Verizon Wireless thumbs its nose at the iPhone

ed <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Rod Speed" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> Elizabot v2.0.3 <[email protected]> wrote:
>>> Randall Ainsworth wrote:
>>>> In article <[email protected]>, George
>>>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> Who in their right mind would want a crippled Verizon phone?
>>>>> Whats crippled? My phones makes and receives calls just fine and
>>>>> in a lot more places than at&t.
>>>>
>>>> Try to connect your crippled Verizon POS to your computer via
>>>> Bluetooth or a cable to transfer wallpaper and ringtones. OOPS! You
>>>> can't do it because they've disabled that functionality that the
>>>> manufacturer built in.
>>>
>>> Check out BitPim. It's a free download from sourceforge. If your
>>> phone is supported, then get a cable on ebay or somewhere. Make
>>> sure you get the right cable, as some of the phones are very
>>> similar. Proceed to transfer ringtones, phonebooks, wallpaper, etc
>>> to your phone.
>>
>>> Problem solved.
>>
>> Still completely ****ed to have to do that when it should
>> be done using the bluetooth that is there for that.
>
> bitpim works over bluetooth too- it uses the serial protocol that's
> usually still available, even if file transfer is disabled. from the
> articles about how iphone *totally* disables bluetooth other than for earpieces, it may not be
> able to take advantage of bitpim...

Yeah, that would be even more comprehensively ****ed with such an expensive phone.

---

› See More: Verizon Wireless thumbs its nose at the iPhone

Rod Speed <[email protected]> wrote:
> ed <[email protected]> wrote:
>> "Rod Speed" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>>> Elizabot v2.0.3 <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>> Randall Ainsworth wrote:
>>>>> In article <[email protected]>, George
>>>>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> Who in their right mind would want a crippled Verizon phone?
>>>>>> Whats crippled? My phones makes and receives calls just fine and
>>>>>> in a lot more places than at&t.
>>>>>
>>>>> Try to connect your crippled Verizon POS to your computer via
>>>>> Bluetooth or a cable to transfer wallpaper and ringtones. OOPS!
>>>>> You can't do it because they've disabled that functionality that
>>>>> the manufacturer built in.
>>>>
>>>> Check out BitPim. It's a free download from sourceforge. If your
>>>> phone is supported, then get a cable on ebay or somewhere. Make
>>>> sure you get the right cable, as some of the phones are very
>>>> similar. Proceed to transfer ringtones, phonebooks, wallpaper, etc
>>>> to your phone.
>>>
>>>> Problem solved.
>>>
>>> Still completely ****ed to have to do that when it should
>>> be done using the bluetooth that is there for that.
>>
>> bitpim works over bluetooth too- it uses the serial protocol that's
>> usually still available, even if file transfer is disabled. from the
>> articles about how iphone *totally* disables bluetooth other than
>> for earpieces, it may not be able to take advantage of bitpim...
>
> Yeah, that would be even more comprehensively ****ed with such an
> expensive phone.

Tho maybe its not so bad with the iphone because you can use the wifi to do that instead.

"Rod Speed" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Rod Speed <[email protected]> wrote:
>> ed <[email protected]> wrote:
<snip>
>>> bitpim works over bluetooth too- it uses the serial protocol that's
>>> usually still available, even if file transfer is disabled. from the
>>> articles about how iphone *totally* disables bluetooth other than
>>> for earpieces, it may not be able to take advantage of bitpim...
>>
>> Yeah, that would be even more comprehensively ****ed with such an
>> expensive phone.
>
> Tho maybe its not so bad with the iphone because you can use the wifi to
> do that instead.

i'm pretty sure i read you can't do that either- they're going after the
zune model there. :P

ed <[email protected]> wrote:
> "Rod Speed" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> Rod Speed <[email protected]> wrote:
>>> ed <[email protected]> wrote:
> <snip>
>>>> bitpim works over bluetooth too- it uses the serial protocol that's
>>>> usually still available, even if file transfer is disabled. from
>>>> the articles about how iphone *totally* disables bluetooth other
>>>> than for earpieces, it may not be able to take advantage of
>>>> bitpim...
>>>
>>> Yeah, that would be even more comprehensively ****ed with such an
>>> expensive phone.
>>
>> Tho maybe its not so bad with the iphone because you can use the
>> wifi to do that instead.

> i'm pretty sure i read you can't do that either-

Dont believe that, that would make the web browser useless.

> they're going after the zune model there. :P

I doubt it. Even Apple isnt likely to be THAT stupid.

Randall Ainsworth wrote:
> In article <[email protected]>, Dr zara
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> I have used ATT and Verizon for at least twenty years, concurrently. Let me
>> assure you that ATT third rate. Verizon blows it away on a daily basis.
>> FYI: The "new" ATT is not anything like the "old" ATT.
>
> More accurately phrased: Verizon blows.
> But, if you like crippled hardware so they can do open wallet surgery
> at every turn...then go for it.

Stop, back the truck up...

The only BT profile that Verizon is missing off any modern phone that
I've seen is the "Multimedia File Sharing" profile, which is mostly
WORTHLESS.

It has multiple problems:

#1 - its really slow! Its even painfully slow on BT 2.0 if you're
moving more than a handful of photos at a time, forget MP3s or movies.
Its worse with wifi or any other 2.4 ghz interference present (I've
actually caused my BT adapter to be completely unable to work by running
netstumbler - the constant flow of AP queries sent by NS (on every wifi
channel) managed to completely hose the BT connection)

#2 - its not reliable, and the failure modes vary depending on
manufacturer/model/situation/etc. Ever tried to recover lost clusters
in the internal flash on a phone that you have no direct file system
access on? Its not much fun.

#3 - its a support nightmare. Verizon doesn't want to support your
peecee (or macintrash) unless you cough up the big bucks for a data
account. Considering how stupid-and-proud-of-it most people are, I
can't blame them. Theres a reason PDA data accounts are cheaper -
theres significantly less support hassles compared to pc-card/tethered
customers.

If you want easy access to add/modify/remove files, you should get a
phone that supports a removable memory card. Its a lot more convenient
than any other option and several hundred times faster than anything
you're going to push over bluetooth. Buying good, fast flash can
improve the phone's responsiveness (especially when saving images) by
comparison to the internal flash, and you reduce the chance of 'wearing
out' the internal flash (most flash is only rated for between 100k to 1M
writes). The other nice thing about this is applications like WMP and
WinAmp will "pick up" the flash device (once its been initialized by
inserted in the cellphone at least once while its turned on) as a
multimedia device and handle the files for you. You can also copy files
'the old fashioned way' (there are separate folders on the flash for the
different types of media)

Personally I consider Verizon pretty damned open, especially when it
comes to data services. Some carriers (at least they did a few years
back) charge extra for dial-out modem (14.4k) access, and nobody else I
can find offers anything similar to the MOU 1xRTT/EVDO. That alone
saves me at least $35/mo compared to any other carrier and I never burn
up enough of my minutes (~200 minutes and ~40MB per month of 1x usage)
to care.

The minutes are the same price as the other area carriers, the text/pics
are about the same price, and I don't have to pay out the ass for small
quantities of data usage... Works out perfect for me.

I really haven't seen anything the iPhone does that the
already-been-off-the-market-6-months VX9800 can't do. The VX9800 has a
faster cellular radio and can stream things off the cell network with
ease. tethered data speeds are limited by the bt 1.2 interface and my
lack of a compatible USB data cable. Theres really only two reasons I'd
want a wifi-capable phone: The ability for the phone to operate as a
wifi AP and route between the cellular interface and wifi - this won't
happen on the iphone due to the slow EDGE cellular radio. The second
feature would be for it to be a VoIP-over-WiFi client, which doesn't
exist (yet), but does for almost every other modern smartphone out there.

Apple needs to stick to markets they understand. Cellular isn't one of
them, obviously. They're not in a position to be competitive with folks
like Samsung, LG, Motorola, Nokia, etc.

Oh well, nothing like good ol' Usenet. Full of loudmouth jackasses and
the corporate ringers that lead them around...

In article <[email protected]>,
"[email protected]" <[email protected]> wrote:

> Apple needs to stick to markets they understand. Cellular isn't one
> of them, obviously.

That would be why they sold so few in the first 24 hours of business.
Ah well, maybe Apple was lucky that the iPhone was such a dismal
failure. Imagine how embarrassing it would have been to have people
lined up around the block only to have their poor customer service
displayed for all to see.

">
> Whats crippled? My phones makes and receives calls just fine and in a lot
> more places than at&t.\

More or less about the same as far as coverge, each has their better areas,
I read people ***** about ATT's coverage, honestly never had a problem,
When I had VZW the same held true.

Why I changed is I prefer gsm for when I visit overseas, Vzw screwed me or
try to on some phones, I hate they extend your contract everytime you change
your plan. But otherwise, the do what they do very good, make calls.

OK as far as more places, your phone won't work in europe, after all you did
say more places.

>
> True. However, you'll have a hard time might hearing that bluetooth-
> transfered ringtone in a "no-service" area...
>
And can I have your documented areas where the have "no-service" areas, and
not your rhetoric. Since you don't use ATT, how would you know? Funny, my
"no-service" phone seemed to work everywhere I've been in the US, and btw,
it worked in areas like europe where VZW and Sprint phones would be needed
to go to some secure land fill because they are nothing more then
paperweights. So where is more areas? One or two here and there, and that
works both ways. I had excellent coverage with them, except in my home.

"[email protected]" <[email protected]> wrote in
news:[email protected]:

> Personally I consider Verizon pretty damned open, especially when it
> comes to data services.

Best in the business:

"DATA PLANS AND FEATURES
Data Plans and Features (such as NationalAccess, BroadbandAccess,
GlobalAccess, and certain VZEmail services that do not include a specific
monthly MB allowance or are not billed on a pay-as-you-go basis) may ONLY
be used with wireless devices for the following purposes: (i) Internet
browsing; (ii) email; and (iii) intranet access (including access to
corporate intranets, email, and individual productivity applications like
customer relationship management, sales force, and field service
automation). These Data Plans and Features MAY NOT be used for any other
purpose. Examples of prohibited uses include, without limitation, the
following: (i) continuous uploading, downloading, or streaming of audio
or video programming or games; (ii) server devices or host computer
applications, including, but not limited to, Web camera posts or
broadcasts, automatic data feeds, automated machine to-machine
connections or peer-to-peer (P2P) file-sharing; or (iii) as a substitute
or backup for private lines or dedicated data connections. This means, by
way of example only, that checking email, surfing the Internet,
downloading legally acquired songs, and/or visiting corporate intranets
is permitted, but downloading movies using P2P file-sharing services
and/or redirecting television programming content for viewing on laptops
is prohibited. A person engaged in prohibited uses continuously for one
hour could typically use 100 to 200 MB, or, if engaged in prohibited uses
for 10 hours a day, 7 days a week, could use more than 5 GB in a month.

For individual use only and not for resale. We reserve the right to
protect our network from harm, which may impact legitimate data flows. We
reserve the right to limit throughput speeds or amount of data
transferred, and to deny or terminate service, without notice, to anyone
we believe is using one of these Data Plans or Features in any manner
prohibited above or whose usage adversely impacts our network or service
levels. Anyone using more than 5 GB per line in a given month is presumed
to be using the service in a manner prohibited above, and we reserve the
right to immediately terminate the service of any such person without
notice. We also reserve the right to terminate service upon expiration of
Customer Agreement term."


Look how awful Sprint's data restrictions are:

"About Data Services & Content
###########################################################FROM HERE
Our data Services and your Device may allow you to access the internet,
text, pictures, video, games, graphics, music, email, sound and other
materials ("Data Content") or send Data Content elsewhere.
###########################################################TO HERE!

Some Data Content is available from us or our vendors, while other Data
Content can be accessed from others (third party websites, games,
ringers, etc.). We make absolutely no guarantees about the Data Content
you access on your Device. Data Content may be: (1) unsuitable for
children/minors; (2) unreliable or inaccurate; or (3) offensive, indecent
or objectionable. You're solely responsible for evaluating the Data
Content accessed by you or anyone on your account. We strongly recommend
you monitor data usage by children/minors. Data Content from third
parties may also harm your Device or its software. To protect our
network, Services, or for other reasons, we may place restrictions on
accessing certain Data Content (such as certain websites, applications,
etc.), impose separate charges, limit throughput or the amount of data
you can transfer, or otherwise limit or terminate Services. If we provide
you storage for Data Content you have purchased, we may delete the Data
Content with notice or place restrictions/limits on the use of storage
areas. You may not be able to make or receive voice calls while using
data Services.

Specific Terms & Restrictions On Using Data Services
In addition to the rules for using all of our other Services, unless we
identify the Service or Device you have selected as specifically intended
for that purpose (for example, wireless routers, Data Link, etc.), you
can’t use our data Services: (1) with server devices or host computer
applications, or other systems that drive continuous heavy traffic or
data sessions; and (2) as a substitute or backup for private lines or
frame relay connections. We reserve the right to limit or suspend any
heavy, continuous data usage that adversely impacts our network
performance or hinders access to our network. If your Services include
unlimited web or data access, you also can’t use your Device as a modem
for computers or other equipment, unless we identify the Service or
Device you have selected as specifically intended for that purpose (for
example, with "phone as modem" plans, Sprint Mobile Broadband card plans,
wireless router plans, etc.)."

What is Sprint missing?
1 - No gigabyte limit. They reserve the RIGHT to limit or suspend, but
have NO GIGABYTE LIMIT. We're testing this 24/7 for the last couple of
months, downloading from usenetserver.com (movies/mp3/documentaries,
etc.) and we're STILL CONNECTED! It's slow, but IT'S THERE! That's a
difference, right?

2 - Sprint's not just for email and webpage spam. They even WARN you you
may get video and music to your PC that may be offensive!

Verizon better just because it's faster? Bull****. Just don't blame
Sprint for the porn quality...(c;

Verizon "open"? NOT! AT&PP's restrictions look just like Verizon's.
Too bad Apple didn't pick Sprint for data. I could be listening to ICRT
on my iPhone!

Larry
--
Verizon Wireless Bankruptcy Administration
P.O. Box 3397
Bloomington, IL 61702
Phone: 800-555-8879
Fax: 309-820-7044
What's this all about??

At 01 Jul 2007 10:12:00 -0400 Michael Paris wrote:

> > True. However, you'll have a hard time might hearing that bluetooth-
> > transfered ringtone in a "no-service" area...
> >
> And can I have your documented areas where the have "no-service" areas,
> and not your rhetoric.

Sure you can have my documented areas, and I'll toss in the rhetoric for
free!

For starters, my southwestern Denver suburban neighborhood- a subdivision
of about 2000 homes, where as of two years ago when Verizon finally put
up a tower AT&T/Cingular became the ONLY carrier that DOESN'T work here.
Even Nextel works! (For years, only Sprint and T-Mo worked here!
Ironically the two services most maligned for crappy coverage.)

> Since you don't use ATT, how would you know?

I used Cingular since before there was a "Cingular" (SBMS in KC.) I was
a monthly Cingular customer for ten years, a Cingular dealer for seven of
them, and used them until I moved to Denver. I continued using them for
three more on prepaid (via three resellers, Callplus, Justalk, and Beyond
Wireless) as a TDMA/analog backup for my T-Mo GSM phone. I even have a
few GoPhones I've bought on clearance sales that Iwhip out when I need in
a pinch (i.e. selling a car and not wanting to use my home number.)

> Funny, my "no-service" phone seemed to work everywhere I've been in
> the US,

Good for you. I've had trouble with Cingular in a few National Parks
throughout the west and the Colorado ski resorts where I've had to put my
prepaid phone into manual selection mode and roam on Verizon. A network
search of my quad-band T-Mo phone comes up empty.

I get piss-poor service on Cingular in many parts of East Providence, RI,
(where I grew up and am currently visiting family) a city of 50,000. My
brother uses Verizon here as his primary business phone because, in his
words, "everyone else has shi--y coverage outside of Providence..."

I was in Washington DC earlier this month, ONLY Verizon works in the
Metro (subway.)

> and btw, it worked in areas like europe where VZW and Sprint
> phones would be needed to go to some secure land fill because they are
> nothing more then paperweights. So where is more areas?

Hey, I'm as much of a GSM snob as anyone- I'm a happy T-Mobile customer.
I LIKE Cingular as well- good phones, reasonable prices, fast data, etc.

But, UNLIKE you, apparently, just because I like or use a service, I
don't delude myself into thinking it's obviously the "best" in all
facets. For example, T-Mo has excellent voice quality, and is an
excellent value, but has slow data and relatively weak rural covrage.
Cingular has fast data, is relatively cheap, but lacks nationwide
coverage compared to Verizon, like T-Mo. I'd still take Cingular over
Verizon because of other GSM benefits (the ability to change phones on a
whim, international roaming, ability to use handsets sourced outside the
carrier, etc.) but I stick with T-Mo over AT&T due to the LARGE coverage
hole around my home.

> One or two here and there, and that works both ways.

In my experience it's more one-way! There are certainly areas where
Cingular works and Verizon doesn't, but in my travels those are far fewer
than the other way around.

> I had excellent coverage with them, except in my home.
Hmmm, so did I!

In my experience with many years of cellular usage, Verizon hands down
wins on coverage- but so what? If coverage isn't your #1 priority, (it's
not mine- cheap ubiquitous data and voice quality rank higher for me)
other services are preferable.

This is the point where the Verizonites all hop in and say "of course
coverage is the number one priority- it's a phone, blah, blah..."

Of course if they REALLY believed that, they'd drop Verizon for Iridium
or any other satellite phone because they truly work everywhere,
including the places even Verizon doesn't!

That just proves even the Verizon coverage snobs have a price/coverage
ratio tolerance - it's just different than mine!



--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

On Sun, 01 Jul 2007 06:38:05 -0500, "[email protected]"
<[email protected]> wrote:

>
>Apple needs to stick to markets they understand. Cellular isn't one of
>them, obviously. They're not in a position to be competitive with folks
>like Samsung, LG, Motorola, Nokia, etc.


NICE TRY

Pundits said Apple would have to sell 100,000 phones this weekend to
keep from being a flop, and 200,000 to be a success. Apple will blow
by 300,000 before Sunday is over. The bar has been raised ! !


Do the math 100 units times how many AT& stores, 1000 units times
how many Apple stores ??

http://www.nypost.com/seven/06242007...ard_wilner.htm

And to think, Microsoft is on Version 6 of Windows for cell phone
devices.

On Sun, 01 Jul 2007 09:03:17 -0500, Tim McNamara
<[email protected]> wrote:

>In article <[email protected]>,
> "[email protected]" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> Apple needs to stick to markets they understand. Cellular isn't one
>> of them, obviously.
>
>That would be why they sold so few in the first 24 hours of business.
>Ah well, maybe Apple was lucky that the iPhone was such a dismal
>failure. Imagine how embarrassing it would have been to have people
>lined up around the block only to have their poor customer service
>displayed for all to see.


Nice try. Most every AT&T store sold out the first day. At least half
the Apple stgores are now sold out. Apple will blow by 300,000 units
sold on Sunday.

http://www.nypost.com/seven/06242007...ard_wilner.htm

M-M wrote:
> In article <[email protected]>,
> "[email protected]" <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> The only BT profile that Verizon is missing off any modern phone that
>> I've seen is the "Multimedia File Sharing" profile, which is mostly
>> WORTHLESS.
>
> VZW won't allow you to add your own ringtones or transfer photos by BT
> and that's irritating. It's a pain to have to use the card.

SURE THEY DO, use bitpim if you insist on doing it that way. If you
still want to use bluetooth you totally missed the whole ****ing point
of my post.

>> Personally I consider Verizon pretty damned open, especially when it
>> comes to data services.
>
> I agree with you there. That's why I'm staying.

Some people want a "personal communications device", some people only
need bling-bling.

>> I really haven't seen anything the iPhone does that the
>> already-been-off-the-market-6-months VX9800 can't do.
>
> The iPhone is WAY cooler and that's the name of the game and Apple knows
> that.

"cooler" for what? They did a lot of marketing, paid a lot of people to
claim how goddamn cool it was on the internet, etc.

The ****ing thing is bigger than a Microtac. If big phones are the new
kewl thing, I guess I'll pull a brick out and start using it (at least
until Febuary...)

>> Apple needs to stick to markets they understand. Cellular isn't one of
>> them, obviously. They're not in a position to be competitive with folks
>> like Samsung, LG, Motorola, Nokia, etc.
>
> Don't underestimate Apple.

Why the **** not? THEY HAVE NEVER AT ANY POINT IN HISTORY EVER ACTUALLY
HAD ANY SIGNIFICANT PORTION OF ANY MARKET THEY ARE A PART OF.

>> Oh well, nothing like good ol' Usenet. Full of loudmouth jackasses and
>> the corporate ringers that lead them around...
>
> Quite right you are.

How much did apple pay you to blow their goat?

[email protected] wrote:
> On Sun, 01 Jul 2007 06:38:05 -0500, "[email protected]"
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> Apple needs to stick to markets they understand. Cellular isn't one of
>> them, obviously. They're not in a position to be competitive with folks
>> like Samsung, LG, Motorola, Nokia, etc.
>
>
> NICE TRY

Selling a lot of units doesn't constitute success. Success is having
those people buy the second unit.

Keep ringing, faggot.

In article <[email protected]>,
"[email protected]" <[email protected]> wrote:

> [email protected] wrote:
> > On Sun, 01 Jul 2007 06:38:05 -0500, "[email protected]"
> > <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >> Apple needs to stick to markets they understand. Cellular isn't one of
> >> them, obviously. They're not in a position to be competitive with folks
> >> like Samsung, LG, Motorola, Nokia, etc.
> >
> >
> > NICE TRY
>
> Selling a lot of units doesn't constitute success. Success is having
> those people buy the second unit.
>
Why stop there? WHy not the 25th? 100th?