buy a Nokia after this phone.

Your experience of the N91 is similar to mine with the N70. What a
pile of xxxx. I hadn't had a Nokia for ages and was not at all
impressed by this symbian phone. Mine went straight back - first time
I'd returned a phone.

Like wise I now have the SE K800i - which is not without its faults
but is superior in every way to the N70.

Moonshine wrote:

> Your experience of the N91 is similar to mine with the N70.

I was hoping this new N-range would bring Nokia back up to their good
old days, but when I tried an N70 I was disappointed. The -- quite
frankly, shocking -- delay between me asking it to create a new text
message [using the right-hand shortcut key under the screen] and it
actually doing it, put me off considering any of the range.

"Bobbo" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
> Moonshine wrote:
>
>> Your experience of the N91 is similar to mine with the N70.
>
> I was hoping this new N-range would bring Nokia back up to their good
> old days, but when I tried an N70 I was disappointed. The -- quite
> frankly, shocking -- delay between me asking it to create a new text
> message [using the right-hand shortcut key under the screen] and it
> actually doing it, put me off considering any of the range.

Nokia use old technological component circuitary in their products, to save
cash. As you'll have noticed, the k800i is much better as an all-rounder.
Shame it's not symbian, but hey.

On 9 Aug 2006 04:38:03 -0700, "Rob" <[email protected]> wrote:

>I recently got the N91 on a vodafone contract and was wondering if
>anyone else suffered the same problems as me:
>

I have it on Vodafone too.

>- Photo gallery takes several minutes to open, even when it's empty?!
>

Yep but after it has built the indexes (first time gallery is run) it
opens the gallery quickly.

>- Phone takes upto a minute to switch on
>

Yes. Guess it has lots to load. Simple answer, don't turn it off.

>- Phone freezes, seems to be random, whether its answeing calls or
>opening a menu it will just crash and then the only way to reset it is
>by removing the battery.
>

Never had mine freeze. Rebooted itself a couple of times though.
No problems at all since I updated firmware (nokia service centre).
Proper Nokia firmware. Vodafone crap removed.

>- Battery life, incredible! How did they get away with those battery
>life figures when I can only get a day's use out of mine and thats on
>standby with full network coverage.
>

Yes. I have 2 spare batteries.
I get a couple of days at least out of a battery if I just use it as a
phone. Music, email web browsing etc use up power.

>- Wireless LAN, can only be used to surf the net? I could not find a
>way to transfer any files so its useless IMO.
>

Cable is best to transfer files. More than happy with transfer rates
and I use it daily at work (to replace usb flash drive).

>
>Needless to say I returned the phone and got a sony ericsson, never
>again will I buy a Nokia after this phone.

I am happy with mine. Maybe you should have tried getting a firmware
update first.
N91. The best mobile music device there is.

--
PajaP

PajaP wrote:

> >- Phone freezes, seems to be random, whether its answeing calls or
> >opening a menu it will just crash and then the only way to reset it is
> >by removing the battery.
> >
>
> Never had mine freeze. Rebooted itself a couple of times though.
> No problems at all since I updated firmware (nokia service centre).
> Proper Nokia firmware. Vodafone crap removed.

Why oh why do operators insist on adding their own buggy softare to the
mix. OK, so they want to brand the phone. I don't own an N91 and don't
have experience of its software, but I guess they also want to give the
user an incentive to use their handset for data transfer over the
network as well.

However the best incentive to do anything like this is to have a
handset that doesn't screw up. If operators really want to add software
it should be as perfect as possible. But they won't manage anything
like that so they should stick to adding branded wallpaper and some
splash screens for diaplay on power on/off and leave the software to
the handset manufacturer. Not of course that they can necessarily get
things right either, but I give them a better chance of so doing.

> Nokia use old technological component circuitary in their products,

Proof and sources ?

Dave

On 9 Aug 2006 17:43:12 -0700, "Mizter T" <[email protected]> wrote:

>Why oh why do operators insist on adding their own buggy softare to the
>mix. OK, so they want to brand the phone. I don't own an N91 and don't
>have experience of its software, but I guess they also want to give the
>user an incentive to use their handset for data transfer over the
>network as well.
>

In fairness, the software on the N91 more amounts to a bit of branding
and all the Vodafone Live stuff. Most of the branding is easy enough
to remove manually.
Not anywhere near as bad as Orange when they used to use the 'Home
Screen' and not allow it to be turned off. I believe they have stopped
this practice now?

>However the best incentive to do anything like this is to have a
>handset that doesn't screw up. If operators really want to add software
>it should be as perfect as possible. But they won't manage anything
>like that so they should stick to adding branded wallpaper and some
>splash screens for diaplay on power on/off and leave the software to
>the handset manufacturer. Not of course that they can necessarily get
>things right either, but I give them a better chance of so doing.

I would have thought that the handset manufacturers do design the
software on behalf of the Operator?
It does seem to introduce more possibilities of the phone screwing up
though.

More annoying on the Vodafone N91 is the external branding.
I wish there was a way to remove this without damaging the case.
I am considering trying some paint stripper on it.

--
PajaP

>
> >- Phone takes upto a minute to switch on

> Yes. Guess it has lots to load. Simple answer, don't turn it off.

I think your missing the point. What with the battery life being so
rubbish sometimes you have to turn it off to save juice!
>
> >- Phone freezes, seems to be random, whether its answeing calls or
> >opening a menu it will just crash and then the only way to reset it is
> >by removing the battery.
> >
>
> Never had mine freeze. Rebooted itself a couple of times though.
> No problems at all since I updated firmware (nokia service centre).
> Proper Nokia firmware. Vodafone crap removed.

So you have to go to the trouble of updating your firmware in a Nokia
service center? Do you not think that the phone should work from when
you get it? Well done for finding a service center btw...
>
> >- Battery life, incredible! How did they get away with those battery
> >life figures when I can only get a day's use out of mine and thats on
> >standby with full network coverage.
> >
>
> Yes. I have 2 spare batteries.
> I get a couple of days at least out of a battery if I just use it as a
> phone. Music, email web browsing etc use up power.

Why should you need to buy another battery though?

> >- Wireless LAN, can only be used to surf the net? I could not find a
> >way to transfer any files so its useless IMO.

> Cable is best to transfer files. More than happy with transfer rates
> and I use it daily at work (to replace usb flash drive).

Not really dealing with the crappy Wireless issue though huh?

> >Needless to say I returned the phone and got a sony ericsson, never
> >again will I buy a Nokia after this phone.

> I am happy with mine. Maybe you should have tried getting a firmware
> update first.
> N91. The best mobile music device there is.

Bollox! As a music device the Nokia's don't hold a candle to either the
SE Walkman range or the Motorola Rokr and V3's.

Nokia have lost it. Nothing works and they don't care about their
customers. Long live Sony Ericsson!

On 10 Aug 2006 01:25:35 -0700, "Schtop!" <[email protected]>
wrote:

>I think your missing the point. What with the battery life being so
>rubbish sometimes you have to turn it off to save juice!

Not missing the point at all. Turn it off and wait for it to switch on
or don't turn it off and recharge it. 30-60 seconds to boot. Not
exactly an age is it?

>So you have to go to the trouble of updating your firmware in a Nokia
>service center? Do you not think that the phone should work from when
>you get it? Well done for finding a service center btw...

It is no trouble to update the firmware and the phone did work from
when I got it.
I also updated the firmware on my PC motherboard, DVD drive and video
card. Updated the firmware in my digital camera. Same for my KISS
network DivX player, my Laptop, printer and set-top box. The list
could go on.
I regularly update the software on my computer along with the hardware
drivers. The list could go on.
Service centres are easy to find. Nokia list them on their site.
It is free to update if the phone has a problem. If you have no
problem there is nothing to stop you saying there is one.

>> Yes. I have 2 spare batteries.
>> I get a couple of days at least out of a battery if I just use it as a
>> phone. Music, email web browsing etc use up power.
>
>Why should you need to buy another battery though?
>

I have a spare battery for all my phones, not just my N91.
I have a spare battery for my digital camera, camcorder and laptop.

>> Cable is best to transfer files. More than happy with transfer rates
>> and I use it daily at work (to replace usb flash drive).
>
>Not really dealing with the crappy Wireless issue though huh?
>

IMO all wireless is crap. What is on the N91 is a good implementation
of a crap system. They do not advertise it as supporting wireless file
sharing. If I chose to use it for its intended purpose, wireless
access to the web and email, it works as it should.

>> N91. The best mobile music device there is.
>
>Bollox! As a music device the Nokia's don't hold a candle to either the
>SE Walkman range or the Motorola Rokr and V3's.
>

That is your opinion. Most review sites tend to disagree with you.
What file types do the SE Walkman etc support? As many as the N91?
Do they have a proprietary audio jack?
Standard usb/connectivity leads for transferring files?

--
PajaP

PajaP wrote:

> On 10 Aug 2006 01:25:35 -0700, "Schtop!" <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
> It is no trouble to update the firmware and the phone did work from
> when I got it.
> I also updated the firmware on my PC motherboard, DVD drive and video
> card. Updated the firmware in my digital camera. Same for my KISS
> network DivX player, my Laptop, printer and set-top box. The list
> could go on.
> I regularly update the software on my computer along with the hardware
> drivers. The list could go on.

I had this issue with my 6600. I'm hardly a power user -- I make
calls, I take pictures, I send and receive SMS/MMS and that's about it
-- but found that it crashed every now and again. My friend said his
did that but stopped when he upgraded the firmware, but I shouldn't
have to do this for a highly consumer orientated device like a mobile
phone to just work normally. This is the result of a combination of
poor engineering and poor testing.

I've never had to update the firmware on my motherboard, digital
camera, printer, Gene Simmons, etc. So there seems to be two
categories of device out there:
1. Things you have to update just to make them work properly
2. Things that just work

> I have a spare battery for all my phones, not just my N91.

I don't believe you should have to carry spare batteries for modern
mobile phones - a colleague of mine has Treo and the battery lasts
about 10 days.

> IMO all wireless is crap. What is on the N91 is a good implementation
> of a crap system. They do not advertise it as supporting wireless file
> sharing. If I chose to use it for its intended purpose, wireless
> access to the web and email, it works as it should.

Whether or not you are a wireless fan, it's a reasonably established
technology and devices which advertise that they support it should
behave in a certain way, i.e. exactly the same as if you'd plugged a
wire into them. When I got my laptop out of its box, it spotted that I
had a wireless network and asked me the password, then after that it
worked like you'd expect any networked device to work.

On 11 Aug 2006 02:01:45 -0700, "Bobbo" <[email protected]> wrote:

>I've never had to update the firmware on my motherboard, digital
>camera, printer, Gene Simmons, etc.

Then you are missing out on bug fixes and new features because they
_will_ have firmware updates available for them.

>> I have a spare battery for all my phones, not just my N91.
>
>I don't believe you should have to carry spare batteries for modern
>mobile phones - a colleague of mine has Treo and the battery lasts
>about 10 days.
>

Well by your definition Treo's are "Things you have to update just to
make them work properly" and you "shouldn't have to do this for a
highly consumer orientated device like a mobile phone to just work
normally".

Like _all_ mobile phones they have bugs that are fixed by updating the
firmware.

http://mytreo.net/treofaq/FirmwareIntro

--
PajaP

On Wed, 09 Aug 2006 14:32:47 GMT, Moonshine <[email protected]>
wrote:

>Your experience of the N91 is similar to mine with the N70. What a
>pile of xxxx. I hadn't had a Nokia for ages and was not at all
>impressed by this symbian phone. Mine went straight back - first time
>I'd returned a phone.

.... and our experience with the awful 6680, though we sold ours on
ebay and went back to our ancient Motorolas. True s**t of the
smelliest kind, never again.

The worst part with the 6680 was that unless you removed the battery
every few days (repeated on two phones), it would start to get slower
and clunker (and it was one of the slowest and clunkyest phones I've
used in 18 years of mobile ownership).

Maybe Nokia have a problem with firmware testing?

Rgds
Jonathan

On Wed, 09 Aug 2006 23:45:13 +0100, PajaP <[email protected]>
wrote:

>>- Phone takes upto a minute to switch on
>
>Yes. Guess it has lots to load. Simple answer, don't turn it off.

ROFL. I wonder what the world would be like if that was proposed as a
solution to a similar fault on, say, a stereo system.

>>- Wireless LAN, can only be used to surf the net? I could not find a
>>way to transfer any files so its useless IMO.
>>
>
>Cable is best to transfer files. More than happy with transfer rates
>and I use it daily at work (to replace usb flash drive).

So what's the point of including WiFi then if it can't actually be
used for anything useful. It may just be another reason why the
battery life is so shockingly poor?

>>Needless to say I returned the phone and got a sony ericsson, never
>>again will I buy a Nokia after this phone.
>
>I am happy with mine. Maybe you should have tried getting a firmware
>update first.

Any product that requires a firmware update out of the box, just to
perform it's supplied function is IMHO not fit for purpose.

>N91. The best mobile music device there is.

Shame it's no use as a phone though.

Rgds
Jonathan

On Thu, 10 Aug 2006 18:54:28 +0100, PajaP <[email protected]>
wrote:

>Not missing the point at all. Turn it off and wait for it to switch on
>or don't turn it off and recharge it. 30-60 seconds to boot. Not
>exactly an age is it?

Spoken as someone who's obviously never had to move regularly to and
from areas where mobile phones are best left off (not just on silent).
If I had to wait 30-60 seconds every time I turn my phone on I often
wouldn't bother with it.

>It is no trouble to update the firmware and the phone did work from
>when I got it.

I went through hell last year trying to get my brand new 6680 updated
(in the hope it would resolve the usability issues), including costs
of petrol, parking etc and many hours of wasted time, it must of cost
me much more than the unconnected price of the phone. That's the
reward you get for buying Nokia, they don't appear to give a ****
about their customers and if you go out of your way to try and help
resolve THEIR issues, you're the one who loses out.

My advice now is that if a phone doesn't do what it should out of the
box return it as unfit right away, don't mess around with firmware
updates etc trying to solve someone elses problem at your expense.

>I also updated the firmware on my PC motherboard, DVD drive and video
>card. Updated the firmware in my digital camera. Same for my KISS
>network DivX player, my Laptop, printer and set-top box. The list
>could go on.

You're a brave man. If any of those updates failed claiming under
warranty would be a really pain if possible at all. I only update
firmware on such things if recommended by the manufacturers own
support (so there's some comeback) or if I'm trying to breath new life
in to old junk (such as a processor upgrade that requires new
firmware). IMHO to do otherwise is foolhardy unless you regard the
equipment as valueless.

>I regularly update the software on my computer along with the hardware
>drivers. The list could go on.

That's not the same as firmware. PC operating systems and software can
relatively easily be reinstalled if all goes wrong. If a firmware
update fails, usually the only option is a return to manufacturer.
This may be chargeable, or on older equipment may not even be possible
at all leaving you with nothing but a paperweight.

>Service centres are easy to find. Nokia list them on their site.
>It is free to update if the phone has a problem. If you have no
>problem there is nothing to stop you saying there is one.

They may be easy to find, but getting to them costs real time and
money. You should not have to pay for someone elses problem.

If I buy a HiFi, I don't expect to have to return it to the shop two
days later for an "upgrade".

>>Why should you need to buy another battery though?
>
>I have a spare battery for all my phones, not just my N91.
>I have a spare battery for my digital camera, camcorder and laptop.

I think the point is that the battery life was much worse than
claimed.

>>Bollox! As a music device the Nokia's don't hold a candle to either the
>>SE Walkman range or the Motorola Rokr and V3's.
>
>That is your opinion. Most review sites tend to disagree with you.

I'll agree with him. Even the V3x is miles better than any Nokia I've
got for mp3 playback. Having said that I still don't get the point, I
mean I want a great phone and a great music player. Why would I want
one device that does both very badly?

Rgds
Jonathan