Cancelled Contract - Return Phone

Hi

Phone bought form Vodafone store for £150.
£150 refund given at store managers discretion.
Vodafone have screwed up my billing every single month resulting in my
having to contact them numerous times on each occasion to get the bill
corrected.
They have given me various freebies as a result of their errors (free
TV, free data and sms, extended 75% discount line rental etc).
All very nice but the hassles of having to contact them each month
(because they have tried to charge me for TV or not applied the 75%
discount etc) has really pissed me off and stressed me out.
I have told them I want to cancel the contract.
I do not want to pay the charges to the end of my contract
They have agreed to this. Exact wording:

"Having shown your email records to my manager she has agreed to
cancel your account with no penalties attached, all I need you to do
is return the hand set".

OK so far so good but I want to keep the phone. I want to keep it
without giving Vodafone any more money.
In a following email they have said I have to return it or pay them
£410.

"The full handset price would be required if you wish to keep it.
The cost of the Nokia N91 would be £410. Alternatively the handset
would need to be returned in it's original condition packaged in the
original packaging and accessories that went with it."

Now the way I read the first email is returning the handset is not a
requirement. I can also see nothing in my contract that states I need
to do this (the contract appears to be for airtime only). They "need"
me to return the handset. Does not state it is a requirement of
canceling my contract (at least how I read it).

I want rid of Vodafone. I want to keep the phone. I don't want to pay
Vodafone any money. They have caused me enough stress, inconvenience
and wasted time without my paying them for the privilege.

I have been emailing the CEO? (Arun Sarin) and Vodafone Stoke Customer
Relations but they are adamant I must pay for or return the handset.

I am prepared (and already expect to have to) to take this to court if
they do not relent.

Thoughts?

--
Many thanks
PajaP

---

› See More: Cancelled Contract - Return Phone

>
> "Having shown your email records to my manager she has agreed to
> cancel your account with no penalties attached, all I need you to do
> is return the hand set".
>
> Now the way I read the first email is returning the handset is not a
> requirement. I can also see nothing in my contract that states I need
> to do this (the contract appears to be for airtime only). They "need"
> me to return the handset. Does not state it is a requirement of
> canceling my contract (at least how I read it).

How can you translate the words "all I need you to do is to return the
handset" into you get a free phone?

Granted, you seem to have had an absolute mare with voda and do warrant the
contract been cancelled, no arguments there.

But, you are definatly taking the pee to expect to keep the phone.

Voda are prepared to re-instate your position before you had the contract to
the position you were before you signed. That position was you were not
contracted to pay them money for services and you were NOT in the posesion
of a shiney new phone.

Cut your losses and run.

Of course, you could ask for compensation in the form of a free phone for
all the troubles but dont hold your breath.

Steve

"PajaP" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news[email protected]...
> Hi
>
> I want to keep the phone. I don't want to pay
> Vodafone any money.
>
> Thoughts?
>
> --
> Many thanks
> PajaP

That's all it comes down to! Far too many customers like that around.

On Fri, 27 Oct 2006 22:03:29 +0100, "pete" <[email protected]> wrote:

>
>"PajaP" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news[email protected]...

>> I want to keep the phone. I don't want to pay
>> Vodafone any money.
>>

>
>That's all it comes down to! Far too many customers like that around.
>

What? far too many that don't let themselves be screwed.

On Fri, 27 Oct 2006 20:26:45 GMT, "Steve" <[email protected]> wrote:

>>
>> "Having shown your email records to my manager she has agreed to
>> cancel your account with no penalties attached, all I need you to do
>> is return the hand set".
>>
>> Now the way I read the first email is returning the handset is not a
>> requirement. I can also see nothing in my contract that states I need
>> to do this (the contract appears to be for airtime only). They "need"
>> me to return the handset. Does not state it is a requirement of
>> canceling my contract (at least how I read it).
>
>How can you translate the words "all I need you to do is to return the
>handset" into you get a free phone?
>

Free? Maybe some more details.
I don't see it as being a free phone (though as I have paid no money
directly for it...).
I have spent a total of over 4 hours on the phone to them. Nearly 100
hundred emails. This has taken many hours of my free time.Time to me
is money, if it ain't pleasure.
On many occasions I also had to contact them as they were sending
numerous spam (advert) emails to my phone on a daily basis. This was
almost from immediately I first turned the phone on. Each time I
contacted them they said they would stop sending them. Still they
arrived. Again more of my free time lost.
In the end I had to get them to change the number (which they did for
free). They claim they do not understand how they were arriving on my
phone. Their was nothing on their system that could be sending them.
But they were all advertising Vodafone services. All from numbers that
they admitted were from their systems.
As a result of the number change I had to reprint all my stationary at
my own expense. Not a great amount but enough for me to be pissed. I
also had to let all my contacts know of my new phone number. Again
eating into my free time (and expense as not covered by any
free/inclusive text bundle at the time).

I don't see the phone as being free. I see it as compensation.
I also do not see the phone as being part of the contract.
My contract was for the airtime. The deal I negotiated in the store
should not come into it. The phone was separate. No contract involved.
My contract with Vodafone does not mention the phone. Just airtime.

>Granted, you seem to have had an absolute mare with voda and do warrant the
>contract been cancelled, no arguments there.
>
>But, you are definatly taking the pee to expect to keep the phone.
>

Maybe it could be interpreted that way. What if the £150 in store had
not been refunded to me by the manager? Would they be deducting this
off the £410? What about the money I have already paid them for ****e
service. Should this not come off the £410?
Who knows? but somehow I doubt it.

>Voda are prepared to re-instate your position before you had the contract to
>the position you were before you signed. That position was you were not
>contracted to pay them money for services and you were NOT in the posesion
>of a shiney new phone.
>

Not quite. I will be without a phone. I sold my old phone at a loss.
This is on top of stationary and other costs.
They promised me something they could not deliver.
If they had kept their end of the bargain I would be happy.

>Cut your losses and run.
>

Never

>Of course, you could ask for compensation in the form of a free phone for
>all the troubles but dont hold your breath.
>

I think they will give up before I do.
And the more time I spend on this, the more determined I become.

Thanks for the feedback

--
PajaP

"PajaP" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Fri, 27 Oct 2006 20:26:45 GMT, "Steve" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>>
>>> "Having shown your email records to my manager she has agreed to
>>> cancel your account with no penalties attached, all I need you to do
>>> is return the hand set".
>>>
>>> Now the way I read the first email is returning the handset is not a
>>> requirement. I can also see nothing in my contract that states I need
>>> to do this (the contract appears to be for airtime only). They "need"
>>> me to return the handset. Does not state it is a requirement of
>>> canceling my contract (at least how I read it).
>>
>>How can you translate the words "all I need you to do is to return the
>>handset" into you get a free phone?
>>
>
> Free? Maybe some more details.
> I don't see it as being a free phone (though as I have paid no money
> directly for it...).
> I have spent a total of over 4 hours on the phone to them. Nearly 100
> hundred emails. This has taken many hours of my free time.Time to me
> is money, if it ain't pleasure.
> On many occasions I also had to contact them as they were sending
> numerous spam (advert) emails to my phone on a daily basis. This was
> almost from immediately I first turned the phone on. Each time I
> contacted them they said they would stop sending them. Still they
> arrived. Again more of my free time lost.
> In the end I had to get them to change the number (which they did for
> free). They claim they do not understand how they were arriving on my
> phone. Their was nothing on their system that could be sending them.
> But they were all advertising Vodafone services. All from numbers that
> they admitted were from their systems.
> As a result of the number change I had to reprint all my stationary at
> my own expense. Not a great amount but enough for me to be pissed. I
> also had to let all my contacts know of my new phone number. Again
> eating into my free time (and expense as not covered by any
> free/inclusive text bundle at the time).
>
> I don't see the phone as being free. I see it as compensation.
> I also do not see the phone as being part of the contract.
> My contract was for the airtime. The deal I negotiated in the store
> should not come into it. The phone was separate. No contract involved.
> My contract with Vodafone does not mention the phone. Just airtime.

It is rocky ground I believe when you end up with a free phone from day one.
If I understand correctly, you were supposed to pay £150 but you managed to
get it for free? Since you never paid for the phone itself... well, it gets
a bit shady, I think. You don't have a sales contract for the phone
itself..

>
>>Granted, you seem to have had an absolute mare with voda and do warrant
>>the
>>contract been cancelled, no arguments there.
>>
>>But, you are definatly taking the pee to expect to keep the phone.
>>
>
> Maybe it could be interpreted that way. What if the £150 in store had
> not been refunded to me by the manager? Would they be deducting this
> off the £410? What about the money I have already paid them for ****e
> service. Should this not come off the £410?
> Who knows? but somehow I doubt it.

Nothing in their T&Cs really says that you 'deserve' compensation for the
crappy service, with regard to what happened to you. Even then you did get
it - freebies and such (which, admittedly they consequently screwed up).

--
Sue

"Sprite" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
>
>> I don't see the phone as being free. I see it as compensation.
>> I also do not see the phone as being part of the contract.
>> My contract was for the airtime. The deal I negotiated in the store
>> should not come into it. The phone was separate. No contract involved.
>> My contract with Vodafone does not mention the phone. Just airtime.
>
> It is rocky ground I believe when you end up with a free phone from day
> one. If I understand correctly, you were supposed to pay £150 but you
> managed to get it for free? Since you never paid for the phone itself...
> well, it gets a bit shady, I think. You don't have a sales contract for
> the phone itself..

Hmm, thinking about it.

Do you have any record of 'purchase' of the phone? An invoice, even if the
phone is marked as free? I just upgraded and I did get an invoice with the
phone even though the handset was free on it, but I'm sure my having that
invoice effectively says that I 'purchased' the phone, even though it was
for £0.00? Thus that is the contract?

You can't have it all ways - you can't say that your contract with Vodafone
is for the airtime and not the phone and thus cancelling the airtime
agreement means a free phone... I mean, your problem is with the airtime -
all the issues you had - spamming, incorrect billing etc., not the phone,
which I assume works perfectly well. Yes, you have managed to get out of the
airtime contract with Vodafone but why should they let you keep a high-end
handset at their expense?

You'll be without a phone, yes. But what service do you intend to use with
the N91? Why not just take out another contract elsewhere?

Meh.. ah well, I'm a shop manager myself. The amount of people we get who
want to get free stuff is ridiculous - take the woman who came back and said
that her USB Memory Stick had 'mysteriously stopped working' and she
demanded a refund. It was, of course, soaking wet.

--
Sue

On Sat, 28 Oct 2006 09:52:12 +0100, "Sprite"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>
>"Sprite" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>news:[email protected]...
>>
>> It is rocky ground I believe when you end up with a free phone from day
>> one. If I understand correctly, you were supposed to pay £150 but you
>> managed to get it for free? Since you never paid for the phone itself...
>> well, it gets a bit shady, I think. You don't have a sales contract for
>> the phone itself..
>
>Hmm, thinking about it.
>
>Do you have any record of 'purchase' of the phone? An invoice, even if the
>phone is marked as free? I just upgraded and I did get an invoice with the
>phone even though the handset was free on it, but I'm sure my having that
>invoice effectively says that I 'purchased' the phone, even though it was
>for £0.00? Thus that is the contract?
>

I have the store receipt which has:

Nokia N91 £150.00
Various lines with contract, sim details....... (no prices associated
with them)
Managers Discretion -£150.00
Total £0.00

>You can't have it all ways - you can't say that your contract with Vodafone
>is for the airtime and not the phone and thus cancelling the airtime
>agreement means a free phone... I mean, your problem is with the airtime -
>all the issues you had - spamming, incorrect billing etc., not the phone,
>which I assume works perfectly well. Yes, you have managed to get out of the
>airtime contract with Vodafone but why should they let you keep a high-end
>handset at their expense?
>

I see this but Vodafone have had some money off me over the last 6
months. I have had a service that I have barely used (maybe 10 minutes
a month out of the allocated 350) because I was so pissed at them.
All I have had is time, trouble, stress and expense.
Why should Vodafone be the only ones to gain out of this. Why should I
lose out. If I (and people in general) do not make a stand what is
there to make them (Vodafone and other companies with poor service)
improve?
They should lose any rights to the phone (though I still say it was
_given_ to me for free at the time I purchased the airtime). Admit
they were in the wrong and put it down to experience.

They admit they have made errors. Continued to make errors after
promising me they were fixed. I just checked my account and it has a
£10 charge for TV still for this months bill. On the 16 October, in
reply to my initial query about this, Emma Pilgrim of Vodafone
customer relations said she had removed this charge (not would remove,
but had removeD). It is till there. So is she a liar? Incompetent?
Whatever it has resulted in costing me more time and stress.
I have had to email them again. I expect there will be a few more days
of emailing them before it is resolved. Just in time for the next bill
to come in wrong. I expect some smart arse at Vodafone will email me
again saying the TV is not free and asking me to send them a copy of
my contract. Yep this has happened. They have accused me of lying
about my contract. Surely they should know the details of my contract.
Note this is just a typical bill. I have not had a correct bill yet
and each one takes several email and phone calls before it is
corrected.

They made the screwups so why should I give them my time for free?

If I return the phone (which I still see as being my property) I have
to make alternative arrangements for copying and then storing the data
that it contains.
Spend time emailing other companies getting the software transferred
to another phone.
Why should I be made to do this because Vodafone are incompetent?

>You'll be without a phone, yes. But what service do you intend to use with
>the N91? Why not just take out another contract elsewhere?
>

Well I thought I might use a PAYG sim for a while.

>Meh.. ah well, I'm a shop manager myself. The amount of people we get who
>want to get free stuff is ridiculous - take the woman who came back and said
>that her USB Memory Stick had 'mysteriously stopped working' and she
>demanded a refund. It was, of course, soaking wet.

LOL, I am not that bad.
But if something does not work I will take it back, every time.
If a service is bad I will complain, every time.
I can forgive and forget occasional bad service but not the level I
have received from Vodafone.

Thanks for taking the time to reply.
It is appreciated.

Replies so far have nearly persuaded me to just return the phone but I
just don't see why Vodafone should get away with treating a customer
so badly. I don't think they have any legal right to the phone.
If they can show me a legal agreement that I have to return the phone
then I will do so (this I have told them).

--
Thanks
PajaP

"PajaP" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Sat, 28 Oct 2006 09:52:12 +0100, "Sprite"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Sprite" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>news:[email protected]...
>>>
>>> It is rocky ground I believe when you end up with a free phone from day
>>> one. If I understand correctly, you were supposed to pay £150 but you
>>> managed to get it for free? Since you never paid for the phone
>>> itself...
>>> well, it gets a bit shady, I think. You don't have a sales contract for
>>> the phone itself..
>>
>>Hmm, thinking about it.
>>
>>Do you have any record of 'purchase' of the phone? An invoice, even if
>>the
>>phone is marked as free? I just upgraded and I did get an invoice with
>>the
>>phone even though the handset was free on it, but I'm sure my having that
>>invoice effectively says that I 'purchased' the phone, even though it was
>>for £0.00? Thus that is the contract?
>>
>
> I have the store receipt which has:
>
> Nokia N91 £150.00
> Various lines with contract, sim details....... (no prices associated
> with them)
> Managers Discretion -£150.00
> Total £0.00
>
>>You can't have it all ways - you can't say that your contract with
>>Vodafone
>>is for the airtime and not the phone and thus cancelling the airtime
>>agreement means a free phone... I mean, your problem is with the airtime -
>>all the issues you had - spamming, incorrect billing etc., not the phone,
>>which I assume works perfectly well. Yes, you have managed to get out of
>>the
>>airtime contract with Vodafone but why should they let you keep a high-end
>>handset at their expense?
>>
>
> I see this but Vodafone have had some money off me over the last 6
> months. I have had a service that I have barely used (maybe 10 minutes
> a month out of the allocated 350) because I was so pissed at them.

That's your decision though - they provided a service but it was your
decision not to use it to its potential.

> All I have had is time, trouble, stress and expense.
> Why should Vodafone be the only ones to gain out of this. Why should I
> lose out. If I (and people in general) do not make a stand what is
> there to make them (Vodafone and other companies with poor service)
> improve?

Personally though, I've found Vodafone to be the best service provider to
date that I have used. I was impressed with their shop service and their
dedication to finding me a tariff that suited my needs. I've been impressed
with services like Passport and Stop the Clock and the flexibility I had
with regard to changing my tariff (can do it a bit earlier than other
networks) and never had a problem myself with billing. I decide to leave
after a totally uninspiring upgrade offer and a rude customer service rep
and a few days later they make me an offer I can't refuse...

The idea is that you pay Vodafone for a service. You received that service,
though it was messed up, and they offered compensation for those errors.
They have agreed to let you cancel the contract early and pay no fee (again,
consider this compensation perhaps, because ordinarily you sign a contract
and have to pay the full amount regardless...). How long has this saga been
going on? Why should Vodafone lose £410 to you?

> They should lose any rights to the phone (though I still say it was
> _given_ to me for free at the time I purchased the airtime). Admit
> they were in the wrong and put it down to experience.

They admitted they were wrong by offering compensation in your contract and
allowing you to cancel early. There is no reason that they should lose any
rights to the phone, IMO.

> They admit they have made errors. Continued to make errors after
> promising me they were fixed. I just checked my account and it has a
> £10 charge for TV still for this months bill. On the 16 October, in
> reply to my initial query about this, Emma Pilgrim of Vodafone
> customer relations said she had removed this charge (not would remove,
> but had removeD). It is till there. So is she a liar? Incompetent?
> Whatever it has resulted in costing me more time and stress.
> I have had to email them again. I expect there will be a few more days
> of emailing them before it is resolved. Just in time for the next bill
> to come in wrong. I expect some smart arse at Vodafone will email me
> again saying the TV is not free and asking me to send them a copy of
> my contract. Yep this has happened. They have accused me of lying
> about my contract. Surely they should know the details of my contract.
> Note this is just a typical bill. I have not had a correct bill yet
> and each one takes several email and phone calls before it is
> corrected.
>
> They made the screwups so why should I give them my time for free?

But the screwups were on the contract. There is no fault with the phone.
They have no obligation to give it to you for free or anything like that.


> If I return the phone (which I still see as being my property) I have
> to make alternative arrangements for copying and then storing the data
> that it contains.

Quite how you see it as your property bemuses me... the handsets are
subsidised. It becomes your property at the end of the contract. Until
then you are only 'borrowing' it or 'renting' it or something like that.
The phone is Vodafone's property until the contract is completed, which it
will not be, hence, it is their property.

I suppose you could perhaps argue that if you pay for the phone over the
course of 12 months effectively, I don't know the legal ins and outs of
ownership with regard to this but, you could say you have paid a certain
amount toward a phone you are not keeping? Maybe you would be entitled to
some compensation there? Just a theory..

> Spend time emailing other companies getting the software transferred
> to another phone.
> Why should I be made to do this because Vodafone are incompetent?
>
>>You'll be without a phone, yes. But what service do you intend to use
>>with
>>the N91? Why not just take out another contract elsewhere?
>>
>
> Well I thought I might use a PAYG sim for a while.
>
>>Meh.. ah well, I'm a shop manager myself. The amount of people we get who
>>want to get free stuff is ridiculous - take the woman who came back and
>>said
>>that her USB Memory Stick had 'mysteriously stopped working' and she
>>demanded a refund. It was, of course, soaking wet.
>
> LOL, I am not that bad.
> But if something does not work I will take it back, every time.
> If a service is bad I will complain, every time.
> I can forgive and forget occasional bad service but not the level I
> have received from Vodafone.
>
> Thanks for taking the time to reply.
> It is appreciated.
>
> Replies so far have nearly persuaded me to just return the phone but I
> just don't see why Vodafone should get away with treating a customer
> so badly. I don't think they have any legal right to the phone.
> If they can show me a legal agreement that I have to return the phone
> then I will do so (this I have told them).

You need to get them to send you or show you something that proves that they
own the phone. AFAIK, you don't own it until the end of a contract which
you won't reach :\

--
Sue

[email protected]lid declared for all the world to hear...
> OK so far so good but I want to keep the phone. I want to keep it
> without giving Vodafone any more money.

Tough. You can't have your cake and eat it.


> In a following email they have said I have to return it or pay them
> £410.
>
> "The full handset price would be required if you wish to keep it.
> The cost of the Nokia N91 would be £410. Alternatively the handset
> would need to be returned in it's original condition packaged in the
> original packaging and accessories that went with it."
>
> Now the way I read the first email is returning the handset is not a
> requirement. I can also see nothing in my contract that states I need
> to do this (the contract appears to be for airtime only). They "need"
> me to return the handset. Does not state it is a requirement of
> canceling my contract (at least how I read it).

There's nothing in the contract which says you can cancel it. They are
offering you a way out with terms attached. Take it or leave it.

> I want rid of Vodafone. I want to keep the phone.

You sound like a petulant child. Give the phone back and walk away from
your contract or carry on with it, that is the choice you have to make.

> I am prepared (and already expect to have to) to take this to court if
> they do not relent.
>
> Thoughts?

You would lose.
--
Regards
Jon

On Sat, 28 Oct 2006 11:21:02 +0100, "Sprite"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>How long has this saga been
>going on? Why should Vodafone lose £410 to you?

6 months. Not had a correct bill yet.
This they admit (after initially accusing me of lying about the
contract terms).
They do not lose £410. They sold me the phone for £150. They chose the
price. The store manger waived this £150 at his discretion. They were
expecting me to keep the contract for 18 months. They have admitted to
messing up my account and have said they will end the contract early
with no penalty. The way I see it they have no right to claim
ownership of my phone. That is a penalty!

>They admitted they were wrong by offering compensation in your contract and
>allowing you to cancel early. There is no reason that they should lose any
>rights to the phone, IMO.

I have the store receipt that shows my ownership of the phone.
When Vodafone can show me a contract the phone is theirs they can have
it back.

>But the screwups were on the contract. There is no fault with the phone.
>They have no obligation to give it to you for free or anything like that.

There is nothing in the contract that states there are allowed to be
screwups in the billing. Plenty about providing me with service but
owing to the nature of mobile telecommunications it is impossible to
provide a fault free service. IMO this does not cover billing
screwups.
There have been times during my contract when I have not had service.
I accept this.

>Quite how you see it as your property bemuses me... the handsets are
>subsidised. It becomes your property at the end of the contract. Until
>then you are only 'borrowing' it or 'renting' it or something like that.
>The phone is Vodafone's property until the contract is completed, which it
>will not be, hence, it is their property.


Nope, nothing in the contract about me borrowing or renting it.
Nothing about it being Vodafone's phone. In fact the contract is quite
the opposite:

1) Definitions
b) you or your means the customer named on the order form

3) The services
a) we aim to connect 'your' mobile device.....
d) when 'your' mobile device is connected....

And plenty more lines referring to the phone as being mine. Nothing
that states it is Vodafone's. Nothing that states it is loaned, hired,
borrowed or is only mine once the contract is completed.

The only physical thing they claim ownership of in the contract is the
sim card. They can have this back.

>You need to get them to send you or show you something that proves that they
>own the phone. AFAIK, you don't own it until the end of a contract which
>you won't reach :\

The end of the contract is reached when they end it.
They have ended it. They have sent me a PAC. Though they screwed this
up by saying it expired the day before they sent it. Obviously a typo
but I still had to email them to confirm this. Which they did.
The contract ends when I use the PAC.

I can find nothing anywhere that states the phone is not mine already
and from day 1.
I have a sales receipt for the phone.
They have a legal right to make me pay for the air time contract.
They have waived this right by sending me the PAC and stating I can
leave without penalty. They have no legal right to the phone.
Unless they can prove otherwise.

--
Thanks
PajaP

On Sat, 28 Oct 2006 11:29:57 +0100, Jon <[email protected]>
wrote:

>There's nothing in the contract which says you can cancel it. They are
>offering you a way out with terms attached. Take it or leave it.
>

Yes there is.
8) Ending of this agreement.
Lots of lines here that I will have to pay the full term of the
contract. Nothing about returning MY phone.

They have agreed to end the contract without penalty. Asking me to
send them MY property is a penalty.

>You sound like a petulant child.

Name calling. Tut tut. And I am the child?
Not a child. Just someone with the balls to not give in to a large
corporation that thinks it can screw its customer and get away with it
without penalty.

>> I am prepared (and already expect to have to) to take this to court if
>> they do not relent.
>>
>> Thoughts?
>
>You would lose.

We will see!

--
thanks
PajaP

On Sat, 28 Oct 2006 11:21:02 +0100, "Sprite"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>Personally though, I've found Vodafone to be the best service provider to
>date that I have used. I was impressed with their shop service and their
>dedication to finding me a tariff that suited my needs. I've been impressed
>with services like Passport and Stop the Clock and the flexibility I had
>with regard to changing my tariff (can do it a bit earlier than other
>networks) and never had a problem myself with billing. I decide to leave
>after a totally uninspiring upgrade offer and a rude customer service rep
>and a few days later they make me an offer I can't refuse...
>

I would add that as telephony service I was happy with Vodafone also.
I have not posted here with the intention of lambasting Vodafone's
telephony services.
More to gather opinion on peoples opinion on phone ownership.
It is their billing system I have a gripe with and customer services
to some extent.

I have found their TV offering to be far superior quality to the
orange TV service.
I get better network reception with Vodafone than I do with any other
operators. In really old buildings with thick walls my Vodafone phone
still has a strong signal, long after Orange and other networks have
given up. 3G coverage is good and speed acceptable.

I was happy with my tariff and the additional features they added as
compensation.
I would still be willing to stay if they had not continually messed up
my bills. I was considering moving other contracts to Vodafone (though
obviously I won't be now).

To me though, the hassles with contacting them continuously to resolve
billing issues were too much.

--
PajaP

On Sat, 28 Oct 2006 12:31:03 +0100, PajaP <[email protected]>
wrote:

>>> I am prepared (and already expect to have to) to take this to court if
>>> they do not relent.
>>>
>>> Thoughts?
>>
>>You would lose.
>
>We will see!

I think Vodafone have bent over backwards to accommodate you, and that
you should return the phone. After all, they have refunded the cost of
it to you. You are trying to get something for nothing, whatever way
you look at it, I would consider it stealing.

Of course you may feel they have stolen your time and energy through
billing mistakes, but that's though luck at the end of the day -
unless there's something in the contract to accommodate you.

--
http://www.unimobiles.com | http://www.unlockyourphone.co.uk
UK Specialists in Refurbished Mobile Phones & Accessories

PajaP wrote:
> On Sat, 28 Oct 2006 11:29:57 +0100, Jon <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
>> There's nothing in the contract which says you can cancel it. They are
>> offering you a way out with terms attached. Take it or leave it.
>>
>
> Yes there is.
> 8) Ending of this agreement.
> Lots of lines here that I will have to pay the full term of the
> contract. Nothing about returning MY phone.
>
> They have agreed to end the contract without penalty. Asking me to
> send them MY property is a penalty.

The terms of the contract are irrelevant here. What Vodafone are doing
is ignoring them (to your benefit) and allowing you to get out of your
contract without having to follow the terms of the contract. Therefore,
when considering the requirements of you getting out the contract, you
should not refer to the contract unless the contract terms are more
favourable to you.

You have 2 options:
1.) Follow the letter of the contract and pay your self out the contract
2.) Accept their offer of goodwill and follow their requirement to
return the handset.

>
>> You sound like a petulant child.
>
> Name calling. Tut tut. And I am the child?
> Not a child. Just someone with the balls to not give in to a large
> corporation that thinks it can screw its customer and get away with it
> without penalty.

How is returning your situation to that which you were in before the
start of the contract unfair?

>>> I am prepared (and already expect to have to) to take this to court if
>>> they do not relent.
>>>
>>> Thoughts?
>> You would lose.
>
> We will see!

Put it this way. Have Vodafone made an effort to understand your
situation and be accommodating? Yes - they've offered to cancel the
remaining months of your contract, in exchange for returning the
(free/subsidised) phone.

Are they forcing you to do this? No. You can continue with your
contract, or you can keep the phone and pay the normal retail price
(£410). You could, if you wanted, flog the phone on eBay and then use
that money to pay yourself out.

They're not forcing you to do anything. It's your choice. Legally,
they have every right to enforce their contract. Morally, they're doing
the 'right thing' and being fair.

Seriously, take it to court, and I think the Magistrate (or whoever gets
allocated to your hearing in the Small Claims court) would find in
favour of Vodafone as they have tried to be fair.

D